PHILADELPHIA | Highrise Development Thread X

[PHLtoNYC]

Radisson Hotel Philadelphia reopens after $10 million renovation, nearly two-year Covid-19 hiatus

https://www.bizjournals.com/philadelphia...tel-phialdelphia-reopens-renovation.html

"The Radisson Hotel Philadelphia has reopened after a nearly two-year Covid-19 hiatus during which the property underwent a more than $10 million renovation. "

"The newly updated rooms at the property offer views of the city skyline or the nearby Stadium Complex and are retrofitted with amenities like flatscreen TVs with streaming services, Wi-Fi, and mini refrigerators. Suites include kitchenettes and a separate seating area for larger groups."

"As part of the remodel, the new open-concept lobby offers individual check-in pods, coffee and tea facilities, and a snack shop, according to the hotel. It also is home to the Whit Lounge, an on-site bar and restaurant serving classic American fare all day."

[Jayfar]

Originally Posted by PHLtoNYC

Radisson Hotel Philadelphia reopens after $10 million renovation, nearly two-year Covid-19 hiatus

https://www.bizjournals.com/philadelphia...tel-phialdelphia-reopens-renovation.html

"The Radisson Hotel Philadelphia has reopened after a nearly two-year Covid-19 hiatus during which the property underwent a more than $10 million renovation. "

"The newly updated rooms at the property offer views of the city skyline or the nearby Stadium Complex and are retrofitted with amenities like flatscreen TVs with streaming services, Wi-Fi, and mini refrigerators. Suites include kitchenettes and a separate seating area for larger groups."

"As part of the remodel, the new open-concept lobby offers individual check-in pods, coffee and tea facilities, and a snack shop, according to the hotel. It also is home to the Whit Lounge, an on-site bar and restaurant serving classic American fare all day."

For anyone not familiar with it, that's the hotel at 2033 Penrose Ave.

Brian Hickey did this write-up for PhillyVoice in 2019: Is this prominent South Philly fixture the worst hotel in the city?

[EastSideHBG]

Originally Posted by allovertown

But that's my point. If it's going to take years, then we can't be nashville or austin that quadroupled overnight. Somewhere around 2010 both cities were at a point where more than half the people living in each city were not residents of the city a decade or so earlier. Come on man, you know nothing like that could ever come close to happening here.

Philly is both much much bigger than either of those cities were when their explosive growth started and we're not even growing at a fraction of a fraction of the same rate.

Philly has over 1.5 million people. We added less than 80 thousand people the past ten years. What is the best case scenario for the next 10 years? 150 Thou? 200? Maybe even 300???? Even if our growth explodes exponentially from where it has been, the people who have been here, will always SIGNIFICANTLY outnumber the newcomers. And as those newcomers live in a city dominated by long time Philadelphians, our culture will rub off on them, and especially their children who grow up here.

Simply put we're already too big and our growth rate is too slow, there's no realistic scenario where philadelphians become outnumbered by newcomers. So what happened in nashville and austin is truly impossible.

Fair points but I don't agree with you on the impossible part because when you mix the right ingredients together things can shift dramatically. And check this out:

https://phillyyimby.com/2022/01/philadelphia-poised-for-record-construction-activity-in-2022.html

And Philly is now one of the least affordable cities for singles:

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/01/06/realestate/best-worst-places-to-rent-studios.html

I do understand where you are coming from with the Philadelphians piece but I just don't think that culture is going to be hanging on for the years to come like we have seen to date. It may always be there but in a much smaller fashion than we are used to.

This is uncharted territory for the area and in many ways it's exciting because what many people wanted to see is happening.

[chimpskibot]

Originally Posted by EastSideHBG

I do understand where you are coming from with the Philadelphians piece but I just don't think that culture is going to be hanging on for the years to come like we have seen to date. It may always be there but in a much smaller fashion than we are used to.

This is uncharted territory for the area and in many ways it's exciting because what many people wanted to see is happening.

Stop being a doomer! Jeez its a real mood killer. Lick your wounds and move on. In no way is Philly the most unaffordable for single renters when you can buy property in the city for less than a used car. You cant do that in any other major city in America (950K+) Period! Culture changes its part of life, thats what is beautiful about cities!

[PHLtoNYC]

Broad and Washington is… Under Construction?!?!?

https://www.ocfrealty.com/naked-philly/hawthorne/broad-and-washington-is-under-construction

[bigfish]

Would you say that the Broad and Washington project is the largest (unit count) project in modern Philadelphia history? It is definitely one that I am most excited about. 1100+ units on top of a subway station!

[chimpskibot]

Originally Posted by bigfish

Would you say that the Broad and Washington project is the largest (unit count) project in modern Philadelphia history? It is definitely one that I am most excited about. 1100+ units on top of a subway station!

Including the lot next door, Yes. However, I think Piazza Terminal in NoLibs has more units.

[EastSideHBG]

Originally Posted by chimpskibot

Stop being a doomer! Jeez its a real mood killer. Lick your wounds and move on. In no way is Philly the most unaffordable for single renters when you can buy property in the city for less than a used car. You cant do that in any other major city in America (950K+) Period! Culture changes its part of life, thats what is beautiful about cities!

Doomer? Mood killer? Lick your wounds and move on? Quite dramatic once again! And who is going to settle down in a neighborhood where the property costs less than a used car? And you mention renters but then talk about buying property?

[City Wide]

Originally Posted by bigfish

Would you say that the Broad and Washington project is the largest (unit count) project in modern Philadelphia history? It is definitely one that I am most excited about. 1100+ units on top of a subway station!

"Modern Philadelphia history" When did that start? History, yes; modern, not so sure of.

[EastSideHBG]

Originally Posted by City Wide

"Modern Philadelphia history" When did that start?

The day that Gritty was revealed to the world.

[allovertown]

Originally Posted by EastSideHBG

Fair points but I don't agree with you on the impossible part because when you mix the right ingredients together things can shift dramatically. And check this out:

https://phillyyimby.com/2022/01/philadelphia-poised-for-record-construction-activity-in-2022.html

And Philly is now one of the least affordable cities for singles:

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/01/06/realestate/best-worst-places-to-rent-studios.html

I do understand where you are coming from with the Philadelphians piece but I just don't think that culture is going to be hanging on for the years to come like we have seen to date. It may always be there but in a much smaller fashion than we are used to.

This is uncharted territory for the area and in many ways it's exciting because what many people wanted to see is happening.

It doesn't matter how unprecedented Philly's growth is. Comparisons to Austin and Nashville are just completely off base. Philly is not going to come close doubling it's population in a couple of decades, much less quadrupling it.

It's possible for Philadelphia to grow at a rate far beyond anything we've seen in recent history, and for that growth rate to still not even come remotely close to what happened in Nashville and Austin. You have to understand how extreme of an outlier these cities population explosions were. Nothing even approaching that will ever happen in Philadelphia.

A more apt comparison would be a city like Boston. In 2000 Boston had nearly 600,000 people, 20 years later they're approaching 700,000 people. They added nearly 100 thousand people in two decades, or about 15% growth. Comparable growth over the next two decades for Philly would be a growth of roughly 250 thousand people, which would bring up population to around 1,850,000 people. To be clear, adding 250,000 people over the next two decades is still WELL ABOVE the best estimates that currently exist. But even if we consider this type of growth that is beyond what most would expect, we're still looking at a Boston like population explosion which doesn't really reassemble Nashville and Austin. People certainly accuse Boston of catering more to the wealthy and losing a certain edge, but would anyone say that Boston isn't Boston anymore? That their unique culture has disappeared? Come on. Your fears of Philadelphia losing its unique culture is just completely unfounded.

We are in uncharted territory, but we're nowhere even remotely near the growth rate that would do the things you're fearful of.

[3rd&Brown]

Originally Posted by allovertown

A more apt comparison would be a city like Boston. In 2000 Boston had nearly 600,000 people, 20 years later they're approaching 700,000 people. They added nearly 100 thousand people in two decades, or about 15% growth. Comparable growth over the next two decades for Philly would be a growth of roughly 250 thousand people, which would bring up population to around 1,850,000 people. To be clear, adding 250,000 people over the next two decades is still WELL ABOVE the best estimates that currently exist. But even if we consider this type of growth that is beyond what most would expect, we're still looking at a Boston like population explosion which doesn't really reassemble Nashville and Austin. People certainly accuse Boston of catering more to the wealthy and losing a certain edge, but would anyone say that Boston isn't Boston anymore? That their unique culture has disappeared? Come on. Your fears of Philadelphia losing its unique culture is just completely unfounded.

We are in uncharted territory, but we're nowhere even remotely near the growth rate that would do the things you're fearful of.

I was thinking the best comparison might be Boston. It's posting strong growth numbers but sorta flying under the radar because it's not that big to begin with and everyone on the East Coast (that grew) was sorta blown out of the water by NYC, not because it grew (we all knew it was growing), but because the Census Bureau was so spectacularly wrong in its estimates prior to the official count.

I have not been to Boston in about a decade, so I'd be curious to see how it has filled in. It contends with space limitations in a way we don't (smaller and hemmed in by water on basically 2 sides) and it is a somewhat low rise city to begin with. From what I've read, much of Fort Point has filled in (it used to be completely barren) and I'd have to assume there is a lot of midrise multi-family development stretching out into the neighborhoods like Dorchester, Roxbury, and Roslindale. I would have to think that it feels more vibrant outside of the usual suspects (Back Bay, South End, Cambridge, Faneuil Hall, North End, etc).

[EastSideHBG]

Originally Posted by allovertown

It doesn't matter how unprecedented Philly's growth is. Comparisons to Austin and Nashville are just completely off base. Philly is not going to come close doubling it's population in a couple of decades, much less quadrupling it.

It's possible for Philadelphia to grow at a rate far beyond anything we've seen in recent history, and for that growth rate to still not even come remotely close to what happened in Nashville and Austin. You have to understand how extreme of an outlier these cities population explosions were. Nothing even approaching that will ever happen in Philadelphia.

A more apt comparison would be a city like Boston. In 2000 Boston had nearly 600,000 people, 20 years later they're approaching 700,000 people. They added nearly 100 thousand people in two decades, or about 15% growth. Comparable growth over the next two decades for Philly would be a growth of roughly 250 thousand people, which would bring up population to around 1,850,000 people. To be clear, adding 250,000 people over the next two decades is still WELL ABOVE the best estimates that currently exist. But even if we consider this type of growth that is beyond what most would expect, we're still looking at a Boston like population explosion which doesn't really reassemble Nashville and Austin. People certainly accuse Boston of catering more to the wealthy and losing a certain edge, but would anyone say that Boston isn't Boston anymore? That their unique culture has disappeared? Come on. Your fears of Philadelphia losing its unique culture is just completely unfounded.

Yes, many long-time residents do feel that Boston isn't what it was anymore. Same with DC. Same with... But the big difference here is that a large part of Philly culture is being affordable and rough around the edges, generations hanging around, not many newcomers. If that keeps shifting...

We are in uncharted territory, but we're nowhere even remotely near the growth rate that would do the things you're fearful of.

My point was to compare cities that had their own unique cultures that were affordable and then the right recipe caused a change.

Good discussion! I will follow up on this in 5-10 years and see where we are at then

[PHLtoNYC]

Sort of on topic, but a mini rant.

I just finished the new Kevin Hart show on Netflix "True Story". It was actually good, a murder/suspense type, and Philadelphia served as a solid setting. It wasn't made out to be some sort of miserable place like in Mare of Easttown (even though I loved that show). https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QP1PAEaszVM

Anyways, my annoyance... Most of the skyline shots and videos were from 10 years ago. Comcast 2, FMC, EVO, etc. were missing in almost every shot, and not even under construction. EVO completed in 2014. Also ironic that he was staying in the Philadelphia Four Seasons (different building in the show), yet the real building didn't exist in the skyline shots.

Does this happen in other cities (Chicago, Boston, Dallas, etc.)? I don't watch enough shows to know. I'm almost certain new shows in New York would not feature a 2010 Manhattan skyline.

Either way, good to see shows in set in Philadelphia, though True Story was only partially filmed in the city.

[Mikieman]

Funny about True Story, I noticed the same thing, the best was one of the shots where the skyline was CGI'd in at the wrong angle, I could figure it out to save my life then I realized what was happening.

[Radio5]

Originally Posted by PHLtoNYC

Sort of on topic, but a mini rant.

I just finished the new Kevin Hart show on Netflix "True Story". It was actually good, a murder/suspense type, and Philadelphia served as a solid setting. It wasn't made out to be some sort of miserable place like in Mare of Easttown (even though I loved that show). https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QP1PAEaszVM

Anyways, my annoyance... Most of the skyline shots and videos were from 10 years ago. Comcast 2, FMC, EVO, etc. were missing in almost every shot, and not even under construction. EVO completed in 2014. Also ironic that he was staying in the Philadelphia Four Seasons (different building in the show), yet the real building didn't exist in the skyline shots.

Does this happen in other cities (Chicago, Boston, Dallas, etc.)? I don't watch enough shows to know. I'm almost certain new shows in New York would not feature a 2010 Manhattan skyline.

Either way, good to see shows in set in Philadelphia, though True Story was only partially filmed in the city.

It definitely happens for most city shots. Even LA. There are tons of new buildings in downtown LA, but you never see them in the city shots. Cost more money when they can just use an already filmed shot for pennies on the dollar and nobody but people like us would notice. But, yes, still annoying. I also would imagine, new buildings might take away attention, where as everyone is used to these stock city clips.

[iheartphilly]

^
Even commercials or other live tv events I have seen broadcasted, they use old stock video of the city. It's just pure laziness on not researching what the current skyline looks like in major cities with the amount of videos swirling around the internet. They could also ask for permission to use any of the great drone footage from IG or whatever, of these cities. And, it's kind of funny when you see your city with throwback video footage like oh, where have these folks been to know that footage was capture in the late 90 or early 2000s.

[therealdawk]

Originally Posted by PHLtoNYC

Sort of on topic, but a mini rant.

I just finished the new Kevin Hart show on Netflix "True Story". It was actually good, a murder/suspense type, and Philadelphia served as a solid setting. It wasn't made out to be some sort of miserable place like in Mare of Easttown (even though I loved that show). https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QP1PAEaszVM

Anyways, my annoyance... Most of the skyline shots and videos were from 10 years ago. Comcast 2, FMC, EVO, etc. were missing in almost every shot, and not even under construction. EVO completed in 2014. Also ironic that he was staying in the Philadelphia Four Seasons (different building in the show), yet the real building didn't exist in the skyline shots.

Does this happen in other cities (Chicago, Boston, Dallas, etc.)? I don't watch enough shows to know. I'm almost certain new shows in New York would not feature a 2010 Manhattan skyline.

Either way, good to see shows in set in Philadelphia, though True Story was only partially filmed in the city.

This is funny. I'm the nerd in the crowd who when watching a national game on TV for the Sixers or Eagles will scream out to the others around me when they're using a stock video of the skyline as they come back from commercial break or whatever. It annoys the heck out of me.

[reparcsyks]

Originally Posted by PHLtoNYC

Sort of on topic, but a mini rant.

I just finished the new Kevin Hart show on Netflix "True Story". It was actually good, a murder/suspense type, and Philadelphia served as a solid setting. It wasn't made out to be some sort of miserable place like in Mare of Easttown (even though I loved that show). https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QP1PAEaszVM

Anyways, my annoyance... Most of the skyline shots and videos were from 10 years ago. Comcast 2, FMC, EVO, etc. were missing in almost every shot, and not even under construction. EVO completed in 2014. Also ironic that he was staying in the Philadelphia Four Seasons (different building in the show), yet the real building didn't exist in the skyline shots.

Does this happen in other cities (Chicago, Boston, Dallas, etc.)? I don't watch enough shows to know. I'm almost certain new shows in New York would not feature a 2010 Manhattan skyline.

Either way, good to see shows in set in Philadelphia, though True Story was only partially filmed in the city.

I bet none of it was filmed in Philly. Any Philly footage was, as you saw, stock. Funniest moment for me was when he was on “Spring Garden Street” and the next block was “Spruce Street.”

[PHLtoNYC]

Originally Posted by Mikieman

Funny about True Story, I noticed the same thing, the best was one of the shots where the skyline was CGI'd in at the wrong angle, I could figure it out to save my life then I realized what was happening.

I noticed that too! And there were several scenes in the hotel and the skyline outside the window was clearly Downtown LA. I spent more time studying the skyline shots than focusing on the actual show, lol.

Originally Posted by Radio5

It definitely happens for most city shots. Even LA. There are tons of new buildings in downtown LA, but you never see them in the city shots. Cost more money when they can just use an already filmed shot for pennies on the dollar and nobody but people like us would notice. But, yes, still annoying. I also would imagine, new buildings might take away attention, where as everyone is used to these stock city clips.

At least it's uniform laziness. I still fear that this laziness happens for in Philadelphia. (No fault of the city).

Originally Posted by iheartphilly

^
Even commercials or other live tv events I have seen broadcasted, they use old stock video of the city. It's just pure laziness on not researching what the current skyline looks like in major cities with the amount of videos swirling around the internet. They could also ask for permission to use any of the great drone footage from IG or whatever, of these cities. And, it's kind of funny when you see your city with throwback video footage like oh, where have these folks been to know that footage was capture in the late 90 or early 2000s.

Yea IG has some of the most beautiful and up to date skyline vistas, drone videos, glamour shots, etc. It can't cost much for Producers to have an intern spend a day researching Philadelphia (or any city) skyline videos for a new show and then request permission from the user and pay a small fee. I guess it really is laziness or lack of astuteness when researching.

Originally Posted by therealdawk

This is funny. I'm the nerd in the crowd who when watching a national game on TV for the Sixers or Eagles will scream out to the others around me when they're using a stock video of the skyline as they come back from commercial break or whatever. It annoys the heck out of me.

Same! whenever there is a Philly show or big event and shots from around the city or area are shown on TV, I feel the need to prepare a disclaimer for my friends about where that shot is, if it's up to date, share details about new buildings planned in Philadelphia, and then I wind up on a tangent about all the development and changes in the city, lol.

Originally Posted by reparcsyks

I bet none of it was filmed in Philly. Any Philly footage was, as you saw, stock. Funniest moment for me was when he was on “Spring Garden Street” and the next block was “Spruce Street.”

Per sources I read, it was filmed mostly in LA with certain scenes filmed in Philadelphia and Pittsburgh. Did the PA film tax credits expire? Seems like some recent shows and movies take place in Philadelphia, but filmed elsewhere?
And yea fake locations is nothing new. I think it was the movie Baby Mama, and they were rushing to Penn Hospital for the birth and went over one of the bridges into New Jersey, I was like, uhh... But I see the same thing in New York. For example — and the City always messed locations up, but most people don't realize.