DENVER | Main Development Thread #7

[gopokes21]

Why are you all insulting each other over a badly executed light rail network? It's all the same if it's at-grade and stuck in traffic... with our only options consisting of value-engineered street-running LRT or BRT, what even gives?

As for further expansion of freeways, how about HELL NO until Polis makes funds available for subway in Denver. Then we can talk about more shiny new 🞵🞵🞵🞵 for the burbs. I'm tired of Denver getting screwed over and over and over by the State and Region. It seems like we only get something nice if the burbs want it, or need it to be centrally located in Denver, otherwise we get no State support and the City squanders the entire city budget on political hobnobbing. We spend billions each year with very little to show for it besides money funneled to special interests. The reality about infrastructure discussions here is that choo choo, freeway, or subway would all happen if only it was good for special interests connected to Hick Polis and Hancock.

The region's core city is neglected at the end of the day. It could grow into a world-class city, but won't for lack of long-term vision and strategic investment. We're just content to be a divided, angry city of WFH techies and their underpaid uber drivers. What kind of community is that?

[Arapahoe]

look at Colorado Springs putting on its big boy pants..



As reported by The Gazette: A 25-story residential tower that would be the tallest building in Colorado Springs history would be constructed downtown along with an 11-story office structure as part of a proposed $270.1 million mixed-use project that would dramatically change the city's skyline.

https://gazette.com/premium/25-story-tow...e1d66d2-35ab-11ec-9ccb-0bab26c8e247.html

[SirLucasTheGreat]

Interesting about the Springs. Surprised that they haven't had many improvements to their skyline with their recent growth

[Sam Hill]

Originally Posted by Ndj

Alternative forms of transit will never overtake SOVs if we continue to pour massive amounts of resources into making driving in SOVs the most convenient form of transportation. It's as simple as that.

There is no "in the meantime" with this. You reap what you sow when it comes to how cities are built. Expanding highway capacity will result in more development that relies on driving. This comes at the expensive of viability for other methods of transportation.

For most of this metropolis, alternative forms of transportation will never overtake cars, period. It’s literally impossible to replace our sprawling suburbs with the dense neighborhoods that would be required to make public transportation even remotely more practical or appealing than SOVs. Limiting the capacity of our freeways in the hopes it will eventually force people living in sprawl to use public transportation is not smart.

The sprawl already exists. And it’s politically impossible to change it from sprawl into anything other than sprawl. In terms of ecology, I’m afraid electric cars are our best hope.

When it comes to alternative forms of transportation overtaking SOVs, let’s focus on urban areas where it’s actually viable. Our recourses are limited and they’re not being used wisely when they’re wasted on a sprawl-serving system of park-n-rides and freeway-hugging light rail lines, while the urban areas in which transit is actually viable are left with inadequate, inconvenient public transportation, and our suburbs are left with inadequate, clogged freeways.

[Curtis Park]

Yes, please!

Denverite:Here’s why one developer says he quit building multifamily market rate apartments in favor of million-dollar houses

"His fixes: make it easier to build more multi-family housing, increase density, do away with single-family zoning statewide and strip back the regulations that add costs for developers."

[COtoOC]

Originally Posted by Arapahoe

look at Colorado Springs putting on its big boy pants..



As reported by The Gazette: A 25-story residential tower that would be the tallest building in Colorado Springs history would be constructed downtown along with an 11-story office structure as part of a proposed $270.1 million mixed-use project that would dramatically change the city's skyline.

https://gazette.com/premium/25-story-tow...e1d66d2-35ab-11ec-9ccb-0bab26c8e247.html

Wow! That skyline hasn't changed in my lifetime! Well, maybe a building in the '80s. Downtown CS always seemed like a missed opportunity to me. Great to see something finally planned.

[RyanD]

Sorry if I'm late to the convo about the R-Line. Bunt_q and I rode it when it opened and it was the most frustrating train I've, honestly, ever been on. Sitting and waiting for light cycles with zero train priority is really the downfall of this line. I did a write up quite a while ago if you're interested:


https://denverurbanism.com/2017/03/come-take-a-ride-on-rtds-brand-new-r-line.html

[wong21fr]

Originally Posted by Arapahoe

As reported by The Gazette: A 25-story residential tower that would be the tallest building in Colorado Springs history would be constructed downtown along with an 11-story office structure as part of a proposed $270.1 million mixed-use project that would dramatically change the city's skyline.

Nice find. Hopefully COS' skyline starts to flesh out a bit more as indicative of the city's size. Considering the dearth of construction there in the last few decades, which thankfully is no longer the case, the city has a lot of potential to capitalize on the urban center.


In other news, there's now two multi-story apartment complexes u/c in Central Park along Central Park Blvd: The previously mentioned Trammel Crowe 300-unit near the station and now ReyLenn's ~300-unit project has broken ground. There's still another 3000-4000 units in the planning/development stage scattered through the neighborhood as well so everyone's favorite yuppies with kids paradise keeps on growing.

[TakeFive]

Largely unmolested, hardly gentrified and mostly unbothered; Let's keep it that way

Happy to help you out

Originally Posted by wong21fr

If I want to have a lesson about what it looked like 25 years ago, I'll be sure to reach out to you.

From what I can gather not much has changed in 25 years (when I discovered this gem) for what I'd describe as the "Richest in Culture" neighborhood and stretch of road in all of Denver. Let's hope that over the next 25 years we can still say: "not much has changed."

If you have extra time it may be worth the effort to take a drive, stop along the way and taste the local cuisine or maybe find some Knick knacks for decorating your place of gentrification.

Let me also pay props to Denverite along the way.

Originally Posted by RyanD

Oof... Moving to a West Alameda address soon. Thank goodness I'm not quite in Limon.

West Alameda is one of the more interesting streets in Denver.

Starting at So Broadway which is mere blocks from Wash Park it has nice access to light rail, all the way out past Casa Bonita and Belmar.

Moving to the other side of the Platte, Federal Blvd and West Alameda is ground zero for some great ethnic, especially Asian choices for food. Back in January 2017 Ashley Dean/Denverite did a nice writeup of restaurants in the area entitled "The best Denver restaurants on Federal Boulevard, according to locals."

Heading west there's any number of interesting things along Alameda and it's also where one can turn left onto Morrison Road.

Some of the best writing ever on Denverite was the recent series of pieces about Morrison Road: "Street Week: Morrison Road."

In the face of massive change in Denver, Morrison Road might have a secret weapon: Its art and feel
Sep. 29, 2021 By Maggie Donahue/Denverite

“If you see art in the public that is representative of your history, or representative of your children or your community, then you feel a stronger tie to the area. And potentially, that is enough strength there that helps you fight to stay.”

JWLC Mendoza's mural on the side of Morrison Road's Re:Vision co-op building. Sept. 22, 2021. Kevin J. Beaty/Denverite

There are those places where you can say "not much has changed" over 25 years and it's a very good thing.

[TakeFive]

"Building affordable housing is too risky, too slow and too mired in bureaucracy, he said."

Not difficult to agree with that.

Originally Posted by Curtis Park

Yes, please!

Denverite:Here’s why one developer says he quit building multifamily market rate apartments in favor of million-dollar houses

"His fixes: make it easier to build more multi-family housing, increase density, do away with single-family zoning statewide and strip back the regulations that add costs for developers."

Except for the no single-family zoning I'm happy to agree. Most of the problems are the result of NIMBY and/or liberal 🞵🞵🞵🞵. Interestingly, Jon Roberts actually points out the benefits of single-family zoning and review.

What frustrates him?

“With the passage of the voter-led Green Buildings Ordinance in 2017, new multifamily and new commercial buildings must also reduce their environmental impact by installing a cool roof and taking additional steps to benefit our neighborhoods, including offering green space or a green roof, significantly reducing energy usage or using renewable energy, or achieving a national green building certification,” she adds.

It's not that I'm averse to the goals here; but why not employ incentives like a tax rebate for including such benefits. Why penalize the builder? If it's for the common good then let all taxpayers 'chip in' by providing incentives rather than time consuming penalties to the builder.

On the surface it all sounds reasonable.

“New multifamily buildings are reviewed to ensure they meet building and energy codes as well as for traffic impact mitigation, parking, storm water drainage, sanitary sewer capacity, emergency services access, sidewalks, tree protection, and view planes, among other site-specific factors.

It appears that much of the problem was timing. There were times when the city’s permitting process was totally backed upped. Apparently things are much better now.

These days, permitting for residential homes and commercial projects should take around four weeks, though new homes are currently taking six weeks, according to the Community Planning and Development website... In September, 82 percent of commercial reviews were being completed on time,

Ofc politics gets messy, strange bedfellows and all that. As The Dirt knows well many NYMBY's are liberals.

While doing away with "single-family zoning" is a builder preferred change popular with many liberals none of his delays had anything to do with that. Land costs are generally the biggest impediment to building more affordable homes.

[kemachs]

Originally Posted by TakeFive

Some of the best writing ever on Denverite was the recent series of pieces about Morrison Road: "Street Week: Morrison Road."

In the face of massive change in Denver, Morrison Road might have a secret weapon: Its art and feel
Sep. 29, 2021 By Maggie Donahue/Denverite



JWLC Mendoza's mural on the side of Morrison Road's Re:Vision co-op building. Sept. 22, 2021. Kevin J. Beaty/Denverite

There are those places where you can say "not much has changed" over 25 years and it's a very good thing.

I love Westwood - it's like a little slice of New Mexico here in Denver - but I can't help but wonder if the massive white-washing that's taken place in Sunnyside (and the rest of the Northside) is heading straight for that neighborhood as well. I'm a fan of Denverite and their reporting, but usually articles like this signal the transformative wave of gentrification, as investors start to gravitate - i.e. remember when River North actually had a nice mix of establishments, and wasn't just an extension of the Bro Corridor? Tennyson too - south of 44th, it has filled in/developed the way a lot of us urbanists would like to see, but you can't deny the old feel/authenticity of Berkeley has been disappearing in the process.

It looks like the community is taking steps to preserve the cultural identity of Morrison Rd. and I hope they are successful - I'm just cynical after seeing so many places try and fail to do that. Neighborhoods with a unique/vibrant culture attract artists/galleries first, then people with $$$ follow, and then housing values...well, you know the pattern. Don't really know if there's a way to prevent the full cycle from happening, especially in 'it' cities like Denver or Austin, but I'm very interested in urban planning theories on how to do so. That feels like the next frontier of place-making / retaining sense of place, now that promoting the three prongs of density/walkability/mixed-use alone has proven to be lacking (in a cultural sense).

[SirLucasTheGreat]

Is the Flora under construction at 3500 Chestnut? I can't get too good of a view from the car but it looks like the foundation might already be excavated.

[RyanD]

Originally Posted by SirLucasTheGreat

Is the Flora under construction at 3500 Chestnut? I can't get too good of a view from the car but it looks like the foundation might already be excavated.

Sure is!






https://denverinfill.com/2021/11/flora-breaks-ground.html

[SirLucasTheGreat]

Thanks, Ryan! I am excited for this one. Probably the best location in RiNo where you are right beside RiNo Art Park, RiNo promenade, Number thirty eight, the Platte River, the Source, multiple breweries, and a short walk to the the 38th and Blake station.

[Robert.hampton]

It sure feels like we have arrived in a post land-barge and texas-donut era with new development in Denver. Seems the vast majority of recently proposed projects are higher quality and have a certain level of interest and individualism that we didn't see much of for a good 5 years. Is this an evolution unique for Denver or something we are seeing all over?

[SirLucasTheGreat]

Yeah. If One River North, that big Aspen tree looking hotel near Civic Center Park, and Evolve Towers end up being built anything like the renderings, that will be impressive

[Agent Orange]

Originally Posted by Robert.hampton

It sure feels like we have arrived in a post land-barge and texas-donut era with new development in Denver. Seems the vast majority of recently proposed projects are higher quality and have a certain level of interest and individualism that we didn't see much of for a good 5 years. Is this an evolution unique for Denver or something we are seeing all over?

That is true, in the city center at least. I'm assuming the higher prices this market commands now have something to do with that. An exception being recent projects in St*pleton/Central Park that Wong recently highlighted. Those appear to be disappointingly Texas donut-like. I had higher hopes for the Central Park A-line station area. New housing of any sort is preferable to empty lots and long term RV parking.

Continuing the former-airport-neighborhood conversation - I think someone in this thread pointed out a few months ago that the 29th and Quebec "town center" area is actually pretty nicely designed area that is aging well. I have to agree. I think the trees and the relatively narrow streets have something to do with it. I wish it could serve as a model of how to build neighborhood retail and multifamily in other parts of suburbanish Denver, but nearly everything else in 80238 that followed it is much less inspired.

[jbssfelix]

The donuts are one thing...what really is a headscratcher to me is the onslaught of large national chain food and retail offerings that are in queue or recently built.

New: Taco Bell, Panda, Murphy Express, Enterprise Car Rental, etc
In Queue: In-n-Out, Quiktrip, Raising Cane's, Popeyes, Chili's

Is it the cost of land that's driving out smaller local players, or something I'm just not seeing altogether? I feel like with the half-decent density and high household income, it would drive more options into the neighborhood...

Originally Posted by Agent Orange

That is true, in the city center at least. I'm assuming the higher prices this market commands now have something to do with that. An exception being recent projects in St*pleton/Central Park that Wong recently highlighted. Those appear to be disappointingly Texas donut-like. I had higher hopes for the Central Park A-line station area. New housing of any sort is preferable to empty lots and long term RV parking.

Continuing the former-airport-neighborhood conversation - I think someone in this thread pointed out a few months ago that the 29th and Quebec "town center" area is actually pretty nicely designed area that is aging well. I have to agree. I think the trees and the relatively narrow streets have something to do with it. I wish it could serve as a model of how to build neighborhood retail and multifamily in other parts of suburbanish Denver, but nearly everything else in 80238 that followed it is much less inspired.

[wong21fr]

Originally Posted by jbssfelix

The donuts are one thing...what really is a headscratcher to me is the onslaught of large national chain food and retail offerings that are in queue or recently built.

New: Taco Bell, Panda, Murphy Express, Enterprise Car Rental, etc
In Queue: In-n-Out, Quiktrip, Raising Cane's, Popeyes, Chili's

Is it the cost of land that's driving out smaller local players, or something I'm just not seeing altogether? I feel like with the half-decent density and high household income, it would drive more options into the neighborhood...

The property taxes/land costs are definitely a contributor to what's going in and the focus on national retailers who are more in a first to market role. It's also that the current retail development is centered around the CBP interchange and it's been marketed not just for the neighborhood population but the traffic counts off of I70 and the pads are being sold as single-use development with no multi-tenant space. It incentivizes the larger players and you don't see those smaller spots that a local business needs. Look at the retail strips that have been put in north of I70: a bike shop, a boutique, a barber, a nail salon, three local food places, a few national chains, and the inexplicable bevy of dentists. It's not perfect, but it's reflective of the kind of spaces that are needed to foster small businesses that aren't currently being built.

I'm going to run with the mantra that it takes time for businesses to flip over and to respond as the area reaches buildout. A few more multi-tenant space would also help. That said, I'm hoping that the rumor of a Trader Joe's just north of I70 at CPB comes to fruition. Put that in and my quasi-suburban 🞵🞵🞵 is happy.

[bunt_q]

“Quasi” suburban? Lol.