CHICAGO | General Discussions - Page 156

ardecila · #**3101** Posted **Oct 3, 2021, 7:32 PM**

What was the last time one of the Big Four sports leagues added an expansion team in a market that already had a team? I would guess the Islanders (1972)? The Rams and Chargers both moved to LA at essentially the same time, and the loyalty of LA fans to faraway teams was always sorta weak, so that's sort of a different situation...

I just don't see a lot of appetite to put a 2nd team in metro Chicago when the (real or perceived) loyalty to the Bears is so strong and the population growth of metro Chicago is essentially stagnant. Smaller but growing media markets are gonna be more attractive possibilities for expansion. I still can't believe Austin/San Antonio don't have a team, given Texas' rabid love of football. Oklahoma City and Portland also seem ripe.

I've heard the talk about London or Mexico City expansions but that's just idle talk IMO, sure the crowds in those cities will fill a stadium for an exhibition game because it's a novelty and because football is fun to watch, but actually supporting a whole season and delivering both ticket sales and the media revenues that an NFL franchise demands?

bnk · #**3102** Posted **Oct 3, 2021, 10:28 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by ardecila

What was the last time one of the Big Four sports leagues added an expansion team in a market that already had a team? I would guess the Islanders (1972)? The Rams and Chargers both moved to LA at essentially the same time, and the loyalty of LA fans to faraway teams was always sorta weak, so that's sort of a different situation...

I justdon't see a lot of appetite to put a 2nd team in metro Chicago when the (real or perceived) loyalty to the Bears is so strong and the population growth of metro Chicago is essentially stagnant. Smaller but growing media markets are gonna be more attractive possibilities for expansion. I still can't believe Austin/San Antonio don't have a team, given Texas' rabid love of football. Oklahoma City and Portland also seem ripe.

I've heard the talk about London or Mexico City expansions but that's just idle talk IMO, sure the crowds in those cities will fill a stadium for an exhibition game because it's a novelty and because football is fun to watch, but actually supporting a whole season and delivering both ticket sales and the media revenues that an NFL franchise demands?

I doubt there would be no problem meeting the need and fill the coffers. Its still the 3rd largest metro and 3rd largest TV ratings.

But It will not happen.

The Bears would claw tooth and nail to stop it

The NFL would support the Bears.

So yes it would be nice to have the Chicago Cardinals back. Its not going to happen for just a few reasons i mentioned.

moorhosj1 · #**3103** Posted **Oct 4, 2021, 1:59 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by bnk

The Bears would claw tooth and nail to stop it

The NFL would support the Bears.

I think the Bears would have veto authority if another team tried to enter its (very large) media space.

That said, the Oklahoma City metro area has 1.5 million people and Chicagoland has 9.5. Half of Chicago would bring the NFL more money than having all of OKC. They only have a basketball team because of Hurricane Katrina.

jpIllInoIs · #**3104** Posted **Oct 4, 2021, 5:33 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by moorhosj1

I think the Bears would have veto authority if another team tried to enter its (very large) media space.

That said, the Oklahoma City metro area has 1.5 million people and Chicagoland has 9.5. Half of Chicago would bring the NFL more money than having all of OKC. They only have a basketball team because of Hurricane Katrina.

OKC is the smallest NBA market and is threadbare with the attendance plummeting after departure of big 3. And its a college town so nfl is a conflict.

Next NFL city candidates include San Antonio, StL, Toronto, San Diego, Sacramento. If FLA can handle 3 teams Cali can handle 3 or 4.

No One is moving into Soldier Field with the existing conditions. They would be starting out with a serious handicap.

left of center · #**3105** Posted **Oct 4, 2021, 6:02 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by jpIllInoIs

No One is moving into Soldier Field with the existing conditions. They would be starting out with a serious handicap.

A stadium that is ready to go beats having to fork over hundreds of millions to build a new one, even with public funding helping out. That said its a non argument anyway, since the Bears would immediately veto any Chicago expansion team as has been mentioned many times.

thegoatman · #**3106** Posted **Oct 12, 2021, 4:42 AM**

That mcdonalds is a absolutely massive waste of space. No reason a suburban, drive thru fast food spot should be in a prime real estate spot like that.

One Chicago looks great tho.

intrepidDesign · #**3107** Posted **Oct 12, 2021, 4:00 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by thegoatman

That mcdonalds is a absolutely massive waste of space. No reason a suburban, drive thru fast food spot should be in a prime real estate spot like that.

One Chicago looks great tho.

I agree the parking lot could go, but I dont mind that McDonalds honestly. I don't fast food but it does have some redeeming qualities, and it certainly doesn't look like a suburban McDonalds, and even those have changes quite a bit in recent years. I love high rises, build them taller, all day, but there are other buildings in that area that are far more offensive looking/a waste of space, for instance that post office on Ohio. That should go long before McDs.

pianowizard · #**3108** Posted **Oct 12, 2021, 4:06 PM**

One thing I love about downtown Chicago is that it's dense but not too dense, giving a relaxing vibe. It's good to have low-rises scattered around town IMO.

marothisu · #**3109** Posted **Oct 12, 2021, 7:20 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by pianowizard

One thing I love about downtown Chicago is that it's dense but not too dense, giving a relaxing vibe. It's good to have low-rises scattered around town IMO.

Funny. We moved back from NYC not long ago - my wife has never actually lived in Chicago but visited many times before. Since she wasn't living here she wasn't really paying as much attention to the urban makeup here. She commented a few days ago how she finds downtown Chicago feels "taller" than most of Manhattan because Manhattan (outside of a few areas) has a lot of 15-20 story buildings mixed in with 5-10 story buildings and the actual tall buildings are mixed in. In Chicago though in some areas she was commenting how everything is 30+ stories and wondering where the "low rise areas are" LOL. You have areas like East and West Village which is mostly low rise and mid rise with a few high rises here and there.

I know what you mean but figured I'd mention it as I found her comments interesting.

I think what makes downtown feel more relaxed than Manhattan for example is the size of the storefronts and the sidewalk widths. In Chicago you'll have 1 restaurant which the same physical size in Manhattan would have literally 7+ stores in.

Steely Dan · #**3110** Posted **Oct 12, 2021, 7:28 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by pianowizard

One thing I love about downtown Chicago is that it's dense but not too dense, giving a relaxing vibe. It's good to have low-rises scattered around town IMO.

scattered low-rises are one thing, but a suburban-model stand-alone drive-thru fast-food restaurant w/ a parking lot like the RN McD's has no place in any downtown area anywhere.

TR Devlin · #**3111** Posted **Oct 12, 2021, 8:16 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by pianowizard

One thing I love about downtown Chicago is that it's dense but not too dense, giving a relaxing vibe. It's good to have low-rises scattered around town IMO.

the urban politician · #**3112** Posted **Oct 16, 2021, 3:54 PM**

I’m in a family wedding in Northern Cali and met a lady here who went to a convention in Chicago recently. She told me she loved it and that the city felt so vibrant. She said that it felt like how San Francisco “used to feel”, but now since Covid all of the tech bros basically either left SF or started working from home; to her, SF feels so “dead” now.

She said that she hung out in the Fulton Market district. I also found it noteworthy that an out of towner is going there to hang out instead of the usual places of years past (Michigan Ave, River North, etc). Of course she is just one person but it was interesting to hear her perspective

rlw777 · #**3113** Posted **Oct 16, 2021, 9:13 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by the urban politician

I’m in a family wedding in Northern Cali and met a lady here who went to a convention in Chicago recently. She told me she loved it and that the city felt so vibrant. She said that it felt like how San Francisco “used to feel”, but now since Covid all of the tech bros basically either left SF or started working from home; to her, SF feels so “dead” now.

She said that she hung out in the Fulton Market district. I also found it noteworthy that an out of towner is going there to hang out instead of the usual places of years past (Michigan Ave, River North, etc). Of course she is just one person but it was interesting to hear her perspective

I've been pretty surprise with how many visitors have asked me about going to Fulton Market / Randolph St. / the West Loop. I usually just suggest they get food or drinks there. I think the west loop needs some cultural landmarks or institutions to really get visitors to stick around there.

the urban politician · #**3114** Posted **Oct 16, 2021, 9:20 PM**

^ A theatre or museum would sure be nice.

Realistically, though, something more than just restaurants and bars would be nice

SIGSEGV · #**3115** Posted **Oct 16, 2021, 9:44 PM**

PSA: go to 110 N Wacker for OHC. 360 views from the 55th floor.

the urban politician · #**3116** Posted **Oct 16, 2021, 9:50 PM**

^ Huh?

Klippenstein · #**3117** Posted **Oct 16, 2021, 11:10 PM**

Are you overlooking WNDR Museum on purpose?

SIGSEGV · #**3118** Posted **Oct 17, 2021, 1:05 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by the urban politician

^ Huh?

OHC= Open House Chicago!

marothisu · #**3119** Posted **Oct 17, 2021, 1:51 AM**

Not surprised about Fulton Market/West Loop. It is a hip or semi hip area and as I've talked about before isn't unlike what happened in lower Manhattan in the late 90s/early 2000s thru like 10 years ago. Same as areas like Logan Square (though that's more like Brooklyn).

TR Devlin · #**3120** Posted **Oct 17, 2021, 11:03 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by marothisu

Not surprised about Fulton Market/West Loop. It is a hip or semi hip area and as I've talked about before isn't unlike what happened in lower Manhattan in the late 90s/early 2000s thru like 10 years ago. Same as areas like Logan Square (though that's more like Brooklyn).

A lot of Chicagoans say that everything west of the Kennedy is like Brooklyn. But that covers a very big area and variety of neighborhoods.

I wondering if you can do a finer mapping. For example:



Wicker Pk	Williamsburg	

Bucktown	Park Slope	

Logan Sq	Bushwick	

Humbolt Pk	??	

Avondale	??	

etc.				



Whadaya think?