Federal Government & Politics | Election 2021 FORUM POLL

[someone123]

Oh yeah, there's obviously capital flight too. Is Canada going to tax global wealth (of citizens? permanent residents?)? What happens if you move abroad? Will Canada be like the US and require that people renounce their citizenship to avoid paying taxes?

We could implement Chinese style capital outflow controls.

[vid]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

So far, the internal SSP poll above is telling me more about the membership of SSP than it is about the final results of the federal election.

Why the ? What were you expecting? An accurate portrayal of national voting intentions? You're like those crazy twitter leftists who think elections are rigged because "Look at how many people posted this Bernie meme!!! Make the results make sense!!!!!! "

I'm literally a registered member of the Green Party. I'm voting NDP because I really have a strong dislike of both my Liberal MP and Justin Trudeau in general. I've been promoting the PPC to anyone I know who is Conservative though, since my riding is considered a 3-way race, to ensure the NDP wins it. I'm very encouraged by the large number of PPC signs here (and I mean large—they're tied with the Conservatives in Thunder Bay as far as signs go).

This is the first election for a higher level of government during which I have not seen a single Green Party sign. I predict they'll get fewer votes than the PPC in both ridings.

My preferred outcome is a Liberal minority with NDP backing, since those parliaments have historically produced the best outcomes for people in general. I'm quite tired of paying thousands of dollars in taxes every year only to be told that all the things that would improve my life are "too expensive" but a multi-billion dollar pipeline to sell unwanted oil is "necessary". Fuck that shit, I'm as sick of it as the Quebecois are of being called out on their bigotries. I hope Trudeau loses a few seats just to humble him a bit, and if he won't be humbled, replace him with someone who is capable of admitting when they've made a mistake and working to correct it because he can't seem to get it right.

Also, fuck anyone who complains to me about taxation policies that I am nowhere near successful enough to need to worry about. The NDP is going to tax your yacht? Must be nice to have such a comfortable life that *that's* your issue this time around.

[Chadillaccc]

Astounding to me that 7 people on this forum will be voting for what amounts to be the closest thing Canada has had to a fascist political party since the 30s. Pathetic. Thankfully they won't win any seats and will continue to be the joke they have been since their inception by that hilarious little wiener.

Speaking of the PPC, that hilarious little wiener (Bernier) was in Calgary for the day of global protesting against… health (?) today. It's funny though, the rally was held in Central Memorial Park in downtown Calgary… and Calgary Centre is the only electoral district in the province their little band of wannabe nazis doesn't have a candidate running in So adorable.

[Gresto]

NDP all the way. I can't stand Trudeau, his arrogance, his entitlement, his cynical contempt for the electorate (in calling an expensive, needless election mid-term simply because the polls looked advantageous), and his insufferably affected speech and mannerisms, but I'll countenance another Lib minority backed by the NDP, or even a coalition. O'Toole is not nearly as unpalatable as Harper, but undesirable all the same.
I like Singh, but I am dismayed by his talking point about "taxing the billionaires". There aren't enough billionaires in Canada to make a difference. He should be talking about progressively raising taxes for anyone making more than, say, 200 Large.

[vid]

Originally Posted by Chadillaccc

Astounding to me that 7 people on this forum will be voting for what amounts to be the closest thing Canada has had to a fascist political party since the 30s.

How is it astounding? You've spent considerable time arguing with several of them for years.

[WarrenC12]

I always love it when online forums defend Billionaires.

We need more taxes on capital, less on labour.

[MolsonExport]

Piketty's central thesis is that when the rate of return on capital is greater than the rate of economic growth over the long term, the result is concentration of wealth. This unequal distribution of wealth causes social and economic instability. Piketty proposes a global system of progressive wealth taxes to help reduce inequality and avoid the vast majority of wealth coming under the control of a tiny minority.

[casper]

Originally Posted by MolsonExport

Piketty's central thesis is that when the rate of return on capital is greater than the rate of economic growth over the long term, the result is concentration of wealth. This unequal distribution of wealth causes social and economic instability. Piketty proposes a global system of progressive wealth taxes to help reduce inequality and avoid the vast majority of wealth coming under the control of a tiny minority.

The concentration of wealth also provide enterprise projects to move forward and get built.

How much does it cost to build a hotel? How about a rental apartment? How about bring a new software project to life? Start a trucking company? Open a restaurant or grocery store? Create a machine shop?

In many case we are talking about an outlay of $1M or more.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by MolsonExport

Piketty's central thesis is that when the rate of return on capital is greater than the rate of economic growth over the long term, the result is concentration of wealth. This unequal distribution of wealth causes social and economic instability. Piketty proposes a global system of progressive wealth taxes to help reduce inequality and avoid the vast majority of wealth coming under the control of a tiny minority.

Yeah and his historical examples of how these things normally revert to the mean aren't something to look forward to. Usually they involve guillotines.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by casper

The concentration of wealth also provide enterprise projects to move forward and get built.

How much does it cost to build a hotel? How about a rental apartment? How about bring a new software project to life? Start a trucking company? Open a restaurant or grocery store? Create a machine shop?

In many case we are talking about an outlay of $1M or more.

Arguably that's what corporations are for.

Does any individual human being *need* more than say, a Billion dollars?

That's enough to set up your family for generations of living in luxury, aka aristocracy.

[vid]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

Arguably that's what corporations are for.

Does any individual human being *need* more than say, a Billion dollars?

That's enough to set up your family for generations of living in luxury, aka aristocracy.

Corporations get money from banks who get money from billionaires except the wealth of billionaires that's stored in banks, like Jeff Bezos's, is mostly stocks and investments which aren't money, they're just a document with an assigned value that could change wildly.

The entire financial "system" is a house of cards at best. It's so abstract and convoluted that you can't tax it. Anything you do to try to contain it will just see it mutate into something different so it can avoid your efforts to hold it accountable.

The only solution is for the people to be fucked over. Equality is impossible, and we should not strive for it. Vote PPC.

[lio45]

Originally Posted by vid

The only solution is for the people to be fucked over. Equality is impossible, and we should not strive for it. Vote PPC.

Right. Anyone in Thunder Bay reading this and intending to vote NDP, don't, you're better off switching your vote to PPC

[lio45]

Originally Posted by MolsonExport

Piketty's central thesis is that when the rate of return on capital is greater than the rate of economic growth over the long term, the result is concentration of wealth. This unequal distribution of wealth causes social and economic instability. Piketty proposes a global system of progressive wealth taxes to help reduce inequality and avoid the vast majority of wealth coming under the control of a tiny minority.

Normally these rates should always match; if not it obviously indicates unsustainable speculation/bubbles. Abnormal and unjustified (temporary) situations.

(Doesn't everyone agree?)

[Chadillaccc]

Originally Posted by vid

How is it astounding? You've spent considerable time arguing with several of them for years.

I guess I just didn’t realize they were that far gone/irredeemable. Very yikes.

[lio45]

It's just a protest vote. No need to read that much into it.

[vid]

Originally Posted by lio45

Right. Anyone in Thunder Bay reading this and intending to vote NDP, don't, you're better off switching your vote to PPC

Hey, the PPC is number one with vacant lots and abandoned buildings, typically the domain of the Conservative Party, so there is definitely a shift this time around!

Originally Posted by Chadillaccc

I guess I just didn’t realize they were that far gone/irredeemable. Very yikes.

You've said some things to them that I wouldn't post and I'm pretty liberal in my free speech on this site. After all, I have at least two posts with the n word in them. I'm still not buying your astonishment.

Originally Posted by lio45

It's just a protest vote. No need to read that much into it.

Yes, but it's a protest vote on the right. As a leftist, this is good news for me. A right wing fringe in Alberta in 2015 delivered an NDP government there, who knows what the PPC can do next time around?!

[Nouvellecosse]

Originally Posted by casper

The concentration of wealth also provide enterprise projects to move forward and get built.

How much does it cost to build a hotel? How about a rental apartment? How about bring a new software project to life? Start a trucking company? Open a restaurant or grocery store? Create a machine shop?

In many case we are talking about an outlay of $1M or more.

Originally Posted by vid

Corporations get money from banks who get money from billionaires except the wealth of billionaires that's stored in banks, like Jeff Bezos's, is mostly stocks and investments which aren't money, they're just a document with an assigned value that could change wildly.

The entire financial "system" is a house of cards at best. It's so abstract and convoluted that you can't tax it. Anything you do to try to contain it will just see it mutate into something different so it can avoid your efforts to hold it accountable.

The only solution is for the people to be fucked over. Equality is impossible, and we should not strive for it. Vote PPC.

Except, banks don't get their money from billionaires - they make it. Yes, that's how most new money gets made. When banks lend money, most or all of what they're lending doesn't exist before hand. They write it into existence with the positive value being issued to the borrower while the creditor retains the negative potential value on a balance sheet. The new money is created in the form of the multiplier effect since the new money enters the economy and can be used to secure new loans spurring the process to repeat. The interest repayment of the principal cancels out the outstanding liability and covers the loans that aren't fully repaid. The hope is that the new value being created by whatever the loan is used for roughly matches the expansion so that the total collective value of the money supply increases despite each unit value decreasing due to inflation. There's also a hope that too great a percentage of loans don't get defaulted on or the interest that gets paid won't cover them all and the total monetary supply then retracts as part of a recession.

This wasn't always the case of course since banks weren't allowed to lend money they didn't actually have. The earliest banks saw all the deposits sitting in their coffers not doing anything and thought it would make sense to make money off it by lending it out to other customers since there was never a large proportion of depositors making withdrawals at any given point. But occasionally everyone would panic and try to all withdraw their funds at once (called a run on the bank) and the bank didn't have enough money available, so regulators put restrictions in place to ensure that banks didn't lend more than a certain proportion beyond the funds they had at hand. This "reserve ratio" differed over time and across regions, but it has generally dropped lower over time to the point that some countries have once again eliminated the requirement.

While this is obviously an oversimplification of the rather convoluted monetary system, the take away is that no, wealth concentration is not needed to ensure the funding of new enterprises. A bank that is cooperatively run and owned by its employees or customers is just as capable of participating in the monetary system as one that's run by wealthy investors. And entities investing on behalf of a large number of less wealthy people such as a teacher's pension fund is just as capable of funding large projects as a single or small number of wealthy individuals.

[Gresto]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

I always love it when online forums defend Billionaires.

We need more taxes on capital, less on labour.

If you're referring to my post, perhaps I wasn't clear. I'm all for taxing billionaires to the hilt (or changing the economic system such that they no longer exist), but my point is that Singh's focus on them is a myopic one; good for a soundbite. Plenty of people are obscenely wealthy while falling far short of billionaire-level affluence.

[caveat.doctor]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

It might be for the best if the Conservatives lose this time. It will give O'Toole time to find better candidates for the next election, and will allow him more time to put his brand on the party. Unless the Conservatives lose catastrophically, I think he will be around for at least one more kick at the can.

Originally Posted by Hybrid247

Voting CPC for the first time on Monday because I don't want to risk giving Trudeau a majority and I also want to signal to the CPC that their move towards center is the right move. Time to abandon the far-right nut jobs.

I agree with Hybrid247 on this one - the Conservative Party this time has done all the right things in more clearly being a centrist party and balanced alternative to the Liberals. If Canadians don't positively reinforce this shift under O'Toole (plus the votes that are lost to the PPC), the message will be that the Party actually needs to double-down on the farther right to keep that base.

I don't think the issue is O'Toole needing to strengthen his "brand" - rather, it's all about making sure the country has two reasonable centrist parties any reasonable person could choose from, to prevent the corruption, arrogance and polarisation that has set in in the Liberal Party since the 2015 win. With the shifts away from Scheer's time, I think this is a good as it gets. If it doesn't work, then we really are reinforcing hyper-polarised politics that only aims to secure one's base.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by vid

Corporations get money from banks who get money from billionaires except the wealth of billionaires that's stored in banks, like Jeff Bezos's, is mostly stocks and investments which aren't money, they're just a document with an assigned value that could change wildly.

What? No, that's not how the financial system works at all.