PHILADELPHIA | Lowrise/General Developments Thread

[mcgrath618]

Originally Posted by Jayfar

CDRs are up, split into morning and afternoon agendas for September 14.

https://www.phila.gov/departments/philadelphia-city-planning-commission/public-meetings/

Includes the first residential/mixed-use development for the Navy Yard:
1. 1200 Normandy Place
Zoned: CMX-3
Gross Square Footage: 704,356 total square feet
25,755 square feet of commercial space
611 residential units
Uses: Residential mixed-use
Parking: 166 vehicular parking spaces
Developer: Mosaic Development Partners (TBC)
Architect: DIGSAU
Attorney: Robert Careless, Cozen O’Connor
PCPC Presenter: Matt Wysong

https://www.phila.gov/media/20210831114744/01_1200-Normandy-Pl_pm.pdf

Great looking project. Can someone explain to me how the BSL extension isn’t justified now?

Yes. I know they need to bore a tunnel. But once the tunnel bore is purchased, it should drive the cost of future extensions down, no?

[Jawnadelphia]

^I posted that over in the Navy Yard thread, I guess technically since these buildings are not a high rise it should've went here, my bad. This project is Digsau, they are awesome--this project should be great.

One question I've always had about the extension of the BSL to the Navy Yard...and I admitted know nothing about such infrastructure/rail construction.

Couldn't you just cut a hole into the ground, elevate the tracks, and have the BSL go above ground, simply run along the road (Broad Street) to the Navy Yard and then down the main street there? Or has that always been the plan? I just don't understand why it costs $1-2 billion to cut a hole, elevate to ground/street level, and install some wires - electric. (if this is a really dumb idea, my apologies!).

[cardeza]

Originally Posted by summersm343

I hear ya, but we have to look at it somewhat positively here. Center City fared pretty well. COVID and BLM protests all at once really hit a lot of cities hard. Manhattan got hit hard in some areas, so did Downtown Chicago. I haven’t been since COVID, but I heard Minneapolis, Seattle, Portland and San Francisco are having tough times too.

It could be worse for sure. This is one time where we should be grateful that Center City is so heavily residential. The vacancies will be filled. We just need a mayor that has some balls and would do something about the homelessness, the dirt bike riders, etc.

The vacancies are probably something that cant be avoided in this current situation, COVID plus online retailing have dealt a major blow to center city retail and the blocks that were struggling before are even worse now. Chestnut east of Broad is in bad shape, its not appealing at all. Im not down here at night so I cant speak on dirt bikes and ATVs but the homelessness and drug addict issues are real and the new info/phone charging kiosks are just a place where the homeless hang out to charge their phones. Not saying they shouldnt be able to charge their phones- but I do wonder what kind of thought was put into the long term effects of placing the kiosks on sidewalks. I have yet to see a tourist or office worker use the kiosk closest to my building. I would say the number one issue that is an absolute turnoff is the amount of urine and poop I encounter on a regular basis, I started working downtown 20 years ago and have been here for most of that time- it was never this bad. We need pay to use public bathrooms or something- this is really unacceptable. Paul Levy has built up a cult like following and has gotten a lot of credit for Center City's resurgence- my thing is you also have to take some of the blame when things arent going well. I see CCD staffers sweeping up and operating their mechanical sweeper- but its just not really enough anymore.

[cardeza]

Originally Posted by skyhigh07

Great summary! Those are exactly my sentiments as well. There are indeed good things happening in the city and it’s encouraging to see more activity. However, while I’ve generally been optimistic, I’ve had an uneasy feeling for the last month or so. I’ve noticed more homeless around Center City and subsequently more trash everywhere. I overheard two young women while walking along Market East the other night who commented the area looks like the zombie apocalypse - to be fair there were quite few meth heads gathered on one particular corner.

Thank you for addressing the dirt bike/ATV situation. Those who don’t think it’s a big deal should try living on Broad, Market or South for a week and see how much they can tolerate it. I imagine it’s probably what hell sounds like. While living at Broad and Arch for a year in Alterra’s One City Apartments, which has “historically protected” 100 year old single paned windows - ie “no windows”, (Alterra likes to skimp on things it seems), I’m pretty sure I lost most of the cells in the part of my brain associated with patience. Also, I was living there during the spring and early summer when groups of 50+ would rampage down Broad at all hours of the night. However, I’ve seen less of the really large groups lately which is encouraging.

Noise pollution is a significant issue in the city that isn’t being addressed enough. I’ve also noticed incredibly loud music emanating from cars which echos off buildings for several blocks - seems like they’re all over lately. Perhaps, I’m now just more sensitive to it, but I lived in Manhattan for three years and it seemed like it was never nearly as noticeable as it is in Philly.

I moved out of One City a few months ago and we have since purchased a townhouse in Spring Garden that we are in the process of renovating, which has been fun. However, if things continue to slide in the wrong direction in terms of quality of life issues, we may end up moving out of the city in a few years. We recently had a conversation with our neighbors who said the same thing.

I hope this doesn’t come across as a rant; thats not my intention. Its just my honest perspective of things as they stand. I love Philly and want to see it succeed. While not everyone is openly discussing it, I do think people are watching to see which way the winds are blowing. If you have similar concerns, please get involved - write to your council member, join a neighborhood association etc. These issues will only get worse if we allow them to.

I think its important to note that many of these issues either don't exist or are less prevalent in the "desirable" neighborhoods outside of Center city so I wont be surprised if there is a slow exodus out of CC to either the burbs, other regions or other Philly neighborhoods. While walking proximity to jobs, restaurants and parks is very valuable, I do wonder how many will pay a premium for that stuff when there are so many headaches, especially when you can get more value in outlying neighborhoods.

[DudeGuy]

Originally Posted by cardeza

I think its important to note that many of these issues either don't exist or are less prevalent in the "desirable" neighborhoods outside of Center city so I wont be surprised if there is a slow exodus out of CC to either the burbs, other regions or other Philly neighborhoods. While walking proximity to jobs, restaurants and parks is very valuable, I do wonder how many will pay a premium for that stuff when there are so many headaches, especially when you can get more value in outlying neighborhoods.

All of these problems would go away if we made it difficult to drive around Center City via installing speed humps, traffic cameras, traffic enforcement officers (like we passed via the ballot initiative), etc.

[AnEmperorPenguin]

Originally Posted by DudeGuy

All of these problems would go away if we made it difficult to drive around Center City via installing speed humps, traffic cameras, traffic enforcement officers (like we passed via the ballot initiative), etc.

I think the speed humps/road redesign and traffic cameras for automated enforcement are going to be what it takes, I (living a bit north of CC) see plenty of cars modded to be way louder then allowed racing around, blowing through lights and stop signs etc, often times in front of cops who I can only assume don't care and will never do anything about it.

[summersm343]

Progress For Two Projects at 25th & Dickinson, on Opposite Sides of the Viaduct

Townhomes on the Grays Ferry side of the tracks:


18 total units starting construction on the Point Breeze side of the tracks:


Read/view more here:
http://www.ocfrealty.com/naked-philly/gr...ts-25th-dickinson-opposite-sides-viaduct

[cardeza]

Originally Posted by DudeGuy

All of these problems would go away if we made it difficult to drive around Center City via installing speed humps, traffic cameras, traffic enforcement officers (like we passed via the ballot initiative), etc.

All of the problems? There are issues beyond ATVs. I actually have not seen that issue during the daytime hours. But I have seen the others.

BTW, looks like Primark is finally about to open at FDP.

https://www.inquirer.com/news/primark-op...-irish-fast-fashion-retail-20210901.html

[Redddog]

Originally Posted by summersm343

Progress For Two Projects at 25th & Dickinson, on Opposite Sides of the Viaduct

Townhomes on the Grays Ferry side of the tracks:


18 total units starting construction on the Point Breeze side of the tracks:


Read/view more here:
http://www.ocfrealty.com/naked-philly/gr...ts-25th-dickinson-opposite-sides-viaduct

I know this developer. Very high quality stuff and a great dude who cares about Philly. They DO exist!

[summersm343]

September CDR Submissions

1200 Normandy Place
-Located in the Navy Yard
-Two residential buildings
-611 total rental units and ground floor retail
-7 floors & 6 floors
PDF:
https://www.phila.gov/media/20210831114744/01_1200-Normandy-Pl_pm.pdf

401 E. Walnut Lane
-Located in East Germantown
-5-story residential building
-57 total units
PDF:
https://www.phila.gov/media/20210831114757/02_-401-07-E-Walnut-Ln_pm.pdf

4240-54 Chestnut Street
-We may have seen this one before
-Located in Walnut Hill or Spruce Hill - whatever you consider this neighborhood
-7 floors
-36,000 sq ft of commercial/office space for Intercultural Family Services, and 128 residential units
PDF:
https://www.phila.gov/media/20210831114641/03_4240-Chestnut-St_pm.pdf

310 Girard Avenue
-We just saw this. This is the redesign of the 3rd & Girard Project
-Located in Northern Liberties
-6 floors
-185 residential units with ground floor retail
PDF:
https://www.phila.gov/media/20210831114710/05_310-330-W-Girard-Ave_pm.pdf

201 W. Johnson Street
-Located in on the border of West Mount Airy and the Morton section of Germantown
-5 floors
-165 residential units
PDF:
https://www.phila.gov/media/20210831114702/04_201-W-Johnson-St_pm.pdf

[summersm343]

611-Unit, Mixed-Use Project Planned at the Navy Yard at 1200 Normandy Place

Current site:


Aerial rendering:


Site plan:


Rendering:


Rendering:


Rendering:


Read/view more here:
http://www.rising.realestate/611-unit-mixed-use-project-planned-at-the-navy-yard/

[New2Fishtown]

Originally Posted by Jawnadelphia

^I posted that over in the Navy Yard thread, I guess technically since these buildings are not a high rise it should've went here, my bad. This project is Digsau, they are awesome--this project should be great.

One question I've always had about the extension of the BSL to the Navy Yard...and I admitted know nothing about such infrastructure/rail construction.

Couldn't you just cut a hole into the ground, elevate the tracks, and have the BSL go above ground, simply run along the road (Broad Street) to the Navy Yard and then down the main street there? Or has that always been the plan? I just don't understand why it costs $1-2 billion to cut a hole, elevate to ground/street level, and install some wires - electric. (if this is a really dumb idea, my apologies!).

Not a dumb question at all. Infrastructure costs more in America than almost anywhere else, and many transit planners, engineers, etc have made a focus to try and understand exactly why that is (Alon Levy is one name I know who's done research on the subject). Between the incredibly complex (and arguably unnecessary) regulatory steps required (such as Environmental Impact Statements) to how we bid contracts, staff projects, etc, it all adds up to sums that are basically insurmountable anywhere where there's a shortage of funds (which is everywhere). Another factor is that we seem to "over-engineer" projects, making them deeper, wider, taller, etc than they really need to be, ballooning costs. Overarching point being, an overground or underground extension of less than a mile should not cost $1 billion, but because it does, the only way to pay for it is federal dollars.

Which brings us to the other side of the issue: lack of political will and entrenched anti-transit bias in prioritizing spending for such projects. There is always money for the things deemed necessary (rebuilding I-95, for example). The federal government could take steps to simplify regulatory processes and expand dollars available for these kinds of investments, but they generally do not.

[Londonee]

Originally Posted by cardeza

All I can say is the negative trends that were developing before COVID in center city are worse now. Im not suggesting that dowtowns arent suffering in other places, but things arent looking great in center city right now. In addition to work scheduling changes in the post covid world I think center city is just lacking some appeal for many companies and workers. I walked around today and the vacancies, homelessness and general look of the city are not where they should be. Even the smells were bad, I felt like I was walking past a trash truck at least 4 times but there wasn't any to be found- it was just trash smells from the alleys carried on the breeze. Things are like this in spite of the presence of the CCD- I guess it would be a lot worse otherwise but thats not really much to get excited about.

Center City is a big place - where exactly was this? I live in Center City and none of these conditions apply to my 'hood. I will admit if you are in the office area at certain quiet times it can feel a bit lonely.

Rittenhouse/Walnut/Chestnut West on a weekend or a nice evening is absolutely brimming with people. My 'hood is busier than it's ever been from a pedestrian standpoint simply b/c more people are staying home for work.

I'm pretty optimistic about a little bit of a reset and market correction post COVID. Things like an underperforming Saxby's at that closed during COVID at 18th and Chestnut is now going to become an &Pizza. The old SNAP kitchen at 19th and Chestnut is becoming a playful ice cream parlor. Slowly but surely it's turning over.

[PHLtoNYC]

Originally Posted by Londonee

Center City is a big place - where exactly was this? I live in Center City and none of these conditions apply to my 'hood. I will admit if you are in the office area at certain quiet times it can feel a bit lonely.

Rittenhouse/Walnut/Chestnut West on a weekend or a nice evening is absolutely brimming with people. My 'hood is busier than it's ever been from a pedestrian standpoint simply b/c more people are staying home for work.

I'm pretty optimistic about a little bit of a reset and market correction post COVID. Things like an underperforming Saxby's at that closed during COVID at 18th and Chestnut is now going to become an &Pizza. The old SNAP kitchen at 19th and Chestnut is becoming a playful ice cream parlor. Slowly but surely it's turning over.

Walnut is largely fine. Chestnut west of 17th is fine. 1200-1700 is spotty to bad. For me, the dirt bike thing is the biggest ongoing problem that needs to be alleviated.

But I LOVE &Pizza, glad they are expanding Philadelphia.

Van Leeuwen (ice cream) opened their first Philadelphia location at 13th & Sansom last week too.

[PHLtoNYC]

Originally Posted by skyhigh07

Great summary! Those are exactly my sentiments as well. There are indeed good things happening in the city and it’s encouraging to see more activity. However, while I’ve generally been optimistic, I’ve had an uneasy feeling for the last month or so. I’ve noticed more homeless around Center City and subsequently more trash everywhere. I overheard two young women while walking along Market East the other night who commented the area looks like the zombie apocalypse - to be fair there were quite few meth heads gathered on one particular corner.

Thank you for addressing the dirt bike/ATV situation. Those who don’t think it’s a big deal should try living on Broad, Market or South for a week and see how much they can tolerate it. I imagine it’s probably what hell sounds like. While living at Broad and Arch for a year in Alterra’s One City Apartments, which has “historically protected” 100 year old single paned windows - ie “no windows”, (Alterra likes to skimp on things it seems), I’m pretty sure I lost most of the cells in the part of my brain associated with patience. Also, I was living there during the spring and early summer when groups of 50+ would rampage down Broad at all hours of the night. However, I’ve seen less of the really large groups lately which is encouraging.

Noise pollution is a significant issue in the city that isn’t being addressed enough. I’ve also noticed incredibly loud music emanating from cars which echos off buildings for several blocks - seems like they’re all over lately. Perhaps, I’m now just more sensitive to it, but I lived in Manhattan for three years and it seemed like it was never nearly as noticeable as it is in Philly.

I moved out of One City a few months ago and we have since purchased a townhouse in Spring Garden that we are in the process of renovating, which has been fun. However, if things continue to slide in the wrong direction in terms of quality of life issues, we may end up moving out of the city in a few years. We recently had a conversation with our neighbors who said the same thing.

I hope this doesn’t come across as a rant; thats not my intention. Its just my honest perspective of things as they stand. I love Philly and want to see it succeed. While not everyone is openly discussing it, I do think people are watching to see which way the winds are blowing. If you have similar concerns, please get involved - write to your council member, join a neighborhood association etc. These issues will only get worse if we allow them to.

Thanks! I am in agreement with your statements too, not a rant to me. I love seeing Philadelphia grow and succeed, just frustrating to see some of these problems, such as the dirt bike situation.

An eye opener will be 2022 when the residential abatement changes. If proposals keep pouring in despite the change, then I am hopeful many of these problems will be addressed or alleviated in due time. If we see a major slowdown in large proposals, then I will be a little nervous.

[PurpleWhiteOut]

I also hope it will get better. I live within walking distance of CC and I don't even go anymore, unless I have to. Partially because there isn't much there for retail that interests me anymore, but partially because of the frankly unpleasant QoL issues (especially trying to get to Chinatown via East Market/Convention Center area). Work brings me to UC, and I prefer neighborhood places at this point rather than dealing with it. None of the issues are permanent, and I'm pretty confident it'll turn around eventually.

On the optimistic side, neighborhood corridors are generally doing great still, and I do like everything in the CDR

[Londonee]

Originally Posted by PurpleWhiteOut

I also hope it will get better. I live within walking distance of CC and I don't even go anymore, unless I have to. Partially because there isn't much there for retail that interests me anymore, but partially because of the frankly unpleasant QoL issues (especially trying to get to Chinatown via East Market/Convention Center area). Work brings me to UC, and I prefer neighborhood places at this point rather than dealing with it. None of the issues are permanent, and I'm pretty confident it'll turn around eventually.

On the optimistic side, neighborhood corridors are generally doing great still, and I do like everything in the CDR

Again, where in CC are you talking about? I assume both you and Cardeza are talking about issues around Market/Chestnut East - b/c there doesn't seem to be that much different around Rittenhouse and Market West. Not trying to push, but I have relationships with some city entities so if sh$t is a problem in a particular area it's helpful to be specific so we can call it out if needed.

[PurpleWhiteOut]

Originally Posted by PHLtoNYC

Walnut is largely fine. Chestnut west of 17th is fine. 1200-1700 is spotty to bad. For me, the dirt bike thing is the biggest ongoing problem that needs to be alleviated.

I agree with this, additionally things are a mess around the Convention Center/Reading Terminal, East Market/Filbert, East South St somewhat, and the areas around Suburban Station/Love Park aren't great. I lived on 15th St for the past two years so I can second the Broad St bikers being a pain in the ass. It's not everywhere, but issues that were there before are just noticeably worse and I just often don't feel it's worth going for leisure unless I have a specific destination. Part of it's on me of course, I'm just hoping and things keep reopening that it'll be worth the fun. I don't want to derail on this too much because I don't think it will really end up productive but there is definitely a feeling that minor issues aren't being kept up on which is coalescing into a larger issue of general unpleasantness

[badthingshappen]

I'm sure it's been posted about before but I missed it. They've been building a big condo/apt? complex around York & Emerald, taking up an empty lot or two and a big parking lot. I deal with the truck repair shop there for work and pass by this often, it's going up fast! The owner of the shop says he's ready to sell to a developer and retire as soon as someone offers him enough haha

Pardon the invoice reflection in my windshield.

https://i.imgur.com/pDD4Oam.jpg

[Busy Bee]

Just wondering if we should steer the expected flood damage and recovery talk to a new thread?