Downtown Eastside - DTES Issues

[Klazu]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

Feel free to see yourself out.

And I have! 5 years in Burnaby and counting. Previously I still visited Vancouver to spend money but with all the crime and religious hatred towards cars, I am sure to spend my money in the burbs instead.

[Changing City]

Originally Posted by Klazu

And I have! 5 years in Burnaby and counting. Previously I still visited Vancouver to spend money but with all the crime and religious hatred towards cars, I am sure to spend my money in the burbs instead.

LOL - the previous widely reported murder was a woman from Burnaby, and then there were the 'young people' stabbed in February, and the woman stalked in Central Park last week, and the 'vicious stabbing' last December by the Highgate Shopping Centre...

And Vancouver doesn't really have a religious hatred towards cars - it just thinks cyclists, transit riders and pedestrians who pay the same taxes towards the same spaces between buildings deserve a fair opportunity to use the space. What is doesn't have is an idolatrous worship of private cars. We're trying to be more like those impressive Scandinavian cities like Oslo, although they're way more anti-car than Vancouver will probably ever be.

And to return to a more DTES-related theme, it would be great if we could adopt a policy like this: "Housing First is built on the principle that having a permanent home can make solving health and social problems much easier. The homeless are given permanent housing on a normal lease. That can range from a self-contained apartment to a housing block with round-the-clock support. Tenants pay rent and are entitled to receive housing benefits. Depending on their income, they may contribute to the cost of the support services they receive. The rest is covered by local government."

[logan5]

Whatever happened to the Guardian Angels? Need them more than ever.


https://www.straight.com/news/vancouvers-guardian-angels-say-they-arent-vigilantes

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by Klazu

And I have! 5 years in Burnaby and counting. Previously I still visited Vancouver to spend money but with all the crime and religious hatred towards cars, I am sure to spend my money in the burbs instead.

Great! Don't bother commenting on Vancouver posts either then, bye!

[Sheba]

Originally Posted by Alex Mackinnon

Again, use your "jump to conclusions mat" and you're probably going to look like a moron when the story comes out. 90% of the time anyways.


Random people people on the other hand don't tend just wander out to places like Lynn Valley unless there's a reason. Impoverished people in the dtes have less mobility than most. Every part of society has its percentage of crazies, serial killers, and generally terrible people. The ones who cant function or cover it up might end up in the ghettos, but thats certainly not all of them. You subsequently can't just blame all that terrible shit that happens on the dtes.

Here's what we know about the man charged in the fatal North Vancouver stabbing attack

On Sunday the Integrated Homicide Investigation Team (IHIT) reported Yannick Bandaogo, 28, had been charged with second-degree murder in the stabbing attack outside the Lynn Valley library on Saturday afternoon.

Bandaogo was arrested at the scene by several police as he stabbed himself. The victim was a woman in her late 20s. Six other people were seriously hurt in the attack.

The RCMP said police were investigating Bandaogo’s “background, history in B.C. and relationship to the victims”.

Court record searches in B.C. turned up no one of that name.

However, according to a Postmedia News search of court records in Quebec there was an arrest warrant issued in Sept. 2020 for a 28-year-old man called Yannick Bandaogo.

Records show Bandaogo pleaded guilty to assault in a conjugal (domestic) violence case in Sept. 2019 in Longueuil, Quebec.

A bench warrant was issued for Bandaogo’s arrest in July 2020 for failure to appear in court.

The Canada-wide arrest warrant was issued in September.

In Oct. 2018, Bandaogo was sentenced to one month in jail for assaulting a police officer and resisting arrest.

The same day he was sentenced to four months in jail for assault causing bodily harm and was handed a three-month term for two separate assault cases.

It is not known yet whether these sentences (that totalled eight months) were served concurrently or how the cases were related.

[rofina]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

Feel free to see yourself out.

Many of us are, while scratching our heads not understanding how it is that everyone is so okay with the precipitous fall in quality of life.

This isn't a win for anyone.

[rofina]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

Great! Don't bother commenting on Vancouver posts either then, bye!

Without meaning to, in two posts, you represent some of the worst attitude in this city.
This type of thinking is sinking this region. Its so obvious now, that's its getting to be laughable.

The most fucking aggravating and ignorant response ever - "don't like it, leave."

Same excuse that's been used here to justify every problem for decades;

Expensive out of control housing? Don't like it, leave.
Out of control bureaucracy? Don't like it, leave.
DTES turning violent and spreading city wide? Don't like it, leave.

Embarrassing and pathetic.

Lets not do better, lets just encourage people that don't want to be robbed while stepping on human shit to leave.
Their connection to the community? Irrelevant.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by rofina

Without meaning to, in two posts, you represent some of the worst attitude in this city.
This type of thinking is sinking this region. Its so obvious now, that's its getting to be laughable.

Klazu has had a terrible and extremely biased attitude towards anything poverty/homeless related.

Of course I'm sick of the crime, filth, and everything else that is going on. His posts and some others on the topic are worse than useless at solving the problem. So really, STFU and leave if you have nothing of value to contribute.

[Vin]

Originally Posted by Alex Mackinnon

Again, use your "jump to conclusions mat" and you're probably going to look like a moron when the story comes out. 90% of the time anyways.

Don't get me wrong on the park encampment. I'm of the opinion that it's a colossal fuck up. It should never have been allowed to assemble. I've had 7 incidents this year involving theft, and another when I caught a fellow breaking into a neighbor's car and got them arrested. The neighborhood is basically getting pillaged and feels much less safe than it's felt in the decade Ive lived here. There should be a lot of asses in jail cells.

Random people people on the other hand don't tend just wander out to places like Lynn Valley unless there's a reason. Impoverished people in the dtes have less mobility than most. Every part of society has its percentage of crazies, serial killers, and generally terrible people. The ones who cant function or cover it up might end up in the ghettos, but thats certainly not all of them. You subsequently can't just blame all that terrible shit that happens on the dtes.

Regarding the murder in Oakridge, I'd bet money on those guys being used by someone else. The cop outfits scream premeditated intimidation, rather than robbery for supplying a drug habit. I wouldn't be at so surprised if those two were used by a dealer or someone who needed a favour and needed someone expendable.

Yeah, but those "random" drug addicts may break into properties and vehicles, steal carburetors and bikes, or whatever they can get their hands on to continue their nasty habit of killing themselves, create a nuisance, causing fear by swearing at people, etc. Stabbing people is just how it can escalate into. The drugs of today are more potent and mind-bending than their predecessors, and ruin human brains way faster. That's what we call "mentally unstable". These people may see their victims as devils or monsters, or even hear tiny voices to cause harm to people around them. Heck, I see addicts on the streets digging into the crevices of walkway pavements, presumably seeing nasty maggots they want to squish in them.

We really need to forcefully make them go cold turkey. I would do that to my own brother if he takes drugs too.

[NewfBC]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

Klazu has had a terrible and extremely biased attitude towards anything poverty/homeless related.

Of course I'm sick of the crime, filth, and everything else that is going on. His posts and some others on the topic are worse than useless at solving the problem. So really, STFU and leave if you have nothing of value to contribute.

People are entitled to their opinion, if you don't like it, leave.

Ron.

[scryer]

Originally Posted by rofina

Without meaning to, in two posts, you represent some of the worst attitude in this city.
This type of thinking is sinking this region. Its so obvious now, that's its getting to be laughable.

The most fucking aggravating and ignorant response ever - "don't like it, leave."

Same excuse that's been used here to justify every problem for decades;

Expensive out of control housing? Don't like it, leave.
Out of control bureaucracy? Don't like it, leave.
DTES turning violent and spreading city wide? Don't like it, leave.

Embarrassing and pathetic.

Lets not do better, lets just encourage people that don't want to be robbed while stepping on human shit to leave.
Their connection to the community? Irrelevant.

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

Klazu has had a terrible and extremely biased attitude towards anything poverty/homeless related.

Of course I'm sick of the crime, filth, and everything else that is going on. His posts and some others on the topic are worse than useless at solving the problem. So really, STFU and leave if you have nothing of value to contribute.

Basically WarrenC12, your response was "don't like it, leave" yet again; proving rofina's point. Not trying to stir the pot further but I do want to help generate some self awareness in your own posting/biases. And rofina does have a point in that certain attitudes/ultimatums are incredibly dismissive and hindering the overall discussion.

To try and get things back on track, this is what Sheba quoted:

On Sunday the Integrated Homicide Investigation Team (IHIT) reported Yannick Bandaogo, 28, had been charged with second-degree murder in the stabbing attack outside the Lynn Valley library on Saturday afternoon.

Bandaogo was arrested at the scene by several police as he stabbed himself. The victim was a woman in her late 20s. Six other people were seriously hurt in the attack.

The RCMP said police were investigating Bandaogo’s “background, history in B.C. and relationship to the victims”.

Court record searches in B.C. turned up no one of that name.

However, according to a Postmedia News search of court records in Quebec there was an arrest warrant issued in Sept. 2020 for a 28-year-old man called Yannick Bandaogo.

Records show Bandaogo pleaded guilty to assault in a conjugal (domestic) violence case in Sept. 2019 in Longueuil, Quebec.

A bench warrant was issued for Bandaogo’s arrest in July 2020 for failure to appear in court.

The Canada-wide arrest warrant was issued in September.

In Oct. 2018, Bandaogo was sentenced to one month in jail for assaulting a police officer and resisting arrest.

The same day he was sentenced to four months in jail for assault causing bodily harm and was handed a three-month term for two separate assault cases.

It is not known yet whether these sentences (that totalled eight months) were served concurrently or how the cases were related.

Personally I fail to see the specific DTES connection yet but I do see that this guy was from out of province (which was a huge discussion a few pages ago, let me remind everyone) AND that the justice system (read: both enforcement and laws in place) had multiple opportunities to apprehend this guy on multiple charges, and failed to protect the public.

[Alex Mackinnon]

Originally Posted by Vin

Yeah, but those "random" drug addicts may break into properties and vehicles, steal carburetors and bikes, or whatever they can get their hands on to continue their nasty habit of killing themselves, create a nuisance, causing fear by swearing at people, etc. Stabbing people is just how it can escalate into. The drugs of today are more potent and mind-bending than their predecessors, and ruin human brains way faster. That's what we call "mentally unstable". These people may see their victims as devils or monsters, or even hear tiny voices to cause harm to people around them. Heck, I see addicts on the streets digging into the crevices of walkway pavements, presumably seeing nasty maggots they want to squish in them.

We really need to forcefully make them go cold turkey. I would do that to my own brother if he takes drugs too.

Hehe, steal carburetors? That's pretty funny. They can have the damned things

I'm not saying our health system is working. It definitely needs a pretty major rejig. Blaming everything on the dtes on the other is pretty freaking dumb though.

[Vin]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

Klazu has had a terrible and extremely biased attitude towards anything poverty/homeless related.

Of course I'm sick of the crime, filth, and everything else that is going on. His posts and some others on the topic are worse than useless at solving the problem. So really, STFU and leave if you have nothing of value to contribute.

Tsk tsk tsk.

Regarding Klazu, not really. But you have an extremely biased attitude towards anything mall-related.

[rofina]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

Klazu has had a terrible and extremely biased attitude towards anything poverty/homeless related.

Of course I'm sick of the crime, filth, and everything else that is going on. His posts and some others on the topic are worse than useless at solving the problem. So really, STFU and leave if you have nothing of value to contribute.

I really encourage you to self reflect a little.

This whole notion of shut up and leave, what type of response or positive reaction do you expect?

Why would you shamelessly say it to Klazu and I?

I remember your posts all the way to early 2000's on Real Estate Talks. Were all stressed - but you've been an apologist asshole lately.

Take a breather and consider who the problem here is. People leaving needles around and shitting on sidewalks, or people talking about it online?

[Vin]

Originally Posted by Alex Mackinnon

Hehe, steal carburetors? That's pretty funny. They can have the damned things

I'm not saying our health system is working. It definitely needs a pretty major rejig. Blaming everything on the dtes on the other is pretty freaking dumb though.

If we can solve the problems in the DTES, everything else becomes a piece of cake. Hence we need to focus on the biggest problem, and that's not dumb at all.

Originally Posted by Changing City

LOL - the previous widely reported murder was a woman from Burnaby, and then there were the 'young people' stabbed in February, and the woman stalked in Central Park last week, and the 'vicious stabbing' last December by the Highgate Shopping Centre...

And Vancouver doesn't really have a religious hatred towards cars - it just thinks cyclists, transit riders and pedestrians who pay the same taxes towards the same spaces between buildings deserve a fair opportunity to use the space. What is doesn't have is an idolatrous worship of private cars. We're trying to be more like those impressive Scandinavian cities like Oslo, although they're way more anti-car than Vancouver will probably ever be.

And to return to a more DTES-related theme, it would be great if we could adopt a policy like this: "Housing First is built on the principle that having a permanent home can make solving health and social problems much easier. The homeless are given permanent housing on a normal lease. That can range from a self-contained apartment to a housing block with round-the-clock support. Tenants pay rent and are entitled to receive housing benefits. Depending on their income, they may contribute to the cost of the support services they receive. The rest is covered by local government."

You make it sound like the DTES is problem-free. What about these?
https://globalnews.ca/news/7722841/strathcona-park-fire/
https://vancouversun.com/news/woman-shot-to-death-in-vancouvers-downtown-eastside

Fact is, DTES reflects the consequences of most of the failings of this city and even the province. The results are usually exacerbated and many times worse in the DTES: all concentrated around the DTES and its immediate neighbours, ie. downtown Vancouver.

[Changing City]

Originally Posted by Vin

You make it sound like the DTES is problem-free. What about these?

Of course I didn't. Klazu made it sound like Burnaby was problem-free. Nowhere is problem-free these days - most recently North Vancouver. But suggesting that it's all because of the DTES is total nonsense.

And you repeat over and over and over again the same simplistic 'lock them all up' mantra that we all know you believe in. Really, you don't have to repeat it. We know your opinion.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by rofina

This whole notion of shut up and leave, what type of response or positive reaction do you expect?

When you ceaselessly complain and shit all over Vancouver, what type of response or positive reaction do you expect?

I don't know where you get that I'm an apologist? You rage against the same things all thread long with no productive solutions. It's tiring and frustrations boil over.

[chowhou]

Yikes! Anyway-

COVID-19 vaccination clinics are continuing to pop up in the Downtown Eastside as public health workers try to offer as much protection as possible to people who live and work in the vulnerable neighbourhood.

The vaccination clinics have set up at locations like the Carnegie Centre, the Downtown Eastside Street Market, the Japanese Hall and the corner of Main and Powell.

But peer workers and nurses have also visited single-room occupancy hotels in an attempt to offer the vaccine to as many people as possible. In some cases, health-care workers have even made house calls for people unable to leave their rooms.

“If somebody had an issue and couldn’t move from their room, we would go to their room and vaccinate them as well and then we’d have to wait outside the door for 15 minutes to make sure they were OK,” said Guy Felicella, a peer clinical advisor with Vancouver Coastal Health.

“VCH has really done well in meeting the community exactly where they’re at.”

Source: The Tyee

Sounds like vaccination in the DTES is going well all things considered.

[rofina]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

When you ceaselessly complain and shit all over Vancouver, what type of response or positive reaction do you expect?

I don't know where you get that I'm an apologist? You rage against the same things all thread long with no productive solutions. It's tiring and frustrations boil over.

I don't shit on Vancouver - I shit on the apologizing and lack of accountability the leadership here is willing to have. I also shit on the complete embrace of inaction that seems to be ok here.

Its surprisingly uncomplicated;

1. Figure out whos who; Mentally ill, criminal, newly homeless.

2. For those that are newly homeless, provide housing, this is who should be receiving all the $500,000 hotel rooms.

3.Mental health issues; build a facility, maybe rebuild Riverview. How do you fund it? DTES costs 1 million a day, everyday, 365. 3 years of current DTES funding would pay for a billion dollar medical care facility. Dispose of all the non-profits running the DTES. We need to actively dismantle the poverty industry. This does not mean disposing of services, health and food services should continue to be funded. The rest can kick it.

4. Criminals, treat them as such and prosecute them. Use existing laws, and lock them up.

That takes care of 75% of the problems, enough to bring the community to a point where it can heal and begin recovery.

I have taken this message in person to the people that can make change. I have a clear conscience in all this - its the politicians and public will that makes real solutions untenable.

Its somehow unpalatable that real action needs to be taken, and the adults need to start acting like adults.

Its patently absurd to let 0.004% of Vancouver population dictate policy and direction of the City, and that's what the current situation feels like.

EDIT:

Ill add - Vancouver needs to be shit on. Preferably by some international publications. The recent news its been making in a negative light, is actually a positive.
Its clear unchecked human misery and gross mismanagement are not enough to get the population and leadership to act in a meaningful way.

Perhaps embarrassment on the international stage for "the best place on earth" and "greenest city" is exactly what's needed to prompt real action and spark conversations that go beyond
useless platitudes and status quo.

Enough of rose colored glasses - were failing on so many front and its obvious to people that actually care. I think you know I'm right, and I think its the reason you're defensive.

This is all getting embarrassing, and its our collective fault for allowing it, and more importantly empowering people that continually allow it to go on.

[scryer]

Originally Posted by Changing City

Nowhere is problem-free these days - most recently North Vancouver. But suggesting that it's all because of the DTES is total nonsense.

The DTES does, however, set the precedent that everywhere else in Metro Vancouver should tolerate the levels of unreported crime and poverty that the DTES does. That's a problem.

Originally Posted by rofina

I don't shit on Vancouver - I shit on the apologizing and lack of accountability the leadership here is willing to have. I also shit on the complete embrace of inaction that seems to be ok here.

Its surprisingly uncomplicated;

1. Figure out whos who; Mentally ill, criminal, newly homeless.

2. For those that are newly homeless, provide housing, this is who should be receiving all the $500,000 hotel rooms.

3.Mental health issues; build a facility, maybe rebuild Riverview. How do you fund it? DTES costs 1 million a day, everyday, 365. 3 years of current DTES funding would pay for a billion dollar medical care facility. Dispose of all the non-profits running the DTES. We need to actively dismantle the poverty industry. This does not mean disposing of services, health and food services should continue to be funded. The rest can kick it.

4. Criminals, treat them as such and prosecute them. Use existing laws, and lock them up.

That takes care of 75% of the problems, enough to bring the community to a point where it can heal and begin recovery.

I have taken this message in person to the people that can make change. I have a clear conscience in all this - its the politicians and public will that makes real solutions untenable.

Its somehow unpalatable that real action needs to be taken, and the adults need to start acting like adults.

Its patently absurd to let 0.004% of Vancouver population dictate policy and direction of the City, and that's what the current situation feels like.

EDIT:

Ill add - Vancouver needs to be shit on. Preferably by some international publications. The recent news its been making in a negative light, is actually a positive.
Its clear unchecked human misery and gross mismanagement are not enough to get the population and leadership to act in a meaningful way.

Perhaps embarrassment on the international stage for "the best place on earth" and "greenest city" is exactly what's needed to prompt real action and spark conversations that go beyond
useless platitudes and status quo.

Enough of rose colored glasses - were failing on so many front and its obvious to people that actually care. I think you know I'm right, and I think its the reason you're defensive.

This is all getting embarrassing, and its our collective fault for allowing it, and more importantly empowering people that continually allow it to go on.

I get the strangest feeling that you've posted this before . Doesn't change the fact that I agree with you.