Salt Lake Transit News Thread

[Makid]

Originally Posted by downtownslcresident

All I have to say is, are you f**king kidding me?! WHY DONT WE UNDERSTAND YET THAT WE NEED TO INVEST IN OUR COMMUNITIES?!

I have been having the same issue since I read the story.

Trax in the existing ROW into Lehi and down to American Fork is the right way to go.

BRT through the Prison Redevelopment area is also the right way to go.

These are not either or options but actually cooperative options.

There is enough demand and support for the Trax extension today. BRT can be worked on as development happens in the redevelopment area.

The problem is that no one is looking at this issue as part of the whole transit system. They are just looking at the single area, and only for development. They are not taking ridership into account, at least as part of the whole system.

We know from previous estimates that Trax to Lehi would add between 20,000 and 25,000 daily riders. Trax to American Fork is estimated between 40,000 and 45,000 daily riders.

The Lehi extensions riders are mostly from SL County. The AF section is split between Salt Lake and Utah County riders. The majority of the riders do not take FrontRunner today. I will state that roughly 50% would most likely take FrontRunner if it ran every 15 minutes.

The BRT line should be a link through the redevelopment area from Draper FrontRunner to Lehi FrontRunner.

If Trax isn't extended to Utah County, FrontRunner needs to have the fares dropped to the same $2.50 per trip level.

See, someone who lives in Sandy and works in Lehi would pay $5.00 to $7.50 each way for FrontRunner. Trax and BRT is $2.50 each way. The FrontRunner costs increase if the person works in American Fork.

While many companies do provide transit passes in SL County, many in Utah County do not. This pushes the costs solely on the employee and they are less likely to pay for transit directly as opposed to drive. This inclination to driving is increased as the number of transfers increases.

Even though Utah County is working on a better bus network and is connecting it to the rail stations, using the example above, the person from Sandy would be looking at no less than 2 transfers. 3 if they don't live adjacent to Trax. 2 transfers is generally the limit for transit ridership. Anything more and you get diminishing riders.

I think this is the point where the State needs to step in and ensure that Trax is extended to Utah County and a separate BRT line is built through the redevelopment area. We need more people to realize that there are different Use Cases and the prison redevelopment area is not going to be a destination for a decent amount of people for 20+ years while Lehi and American Fork are viable today. If we want to get more people using Transit and improve air quality, we need to reduce the number of transfers whenever possible.

[joscar]

Originally Posted by downtownslcresident

All I have to say is, are you f**king kidding me?! WHY DONT WE UNDERSTAND YET THAT WE NEED TO INVEST IN OUR COMMUNITIES?!


UTA discards proposal for $1 billion TRAX at Point of Mountain; seeks bus rapid transit there instead:

https://www.sltrib.com/news/politics/202...er_BFmlwWb4iJBY0Tyyp1ChHXbUm8JLtZYHod83g

Agreed. I just pulled the "Preferred Alternative Recommendation" map from the meeting's agenda packet. Looks terrible and a connection to FrontRunner in Lehi is only an "option." Want to get from your home in Orem to your job at Adobe on UTA? Well ride FrontRunner to Draper then catch BRT back south.

UTA had a great plan, using the old Union Pacific mainline ROW around Point of the Mountain for TRAX. I'm sure we can thank the state legislature for this boondoggle.

[Ironweed]

I am a rail proponent. I think it is far more efficient that a RBT.

Very disappointing to see UTA bail on extending light rail. I think it is a major mistake.

[RC14]

If the goal is to serve the prion site than I would prefer BRT. The future TRAX extension needs to continue along the existing ROW to better serve the rest of the system in the future. My hope is that in the long term we get both a BRT line serving the prison site and an LRT extension of the existing blue line serving Lehi, American Fork and beyond

[bob rulz]

Very disappointed in this incredibly short-sighted decision.

[Schmoe]

Originally Posted by bob rulz

Very disappointed in this incredibly short-sighted decision.

I'm torn on this. I love public transit, but with the future poised to welcome electric AVs, I wonder if our road infrastructure won't be the best thing for our community and hundreds of others across the country.

[RC14]

^
I think, on some level, infrastructure investment is an expensive apology for poor planning. IE if cities were designed in the most efficient way possible from the start we wouldn't need to spend billions on trains and highways.

There is an argument that the best way to incorporate AVs is to create a "stupid" road system. Because AVs would be able to communicate with each other we would not need things like traffic lights, extra lanes, signage etc. All we will need is pavement for the vehicles to travel on. It is possible that we could get to a point were vehicles wouldn't need to stop at intersections because they would be able to time everything such that they could pass within inches of each other.

I don't know if we will ever get to that point but, to your point, I think that is the future we should move towards. A world where expensive infrastructure is no longer necessary.

[Schmoe]

Every time I hear the arguments about local transit infrastructure, these are the exact thoughts I return to. I do think long-haul infrastructure would be a good investment, but that's another topic.

[bob rulz]

I'm still far from convinced that this fully autonomous EV future is less than decades away. Even if it's closer than that, it's still a poor reason not to invest in public transit. I don't see why we can't have both anyway.

[Schmoe]

Originally Posted by bob rulz

i'm still far from convinced that this fully autonomous ev future is less than decades away. Even if it's closer than that, it's still a poor reason not to invest in public transit. I don't see why we can't have both anyway.

R O I

[New_Future_Mayor]

Originally Posted by Schmoe

R O I

Even with EV fully autonomous vehicles and shared services, many people will still not be able to afford that service, and transit can take much of that load off. Capacity on rail is still much easier to add, with frequency (when double tracked, looking at you FrontRunner). There is still only a certain amount of capacity on highways even with autonomous vehicles maximizing the space.

So are you arguing that because EV Autonomous may be here in the next 10 years or the maybe the next 40, that transit infrastructure shouldn't be built? It's going to take an entire generation to get the majority of people to move to autonomous.

[Schmoe]

Originally Posted by New_Future_Mayor

Even with EV fully autonomous vehicles and shared services, many people will still not be able to afford that service, and transit can take much of that load off. Capacity on rail is still much easier to add, with frequency (when double tracked, looking at you FrontRunner). There is still only a certain amount of capacity on highways even with autonomous vehicles maximizing the space.

So are you arguing that because EV Autonomous may be here in the next 10 years or the maybe the next 40, that transit infrastructure shouldn't be built? It's going to take an entire generation to get the majority of people to move to autonomous.

Personally, I think you're underestimating the pace of technological development. But who knows? I think the better ROI on transit projects is enhancing routes in the urban core and improving speed to/from the suburban communities. While I love Trax, I don't think it solves either problem when you get down into Utah County. So I agree about FrontRunner, but I don't necessarily agree about Trax when it comes to the distance of going to Lehi or beyond. If we were talking about new routes within 20 miles of downtown, I could get behind that. Over time, however, I think AVs will be the preferred mode of transit for all but the lowest income individuals, and fixed route transit will consolidate to only the minimum of spoke routes.

[RC14]

I don't think people will ride TRAX from American Fork to Salt Lake regularly but I still think the Blue line should be extended to American Fork. People will ride TRAX from American Fork to Lehi, Lehi to Draper, Draper to Front Runner in Murray etc. TRAX will serve the medium haul commutes and help commuters get to Front Runner.

Just like you probably wouldn't drive State Street from Draper to SLC, you would probably take I-15.

[Makid]

Utah could get in on money for a statewide commuter rail system

https://www.fox13now.com/news/local-news...ney-for-a-statewide-commuter-rail-system

SALT LAKE CITY — A resolution introduced in the Utah State Legislature seeks to prod the state to get in on potentially billions in infrastructure spending for a statewide commuter rail system.

Senate Concurrent Resolution 3, sponsored by Senate Minority Whip Luz Escamilla, D-Salt Lake City, and Rep. Sandra Hollins, D-Salt Lake City, would push for Utah to pursue options to expand rail through congressional funding.

"There is going to be money coming for infrastructure across the country," Sen. Escamilla said in an interview with FOX 13 on Tuesday. "We should be at the table, being the Crossroads of the West."

The system envisioned is not like Utah Transit Authority's FrontRunner or TRAX, but more like Amtrak. There is discussion of rail lines from Ogden to Cedar City, or Provo to Green River. Christensen said that's as far as existing rail lines go right now, but buses could get people to the tourism hotspots of St. George and Moab.

This would be a great opportunity to not only build the lines but also to have them connect through the Rio Grande Station in SLC. Everyone should send Hatman's write up to not only the bill sponsors but also to the Transportation committees.

I have sent copies to nearly everyone in the State Legislature.

I don't think the project will be funded this year but I could see a Study being conducted for the viability of the lines. I also think that the lines would be better utilized and more successful with a connection to a Renovated and Upgraded Rio Grande Station.

[Makid]

I got an email today regarding an update on the 200 South upgrades.

Soil and Pavement Sampling
NIGHT WORK
February 3 - 5, 2021
9 p.m. - 6 a.m.

Crews and equipment will be moving throughout the corridor collecting soil and pavement samples. Operations will begin at 900 E. and move west, spending approximately 2 hours at each sampling location. Expect night time construction lighting, moving construction equipment with temporary lane closures, vibration and noise from equipment and the sampling process.

Even though I prefer center running transit, I do like the progress that is being made. I still wish they would reduce a lane of traffic from each direction. This way there is ample room for the protected bike lanes, and the intermittent green (landscaped) medians.

The way it is going, I would love to see the same updates done on multiple streets around the City such as 6th North, 4th West, 9th South, 13th East, and 21st South to list those that I feel would be good candidates over the next few years.

[Makid]

Utah lawmakers propose $2.2 billion in road, rail and state park improvements

https://www.fox13now.com/news/local-news...in-road-rail-and-state-park-improvements

SALT LAKE CITY — A $2.2 billion infrastructure spending bill has been unveiled in the Utah State Legislature, spending taxpayer money to improve roads, speed up trains and improve state parks.

"It’d be a record amount of infrastructure spending in the state," said House Majority Whip Mike Schultz, R-Hooper, who is sponsoring House Bill 433.

The bill, made public late Wednesday, would allocate money to double-track FrontRunner trains from Provo to Ogden, as well as funding a bus rapid transit system in the middle of the Salt Lake Valley. It's because I-15 is reaching capacity as the state continues to see population growth, Rep. Schultz said.

"Our roadways can’t handle the additional capacity. UDOT will tell you, we can’t make I-15 wide enough," he said.

It would also plan for growth at Point of the Mountain when the Utah State Prison moves, and even fund a bridge project in Brigham City.

The legislature is proposing a funding increase for Utah Transit Authority to fund double-tracking Frontrunner, with the goal of trains running every 15 minutes.

[bob rulz]

Is it talking about the Mid-Valley Connector? That's definitely one of the BRT lines I would love to see.

Does anybody know where we can find a complete list of projects that are proposed to be funded?

[Utahn]

Originally Posted by bob rulz

Is it talking about the Mid-Valley Connector? That's definitely one of the BRT lines I would love to see.

Does anybody know where we can find a complete list of projects that are proposed to be funded?

https://www.deseret.com/utah/2021/2/25/2...-be-biggest-in-utahs-history-legislature

As currently written, HB433’s bonds would pay for several projects, including:

$200 million to double-track sections of FrontRunner, contingent on an agreement between the state and the Utah Transit Authority that UTA would pay $5 million per year for 15 years toward repayment of the bonds. Also included in the bill is a one-time infusion of $100 million to total $300 million toward double-tracking FrontRunner.
$30 million for a Forest Street rail bridge project in Brigham City.
$11 million for a bus rapid transit in the “Salt Lake midvalley area.”
$5 million for an environmental study at Point of the Mountain, or the soon-to-be former site of the Utah State Prison.
$4 million for a Utah Transit Authority and Sharp and Tintic railroad consolidation project, which would connect Sharp and Tintic Railroad corridors within Springville and Spanish Fork.

There is an additional list of road projects at the Deseret News link as well.

[stayinginformed]

Originally Posted by bob rulz

Is it talking about the Mid-Valley Connector? That's definitely one of the BRT lines I would love to see.

Does anybody know where we can find a complete list of projects that are proposed to be funded?

Here is the link to the actual legislation: https://le.utah.gov/~2021/bills/static/HB0433.html

[downtownslcresident]

So does the current bill provide funding for double tracking the entire length of the line? Or just a patchwork of the most important sections?