Stadiums & Arenas of Canada, Part 3 - Page 236

Chadillaccc · #**4701** Posted **Feb 15, 2021, 9:39 PM**

The two will basically be kitty corner to each other separated by the arena's plaza in the block between.

Djeffery · #**4702** Posted **Feb 15, 2021, 10:20 PM**

The arena is supposed to be to the left of the perspective of that picture isn't it?

Chadillaccc · #**4703** Posted **Feb 16, 2021, 12:03 AM**

Yes, one block north of the Saddledome.

Design is being finalized over this next months, renders by April at the latest apparently. Another update from a person on the design team says it will have the best street retail integration of any rink in the league, though that's not a tough feat. Unsure if the accompanying hotel proposal will be released simultaneously.

Anywho, this is the map of East Victoria Park and Stampede Park showing locations. Doesn't show the Green Line subway station that will accompany the arena though.

Prairiedawg · #**4704** Posted **Feb 16, 2021, 3:20 AM**

I could be completely out to lunch on this but I thought the Green Line alignment may have had 4th St SE Station shifted from 12th Ave to just north of 10th Ave SE with the tunnel entrance to downtown at about 3rd St SE.

Chadillaccc · #**4705** Posted **Feb 16, 2021, 3:25 AM**

Nah. That's the old alignment. The photo is from 2019, back when 4 Street Station was at grade and north of 10th. The new alignment is subway under 11th with entrances on both 4th and 5th Streets.

Prairiedawg · #**4706** Posted **Feb 16, 2021, 3:33 AM**

that's cool, thanks for clarifying.
The Green line has had a lot of revisions, it's hard to know what it's latest reiteration is

steve61 · #**4707** Posted **Feb 17, 2021, 7:12 PM**

So has there been any word on when the designs for the new Calgary Event Centre might get released to the public?

TimB09 · #**4708** Posted **Feb 17, 2021, 7:35 PM**

Still wish they had killed two birds with one stone and built a new stadium for the Stamps as well.

MalcolmTucker · #**4709** Posted **Feb 17, 2021, 7:59 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by TimB09

Still wish they had killed two birds with one stone and built a new stadium for the Stamps as well.

That would have certainly been a situation of "why build one when you can build two for twice the price".

JHikka · #**4710** Posted **Feb 17, 2021, 8:02 PM**

The failed Calgary 2026 bid didn't even propose a new stadium, did it? IIRC they were going to use McMahon for opening and closing. Surely the ROI on an arena outweighs that of a stadium of that size.

ZeDgE · #**4711** Posted **Feb 17, 2021, 9:02 PM**

A new multi use stadium was in the old west village proposal. The renderings were hideous though, looked like an over grown rec centre with stands.

HomeInMyShoes · #**4712** Posted **Feb 17, 2021, 9:04 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by JHikka

The failed Calgary 2026 bid didn't even propose a new stadium, did it? IIRC they were going to use McMahon for opening and closing. Surely the ROI on an arena outweighs that of a stadium of that size.

Maybe Calgary could buy ours and move it 700km West? It's pretty much new with the box and unused at present.

wave46 · #**4713** Posted **Feb 17, 2021, 9:11 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by JHikka

The failed Calgary 2026 bid didn't even propose a new stadium, did it? IIRC they were going to use McMahon for opening and closing. Surely the ROI on an arena outweighs that of a stadium of that size.

Without a doubt.

A new football stadium is about the most underutilized, costly piece of infrastructure one can think of simply due to the capacity needed for football games.

There's about 10 football games per season and a rare number of concerts that require that capacity. You might get an Olympics or Pan Am games every couple of generations. Since multipurpose stadiums are no longer a thing, they don't really even lend themselves to baseball.

If it's an open roof stadium, you lose a third to a half the year in Canada.

An arena can be used year round. If you have an NHL franchise, you're looking at ~40 games per season. If you manage to get an NBA franchise, there's another 40 games. You can fill our the remaining dates for concerts and events year round. There's a reason why arenas in big cities were privately built.

MalcolmTucker · #**4714** Posted **Feb 17, 2021, 9:25 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by wave46

Without a doubt.

A new football stadium is about the most underutilized, costly piece of infrastructure one can think of simply due to the capacity needed for football games.

There's about 10 football games per season and a rare number of concerts that require that capacity. You might get an Olympics or Pan Am games every couple of generations. Since multipurpose stadiums are no longer a thing, they don't really even lend themselves to baseball.

If it's an open roof stadium, you lose a third to a half the year in Canada.

An arena can be used year round. If you have an NHL franchise, you're looking at ~40 games per season. If you manage to get an NBA franchise, there's another 40 games. You can fill our the remaining dates for concerts and events year round. There's a reason why arenas in big cities were privately built.

So, there were a couple of things. The city was/is planning on building an enclosed 5-10,000 track and field stadium, a 'field house'. This was part of the Olympic bid to use it for curling.
The concept was, if you are spending $250 million on an enclosed 10,000 seat stadium, why not go further and spend $450 million on a 20,000 or 30,000 seat stadium.

wave46 · #**4715** Posted **Feb 17, 2021, 9:33 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by MalcolmTucker

So, there were a couple of things. The city was/is planning on building an enclosed 5-10,000 track and field stadium, a 'field house'. This was part of the Olympic bid to use it for curling.
The concept was, if you are spending $250 million on an enclosed 10,000 seat stadium, why not go further and spend $450 million on a 20,000 or 30,000 seat stadium.

The return on investment still sucks compared to an arena of ~20,000, though. You get a much less useful asset that generates less revenue and is used much less.

Since the Olympic bid is dead in the water, I'm surprised the city is still planning to build anything outside of the arena they promised the Flames.

esquire · #**4716** Posted **Feb 17, 2021, 9:49 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZeDgE

A new multi use stadium was in the old west village proposal. The renderings were hideous though, looked like an over grown rec centre with stands.

The rendering really did just make it look like a giant university field house that happened to have a surface big enough for a football field. If Calgary is going to build a stadium for pro sports, it should be done right.

MalcolmTucker · #**4717** Posted **Feb 17, 2021, 10:05 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by wave46

The return on investment still sucks compared to an arena of ~20,000, though. You get a much less useful asset that generates less revenue and is used much less.

Since the Olympic bid is dead in the water, I'm surprised the city is still planning to build anything outside of the arena they promised the Flames.

A few of the projects from the Olympic Bid budget envelope are going forward. The field house (long planned), the expanded convention centre (long mused), the flames arena (long mused). Most of the Olympic Capital budget really, maybe 4/5ths or so except for the athletes villages.

thurmas · #**4718** Posted **Feb 18, 2021, 3:35 AM**

i am amazed looking just now at how many stadiums for soccer and rugby the UK has yet Canada takes forever to build any at all. Just look at this list here Darlington arena built for just 18 million pounds in 2003 seats 25500, cardiff city stadium seats 33280 and only cost 48 million pounds in 2009 and we can't have Halifax or Quebec city build a CFL stadium?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Darlington_Arena

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cardiff_City_Stadium

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...om_by_capacity

Dalreg · #**4719** Posted **Feb 18, 2021, 7:18 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by thurmas

i am amazed looking just now at how many stadiums for soccer and rugby the UK has yet Canada takes forever to build any at all. Just look at this list here Darlington arena built for just 18 million pounds in 2003 seats 25500, cardiff city stadium seats 33280 and only cost 48 million pounds in 2009 and we can't have Halifax or Quebec city build a CFL stadium?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Darlington_Arena

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cardiff_City_Stadium

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...om_by_capacity

Comparing apples to oranges. Building a soccer stadium in England is different to building a football stadium in Canada.

jonny24 · #**4720** Posted **Feb 18, 2021, 1:25 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by thurmas

i am amazed looking just now at how many stadiums for soccer and rugby the UK has yet Canada takes forever to build any at all. Just look at this list here Darlington arena built for just 18 million pounds in 2003 seats 25500, cardiff city stadium seats 33280 and only cost 48 million pounds in 2009 and we can't have Halifax or Quebec city build a CFL stadium?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Darlington_Arena

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cardiff_City_Stadium

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...om_by_capacity

Now compare indoor hockey arenas.

The Canada equivalent of the UK having a soccer stadium of a few thousand in every town, and being real good at building them, is the fact that just about every town with more than two traffic lights has an arena, and is the standard focal point for a "community center" here.