Winnipeg Construction X

[LilZebra]

I'm happy that they went beyond pothole repair and actually reconstructed most of Corydon in the past 2 years.

Great job.

Now that that's done, time to FIX Stafford St. in like manner.

[rrskylar]

Originally Posted by trueviking

I'm not sure how I feel about putting homeless people in shipping containers.

Our provincial govt. saw fit to spend $17.9 M (yes million) on shipping containers to facilitate visits at personal care homes, once all are vaccinated they should be able to get a couple cents on the dollar for them!

[plrh]

Originally Posted by LilZebra

I'm happy that they went beyond pothole repair and actually reconstructed most of Corydon in the past 2 years.

Great job.

Now that that's done, time to FIX Stafford St. in like manner.

I have mixed feelings about that. Corydon from Brock to Cambridge was in fine shape, there were a lot of worse streets than that. But I guess in terms of continuity, why would they exclude an 8 block stretch when the rest of the street is getting done? As long as an administrator and not a politician made the decision, I can live with it. I am looking forward to next year's phase being done, Taylor.

[H2man]

I think it’s fair to desire roads above third world country condition in addition to the progressive/sustainable stuff. How the budget is divvied up between these two categories is discussion-worthy, but it shouldn’t be either/or.

[blueandgoldguy]

Off-topic in this thread, but the people giving testimonials in those Siloam Mission radio ads on 1290 - how the shelter provided a place of comfort, nutrition and warmth, assisted in turning around their lives - are voice actors or are they actually homeless/formerly homeless people?

Dumb question I guess. I suspect they are voice actors.

[esquire]

Originally Posted by blueandgoldguy

Off-topic in this thread, but the people giving testimonials in those Siloam Mission radio ads on 1290 - how the shelter provided a place of comfort, nutrition and warmth, assisted in turning around their lives - are voice actors or are they actually homeless/formerly homeless people?

Dumb question I guess. I suspect they are voice actors.

I strongly suspect they buy canned campaign materials designed for shelters.

At one point I'm pretty sure a similar shelter in Edmonton used the same materials that Siloam did.

It makes sense in some respects... the pitch is basically the same regardless of whether you're in Fredericton or Saskatoon, buying a proven ad campaign off the shelf probably saves you a few bucks vs. creating your own.

Other industries do this too... I've heard the "cuts the mustard" car dealer jingle in other cities (it was associated with Parkside Ford locally).

[trueviking]

Originally Posted by H2man

I think it’s fair to desire roads above third world country condition in addition to the progressive/sustainable stuff. How the budget is divvied up between these two categories is discussion-worthy, but it shouldn’t be either/or.

When you are spending $150-million a year to fill potholes, it kind of is either/or everything else. The money bag is only so deep and it is one of the biggest ticket items.

The only real solution is to build fewer roads. Every property taxpayer today is paying to maintain 50% more road than their parents were. For some reason we don’t seem interested in changing that. So. You either raise taxes, accept that there will be potholes, or you cut far more important things and use that money to fill those potholes with. We have chosen the third option. And then the potholes come back again next spring because we live in the sub-Arctic.

Personally I think our roads are in no worse condition than other Canadian cities. It’s a bit of a (sub)urban legend.

I see no justification for suddenly adding $50-million to the potholes budget, particularly in the face of so much other uncertainty and cuts. We should have just kept it at 2019 levels ($100m) and spent the other $50 on more important priorities. The potholes will always be there. They are no different last year than this year. People just need to get over it. Quality of life should be our priority.

[Jeff]

^^^ 100% agree. I used the AT paths like crazy this summer and with the new connected sections like the bridge over Pembina at Jubilee it certainly upped my quality of life instead of bitching about a few bumpy roads. The roads are in just as shitty condition in Toronto and Vancouver.

[Wigglez]

Originally Posted by H2man

I think it’s fair to desire roads above third world country condition in addition to the progressive/sustainable stuff. How the budget is divvied up between these two categories is discussion-worthy, but it shouldn’t be either/or.

I'd recommend going to a 'third world country' and drive around for a bit. If you think Winnipeg's roads are bad... Just wait...

Note: make sure its not a country with highways built/supported by China so they can better exploit and export their natural resources to China.

[rrskylar]

Originally Posted by Wigglez

I'd recommend going to a 'third world country' and drive around for a bit. If you think Winnipeg's roads are bad... Just wait...

Note: make sure its not a country with highways built/supported by China so they can better exploit and export their natural resources to China.

Off topic I know, but how is what China is doing right now in Africa any better than the colonization of Africa by Europeans centuries ago? Certain African countries are basically owned by China right now!

[GreyGarden]

Quality of life should absolutely be our priority. Our interprovincial migration numbers are still terrible. And it seems to be getting worse. Despite what some say, its not just about jobs, young educated people with choices leave partly because of quality of life.

Our roads are fine.

[H2man]

Originally Posted by trueviking

When you are spending $150-million a year to fill potholes, it kind of is either/or everything else. The money bag is only so deep and it is one of the biggest ticket items.

The only real solution is to build fewer roads. Every property taxpayer today is paying to maintain 50% more road than their parents were. For some reason we don’t seem interested in changing that. So. You either raise taxes, accept that there will be potholes, or you cut far more important things and use that money to fill those potholes with. We have chosen the third option. And then the potholes come back again next spring because we live in the sub-Arctic.

Personally I think our roads are in no worse condition than other Canadian cities. It’s a bit of a (sub)urban legend.

I see no justification for suddenly adding $50-million to the potholes budget, particularly in the face of so much other uncertainty and cuts. We should have just kept it at 2019 levels ($100m) and spent the other $50 on more important priorities. The potholes will always be there. They are no different last year than this year. People just need to get over it. Quality of life should be our priority.

I would rather just pay higher taxes and get both, but that’s just me.

Are potholes as bad in North Dakota, Minnesota or eastern Montana? That’s something I have noticed but it’s anecdotal. Is that also just suburban legend?

[plrh]

I would say the roads in North Dakota are in a similar condition as the ones here. With the exception of the Interstates. But just driving down some local collector is nearly identical. Maybe they have more modern geometry, but actually pavement condition is the same.

[Winnipegger]

Originally Posted by trueviking

When you are spending $150-million a year to fill potholes, it kind of is either/or everything else. The money bag is only so deep and it is one of the biggest ticket items.

The only real solution is to build fewer roads. Every property taxpayer today is paying to maintain 50% more road than their parents were. For some reason we don’t seem interested in changing that. So. You either raise taxes, accept that there will be potholes, or you cut far more important things and use that money to fill those potholes with. We have chosen the third option. And then the potholes come back again next spring because we live in the sub-Arctic.

Personally I think our roads are in no worse condition than other Canadian cities. It’s a bit of a (sub)urban legend.

I see no justification for suddenly adding $50-million to the potholes budget, particularly in the face of so much other uncertainty and cuts. We should have just kept it at 2019 levels ($100m) and spent the other $50 on more important priorities. The potholes will always be there. They are no different last year than this year. People just need to get over it. Quality of life should be our priority.

To be absolutely clear, despite what most people seem to think, in recent years Winnipeg's massive local and regional street renewal budget has significantly improved the conditions of our roads. In fact, according to the Municipal Benchmarking Network in Canada, based on engineering assessments Winnipeg had the second highest percentage of roads that were in good or very good condition, at 71% of the network. This puts us in second place, behind Thunder Bay. Source on page 185 of this PDF.

People who still complain about potholes and the state of our roads have clearly never been to other Canadian cities and have no frame of reference. The whole "fix the potholes!" mentality in this city is rooted in the 2000s and early 2010s when mayors slashed the roads budget in order to freeze and decrease property taxes. It's taken about 7 years to undo the failures of past elected officials on this particular portfolio.

[pspeid]

Originally Posted by Winnipegger

To be absolutely clear, despite what most people seem to think, in recent years Winnipeg's massive local and regional street renewal budget has significantly improved the conditions of our roads. In fact, according to the Municipal Benchmarking Network in Canada, based on engineering assessments Winnipeg had the second highest percentage of roads that were in good or very good condition, at 71% of the network. This puts us in second place, behind Thunder Bay. Source on page 185 of this PDF.

People who still complain about potholes and the state of our roads have clearly never been to other Canadian cities and have no frame of reference. The whole "fix the potholes!" mentality in this city is rooted in the 2000s and early 2010s when mayors slashed the roads budget in order to freeze and decrease property taxes. It's taken about 7 years to undo the failures of past elected officials on this particular portfolio.

Excellent points thanks for bringing these up. I'm kind of surprised municipal agencies haven't pointed this out to take a little credit for civic improvements.

As far as the public perception goes, people like to be outraged at their perceptions of roads (or buses or panhandlers or whatever). When something has become "common knowledge", look out, perceptions never seems to change.

[Winnipegger]

Originally Posted by pspeid

Excellent points thanks for bringing these up. I'm kind of surprised municipal agencies haven't pointed this out to take a little credit for civic improvements.

As far as the public perception goes, people like to be outraged at their perceptions of roads (or buses or panhandlers or whatever). When something has become "common knowledge", look out, perceptions never seems to change.

Thanks! And yeah, I agree that there are often a lot of local success stories on public or private entities changing things for the better here, but it often falls on deaf ears because Winnipeggers have a tendency to always think we are the worst at everything, regardless of what the actual truth is. If you ever take a look at the city's budget documents, they are filled with comparable metrics such as fire response time, road conditions, snow clearing costs, etc., that show just how well our city does with so few resources. But nobody wants to spend time combing through 300 pages of numbers, and even fewer are keen on reporting positive aspects about our city.

[buzzg]

Ten years ago we had some pretty prominent busy roads in very rough shape, specifically Pembina was awful forever. That just isn't the case anymore. It's rare to see a busy road littered with potholes anymore. If some residential streets aren't perfect, who cares – natural speed bumps.

[OTA in Winnipeg]

^St. James was voted the worst street in the city for multiple years in a row. Smith street in front of the Marlborough was almost a cow trail it was so bad. Nice to have them done now.

[pspeid]

Originally Posted by Winnipegger

Thanks! And yeah, I agree that there are often a lot of local success stories on public or private entities changing things for the better here, but it often falls on deaf ears because Winnipeggers have a tendency to always think we are the worst at everything, regardless of what the actual truth is. If you ever take a look at the city's budget documents, they are filled with comparable metrics such as fire response time, road conditions, snow clearing costs, etc., that show just how well our city does with so few resources. But nobody wants to spend time combing through 300 pages of numbers, and even fewer are keen on reporting positive aspects about our city.

Good news also (apparently) makes for a lousy local news story. It could just be me, but it seems there are a few local news writers who I feel make a living out of stoking outrage over how "terrible" things are here and how "great" they are somewhere else.

[zalf]

Originally Posted by pspeid

Good news also (apparently) makes for a lousy local news story. It could just be me, but it seems there are a few local news writers who I feel make a living out of stoking outrage over how "terrible" things are here and how "great" they are somewhere else.

It's also hard to think about infrastructure, in the broad sense, when it's working well. Someone could drive all week on smooth roads, then hit one pothole and now "the roads are shit!"

No one thinks about roads until they strike a pothole. No pays any attention to plumbing until the toilet backs up. No one appreciates public health until there's a pandemic.