Salt Lake City: Official Development News Thread - Part 5

[Orlando]

Originally Posted by Layrasm

I was hoping it got scrapped, but doesn’t sound like the case. It’s mediocre to say the least, on prime real estate, could have been something special.

Especially along State Street leading up to the capitol, with Kensington and 95 S, another skyscraper would have created a nice “tunnel” feel.

What? Are you out of your mind? Scrapped?! A tall tower on that site is not needed, nor does it fall into the city's urban form code/zoning or something?, where taller towers are to be located on the corners of blocks. This project is sandwiched between two 13-story office towers, and does so much for the street interaction and the through-block connections. The colors and material are fresh for Salt Lake City, and create a vibrant urban feel. The Strand was nice, but the way these two buildings are formed make it primarily about creating a through-block, which we need to see more and more of at these mid-block sites.

[bob rulz]

I agree with Orlando. A ton of height isn't needed there. I actually really like the proposal, even with the height decrease. It looks very engaging at the street level.

Not sold on this Ice House development. As Marvland said, that area needs more street engagement. I really hope our planning commission starts enforcing street-level retail requirements and facade lengths more strictly.

[Atlas]

I think we can all agree that the current 255 S State design, reduced height or not, is better than a massive hole in the ground.

I like that it has a nice mid-block connection that prominently features the Cramer House. I do wish both towers were about 6-8 stories taller though.

[RC14]

I will admit that I find the current 255 S State proposal underwhelming. I wish it was taller. However I do agree that the mid-block connection and street engagement are home runs.

[mattreedah]

Originally Posted by Orlando

What? Are you out of your mind? Scrapped?! A tall tower on that site is not needed, nor does it fall into the city's urban form code/zoning or something?, where taller towers are to be located on the corners of blocks. This project is sandwiched between two 13-story office towers, and does so much for the street interaction and the through-block connections. The colors and material are fresh for Salt Lake City, and create a vibrant urban feel. The Strand was nice, but the way these two buildings are formed make it primarily about creating a through-block, which we need to see more and more of at these mid-block sites.

Agreed x10. The posters here OFTEN let perfect be the enemy of good.

[RC14]

Taken just over an hour ago:

650 Main in background and 6th and Main in foreground


Seven02 in background to the left

[Blah_Amazing]

.

[mattreedah]

Originally Posted by Blah_Amazing

I'm actually shocked all of you have somehow managed to twist yourselves into these particular opinions.

Acting like this would be gone if we built taller is completely untrue! Could the midblock have been improved in that proposal? Sure! Is the current project "perfect," as mattreedah put it? NO!

Um, my point is that just because 225 S State isn’t perfect doesn’t mean it should be rejected. It’s a cool project. If you don’t think 10-12 story buildings are worthy of this forum then I don’t know what to tell you other than I disagree.

I guess we can stop discussing decent probable-to-happen developments in favor of speculating on 400+ towers. That would be so boring. Other than the new legit tower proposal once every year or two, the forum would essentially just be (1) how dumb Utah is for not doing 500+ foot towers, (2) how much Lehi sucks because now no one wants to build towers downtown, and (3) how much Mormons suck for not wanting to live downtown in towers.

The mid-block, mid-rise stuff that actually gets built keeps this forum somewhat positive and keeps us from tearing each other apart.

[Viperlord]

Broken Promises — Historic Utah Theatre donated to a developer with an affordable housing promise. Impossible, now claims developer

The developer of the old theatre building made questionable donations to the mayoral race

https://utahstories.com/2020/11/broken-p...promise-impossible-now-claims-developer/

[Blah_Amazing]

.

[Blah_Amazing]

.

[Atlas]

Originally Posted by Viperlord

Broken Promises — Historic Utah Theatre donated to a developer with an affordable housing promise. Impossible, now claims developer

The developer of the old theatre building made questionable donations to the mayoral race

https://utahstories.com/2020/11/broken-p...promise-impossible-now-claims-developer/

Regardless of the content of the article, which seemed to be a rather one-sided treatment of the issue to me, that is a blatantly dishonest (or ignorant) use of that first photo which is not, in fact, the interior of the Utah Theatre.

Also, I'm not sure where the "Impossible, now claims developer" in the title comes in. When did the developer say there would no longer be affordable housing in the project? As far as I know, the deal is still that they have to include 10% affordable units and preserve elements of the theater.

[Comrade]

Originally Posted by Layrasm

I was hoping it got scrapped, but doesn’t sound like the case. It’s mediocre to say the least, on prime real estate, could have been something special.

Especially along State Street leading up to the capitol, with Kensington and 95 S, another skyscraper would have created a nice “tunnel” feel.

Agreed. I said as much during its initial unveiling. Not only was the original version fairly mediocre, the downsized version is even more so. Very disappointed with that development. At this point, I wish they had just rehabbed the older, historic buildings on that site instead of tearing 'em down.

[Orlando]

Wow. Unbelievable. This is a great asset for the city to open that block up. I guess the design aesthetic is not your cup of tea, but from my perspective, as an architect, this white and gray aesthetic is the freshest in style design trend going on these days.

[allh]

https://twitter.com/olymasic/status/1336181118953918464?s=10

Just saw this on twitter and was wondering if anyone else has seen this. The streets looked way more packed with people then, but why?

[Orlando]

Blah Amazing,
If we were to talk just about high-rises on here, it would be very quiet and boring on here. We had separate threads for some of the towers, but consensus from the members was to consolidate the threads. So, any discussion of any kind of developments in Salt Lake City are posted here. High-rise, mid-rise, and low-rise, except houses, are posted here. Viperlord is the moderator and he can clarify if you need further clarification.

[Stenar]

Originally Posted by Atlas

Regardless of the content of the article, which seemed to be a rather one-sided treatment of the issue to me, that is a blatantly dishonest (or ignorant) use of that first photo which is not, in fact, the interior of the Utah Theatre....

It's the Tacoma Pantages Theatre, which is almost identical. The group trying to save the theatre used it on their site to show what SLC's theatre could look like, but the caption in this article is wrong. There was probably just some confusion, not dishonesty.

[Stenar]

The Strand design was hideous and made the mid-block connection an afterthought. I'm glad it wasn't chosen.

I wish the current proposal hadn't changed its design, though.

I don't agree with the planning department saying the food hall should have an entrance right on State St. The original design entices people to use the mid-block walkway.

[bob rulz]

Blah_Amazing, with all due respect, but I am not here only to talk about towers. I am here to talk about the development of Salt Lake City. Of course I'm thrilled when tall towers are proposed, but I'm not here to complain about all of the buildings not getting enough height.

I actually agree with you that the city should scrap its "tall towers on corners" design standards. Mid-block towers can and should be something that can be done. But 1) to say that we are losing out on locations for tall towers is absurd. Salt Lake City still has tons of underutilized land downtown. And 2) just because the new tallest is proposed down the street doesn't mean that has to be a tall skyscraper. Are you saying that other cities don't have mid-rise towers in proximity to their tallest?

Mid-rise buildings are still very important for urban development and building the urban fabric of a city. The more mid-rise developments you get, the greater the chances of seeing taller towers in the future. The city is reaching what I consider to be a maturation phase - we're transitioning into being a major city. That involves denser development at all levels - not just high rises.

Yes, I am a champion of mid-rise development. I am also a champion of high-rise development. Those two ideas are not mutually exclusive but, in fact, are done in tandem.

There is more to building a vibrant city than just building skyscrapers. There are cities with tons of skyscrapers and absolute crap street life and urban design, and there are cities that feature hardly any skyscrapers but are very vibrant and lively. I know this website is called skyscraperpage, but I think we've long since set the precedent that this is a general development and urbanist discussion page, not just a skyscraper page.

[Orlando]

Regarding the corners, I don't think the City strictly requires it. Obviously, they allowed for the Pantages Theater Tower approval. But, what makes a strong urban corner? a short tower, or taller tower? Would it have been better if they had 99West to be only 20 stories and Tower 2 located midblock on 1st south to be 30 plus stories? CCRI obliged the city and made the changes, but I'm sure the City wouldn't stop CCRI if they were adamant about going with their original plan. 222 Main is the tallest tower on that block and it's not on the corner, but the City allowed it. They are reasonable. There is a desired urban form, which is ideal, and is mostly a guideline. To me, it looks much better to have the taller towers on the corner, but I also don't think it has to be always followed. 99 West is a great example of having taller towers on the corner. 95 State, 111 Main, & One Utah Center are all good examples of the taller towers on corners. Same also with The two Gateway towers on the South Temple & Main St. Those two towers do a great job of framing a gateway at the north end of Main Street.