CHICAGO | St. Regis Chicago (Vista) | 1,191 FT | 101 FLOORS

[sentinel]

Originally Posted by pilsenarch

The blow-through floor was simply the result of a mistake. It had nothing to do with increasing the width of he building on a few of the floors.

The team published this nonsense to try to cover up their huge mistake. The design did change to reduce the changes in SF in the floors, but that was a direct result of the shit show the condo floor plans are even now... it's not easy to design the same floor plan for a unit that changes 3 to 4 feet across its entire exterior walls without some very awkward and bizarre consequences...

the developer did not force an increase in some of the condo plans (which did not change bedroom/bath counts at all) only to sacrifice some of the most prime SF in the entire project at the blow through and reduce the number of units to be sold...

the a/e team just realized way too late that the shear strength of the building was inadequate... wouldn't be the first time this has happened with a high profile skyscraper... (google the john hancock building in Boston and the citicorp tower in NYC)

How do you do know this information? Were you directly involved in the development? Were you part of the development team?

[pilsenarch]

^direct access to the CD team

[ChiTownWonder]

Originally Posted by pilsenarch

^direct access to the CD team

Well that's disappointing then. Still I think the blow through is the least hideous discrepancy in the design.

[sentinel]

Originally Posted by pilsenarch

^direct access to the CD team

So you're saying bKL, who is the architect of record (not Studio Gang), messed up the design during CDs, and that the information released about that was a cover-up, is that correct?

[pilsenarch]

^bKL is not responsible for either the design or the engineering...

[sentinel]

Originally Posted by pilsenarch

^bKL is not responsible for either the design or the engineering...

You are spreading blatant misinformation: bKL is the Architect of Record.

"Consultant Team

bKL Architecture, architect of record

Gensler, hotel architect

HBA, interior architect

Magnusson Klemencic Associates, structural engineer

dbHMS, MEP design assist

Mackie Consultants, civil engineer

OLIN, landscape architect

CDC, facade consultant"

The above is taken directly from Studio Gang's website:
https://studiogang.com/project/vista-tower

As AOR, they are directly responsible for the design and engineering of a building.

A design team with the experience of the firms listed above does not simply make 'a huge mistake', nor would they cover up something as massive as requiring a blow-through floor. I firmly believe Occam's razor, in that the changes were Owner-directed, which required the design team to come up with the solution of the blow-through floor. If this was truly a mistake on the part of the design team, they would have been fired a long time ago, regardless of whatever relationship Magellan has with bKL or Studio Gang. Clients, owners change their minds A LOT, even during construction; it is their prerogative, especially if they feel it would improve a project, and assuming they have the money to do so.

Nearly 20 years ago, I had just completed grad school and was hired by a firm during CA phase of a large educational building at UC. The Dean of the college didn't like the orientation of the suite of admin offices, as he wanted to have a view of the students entering the building from the second floor where the offices were located, so the decision was made to rotate over 10,000 sq ft of office space by 90 degress(!!!) to accommodate the Owner's request. This was after a construction permit was issued for the project, and during framing of the steel structure. The university gave their blessing because the Dean of this particular department held a lot influence, so they were willing to shell out millions to change everything, which entailed: coordinated civil/architectural/structural/MEPFP/landscape drawings, additional permit submission to reflect the design change, multiple change order to account for the fact that the steel framing was already up, not to mention required additional structural support to cantilever the offices in the desired, new orientation. IIRC it was between $8-10 million in combined change orders so that the Dean could be happy. All Owner-directed, and the design team willingly obliged.

Architects, engineers are professional, licensed consultants, all understand fully how little margin of error there is on projects even for small change orders, let alone massive alterations such as a blow-through floor.

[rlw777]

Originally Posted by sentinel

As AOR, they are directly responsible for the design and engineering of a building.

When the AOR is not also the design architect it generally means they provide construction documents and administration services based on the designs from the design architect. The design is the responsibility of the design architect not the Architect of Record. Neither is the engineering. I might add that this is an especially common arrangement (having a local AoR) when the design architect is from a different city or country.

[sentinel]

Originally Posted by rlw777

When the AOR is not also the design architect it generally means they provide construction documents and administration services based on the designs from the design architect. The design is the responsibility of the design architect not the Architect of Record. Neither is the engineering. I might add that this is an especially common arrangement (having a local AoR) when the design architect is from a different city or country.

The AOR is responsible for all consultants under their agreement and their work, whether engineers or design architect. My comment was in direct response to the previous poster saying that bKL was not involved in the design or engineering.
In some instances, there are separate prime agreements between the Owner and design architect, AOR and EORs, but that is not typical for large projects where coordination between consultants is critical to project delivery, such as this.

[ivi237]

Pics for the underpass to the riverwalk. Haven't seen any work done in the last few days. Looks like they are ready to open this part when everything else opens.

[sentinel]

^Holy crap!! That looks really fantastic.

[Skyguy_7]

^ Very nice indeed. I love the lighting around the columns.

[cozy]

woah!! looks awesome

[HomrQT]

From these photos that entranceway looks like a bus terminal...

I wonder if it will feel nicer seeing it in person.

And I was under the impression it was the city who caught the mistake and mandated a blow through floor.

[dropdeaded209]

yeah i dunno about "really fantastic" or "really nice"... maybe "passable" or "functional" ... all that grey and the low, wide proportions contributes to a feeling of compression and sterility IMHO... a little color wouldn't have killed anyone... hard to tell from photos but here's hoping it's leans more futuristic-sleek than hospital waste disposal alley!

[sentinel]

Well, they had to do something to provide an underpass for a nearly 1,200 tall tower above, so not sure what people think would have looked better

It's clean, simple, with ample lighting, I think it works well.

Incredible to think this is how it was before construction began:
https://www.google.com/maps/@41.8873...7i13312!8i6656

[jpIllInoIs]

Originally Posted by sentinel

Well, they had to do something to provide an underpass for a nearly 1,200 tall tower above, so not sure what people think would have looked better

It's clean, simple, with ample lighting, I think it works well.

Incredible to think this is how it was before construction began:
https://www.google.com/maps/@41.8873...7i13312!8i6656

I don't understand any of the criticisms. Looks like a bus terminal? This is a functional roadway, not a revenue producing space. I've seen it in person and it has clean lines with super lighting and a feel of entering a significant space. It provides pedestrian, bicycle, ride share access and egress linking 2 immediate greenspaces and really 4 spaces counting Maggie Daley and the Lakefront.
It will not be a waste disposal alley since it provides entryways into the Vista building on the lower levels. The 2nd lower level will be garbage service as in all of the LakeshoreEast development.

[sentinel]

^^I agree.

[vexxed82]

I think it looks cool for what amounts to a passageway. I'm curious how it will age. The longer I photograph, the more I become curious about how materials seem to decay.

Take Navy Pier for instance. If you've been on that formerly-new wave wall/grand staircase, it looks cool from far, but up close it's already decrepit. The glass walls are hazy, streaky, and dirty. The wood treads are worn, and the steel slats that make up the wall/under the stairs are a trap for massive spider webs, leaves, and trash.

I think if this space stays clean and bright, it'll be quite nice, but I do worry a bit about what sort of crud may worm its way into the seams of the slats. Thankfully, most of this space isn't totally exposed to the elements so I think they should hold up well, but time will tell.

Relatedly, the older I get, and the quicker time seems to pass, the faster things seem to age. I remember when Millennium Park felt brand spanking news, and now, I can see signs of aging everywhere. I know nothing lasts forever, but when it comes to material selection and design, how much consideration is given to how long something will look "good." And how long should things look new?

Another example is the "new" Rush Hospital. At once it was a gleaming white edifice, but you can already see some staining. Even worse, the older wing next door is stained and discolored.

McCormick Place is yet another. How much of this is dirt that can be cleaned vs. actual facade damage that can't be reversed.

[Skyguy_7]

^Dear AORs,

When looking for timelessness, please go with limestone and black granite or marble!

[the urban politician]

Originally Posted by ivi237

Pics for the underpass to the riverwalk. Haven't seen any work done in the last few days. Looks like they are ready to open this part when everything else opens.

I like it!

My biggest concern was that it wouldn't be well lit, but it is and I think that will make it feel safe and inviting, even at night.

Once this goddamn pandemic is over, we are definitely going to visit this when we come into the city