O-Train Line 2/4 [Stage 2 | Greenboro to Limebank/Airport] | In Service - Page 106

Catenary · #**2101** Posted **Oct 3, 2020, 6:02 PM**

I am glad they moved to having a longer bride instead of the short bridge with a box culvert for the MUP that was originally proposed. That would have put the MUP in effectively a tunnel and been a safety and security downgrade.

Hybrid247 · #**2102** Posted **Oct 3, 2020, 7:30 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lightspotting

Geo Ottawa shows that the Trillium line will be double tracked at this area, I just figured this was a temporary arrangement unless something has changed?

I don't think we can count on the GeoOttawa map being an accurate depiction of what the final configuration will be for double-tracked sections. I've noticed some discrepancies since the start of Stage 2 construction. For instance, the bridge over Lester Road is shown as double-tracked on GeoOttawa, but it seems they're only building a single-tracked bridge.

OCCheetos · #**2103** Posted **Oct 3, 2020, 9:01 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hybrid247

I don't think we can count on the GeoOttawa map being an accurate depiction of what the final configuration will be for double-tracked sections. I've noticed some discrepancies since the start of Stage 2 construction. For instance, the bridge over Lester Road is shown as double-tracked on GeoOttawa, but it seems they're only building a single-tracked bridge.

It was confirmed by the Stage 2 team that the data on GeoOttawa is not TNEXT's alignment but rather the "suggested" alignment, but I don't think there are technically discrepancies in either of these cases.

It's been repeated several times now in FEDCO meetings that double tracking would go as far as Beech Street (under the 417), and that happens to be what is shown on GeoOttawa.

As for Lester, the second track isn't actually part of the "alignment". Any time there's a line in the RIO layer without those ticks along it, it isn't actual rail that is part of the project, but rather some future/unrelated track. There have been plenty of other examples of this across the city.

Originally, the "proposed" solution was a single track grade-separated crossing for the Trillium Line, and an at-grade freight crossing, but if I'm not mistaken TNEXT opted to build a grade-separated freight crossing(?)

So while I guess showing the at-grade crossing might be a discrepancy, the single-track bridge is not. The main discrepancies as far as I know are with the layout of Bowesville + the crossover track there, as well as all of Limebank.

Hybrid247 · #**2104** Posted **Oct 4, 2020, 2:58 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by OCCheetos

It was confirmed by the Stage 2 team that the data on GeoOttawa is not TNEXT's alignment but rather the "suggested" alignment, but I don't think there are technically discrepancies in either of these cases.

It's been repeated several times now in FEDCO meetings that double tracking would go as far as Beech Street (under the 417), and that happens to be what is shown on GeoOttawa.

As for Lester, the second track isn't actually part of the "alignment". Any time there's a line in the RIO layer without those ticks along it, it isn't actual rail that is part of the project, but rather some future/unrelated track. There have been plenty of other examples of this across the city.

Originally, the "proposed" solution was a single track grade-separated crossing for the Trillium Line, and an at-grade freight crossing, but if I'm not mistaken TNEXT opted to build a grade-separated freight crossing(?)

So while I guess showing the at-grade crossing might be a discrepancy, the single-track bridge is not. The main discrepancies as far as I know are with the layout of Bowesville + the crossover track there, as well as all of Limebank.

That makes sense. Last time I drove by the Lester crossing, there was a single-track bridge with a grade crossing directly adjacent to it, so it would seem they opted to keep the at-grade freight crossing.

TheMatth69 · #**2105** Posted **Oct 4, 2020, 3:08 AM**

Went over at South Keys last Thrusday to check over the construction of the station, foundation works are still ongoing:

J.OT13 · #**2106** Posted **Oct 5, 2020, 1:13 PM**

Some work at Bayview.

https://twitter.com/rail613/status/1312816277090697217

Gladstone.

https://twitter.com/rail613/status/1312823710018154503

OCCheetos · #**2107** Posted **Oct 9, 2020, 5:47 PM**

There are photos of Gladstone (and the area) being regularly posted on the Railfans discord.

Of note: Pomerleau seems to be setting up to begin the actual construction of Gladstone station.

Guideway work (or maybe pedestrian overpass work?) seems to be starting near Bayview as well.

J.OT13 · #**2108** Posted **Oct 10, 2020, 12:29 PM**

Carleton University:

https://twitter.com/deellisd/status/1314708731586842624

TheMatth69 · #**2109** Posted **Oct 10, 2020, 2:13 PM**

Are we keeping wood ties on the upgraded/extended Trillium Line or are we switching for concrete ties ? Don't think that has been mentioned anywhere ?

OCCheetos · #**2110** Posted **Oct 10, 2020, 3:11 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheMatth69

Are we keeping wood ties on the upgraded/extended Trillium Line or are we switching for concrete ties ? Don't think that has been mentioned anywhere ?

I don't think anyone really knows right now. There's no requirement for concrete ties in the PA, but I do remember one of the "selling" points of TNEXT was that they were moving $100 million of long term maintenance-related work into the initial project so maybe that would include ties?

I was actually wondering this yesterday since it seems like they're currently in the process of lifting all of the remaining track between Gladstone and Bayview. I can't think of any other reason to do that other than to work on the track bed or ties.

PHrenetic · #**2111** Posted **Oct 10, 2020, 7:53 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by OCCheetos

I don't think anyone really knows right now. There's no requirement for concrete ties in the PA, but I do remember one of the "selling" points of TNEXT was that they were moving $100 million of long term maintenance-related work into the initial project so maybe that would include ties?

I was actually wondering this yesterday since it seems like they're currently in the process of lifting all of the remaining track between Gladstone and Bayview. I can't think of any other reason to do that other than to work on the track bed or ties.

Good Day.

Yep. And I recall reading somewhere in an official release that they were going to examine all the ties, remove the bad or questionable ones,
and have the remaining 'good' ones re-certified for use (whatever that implies). (I cannot recall where I read it.)

As for lifting that stretch of rail, I believe that it is the 'oldest' stretch of both rail / ties and comms / signals cabling (renewed tho it was),
and that it is far easier to replace it all by lifting, replacing the cabling / runs, electronics boxes, and signals, and re-laying the ties / rail.

And, finally, for that stretch, I believe that there is some re-alignment to be done to finally straighten out some now unnecessary curves and reduce some grade change percents.
At least I hope so.

All around easier to lift and re-lay. FWIW.

EnJoy!

OCCheetos · #**2112** Posted **Oct 10, 2020, 11:37 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by PHrenetic

Good Day.

Yep. And I recall reading somewhere in an official release that they were going to examine all the ties, remove the bad or questionable ones,
and have the remaining 'good' ones re-certified for use (whatever that implies). (I cannot recall where I read it.)

As for lifting that stretch of rail, I believe that it is the 'oldest' stretch of both rail / ties and comms / signals cabling (renewed tho it was),
and that it is far easier to replace it all by lifting, replacing the cabling / runs, electronics boxes, and signals, and re-laying the ties / rail.

And, finally, for that stretch, I believe that there is some re-alignment to be done to finally straighten out some now unnecessary curves and reduce some grade change percents.
At least I hope so.

All around easier to lift and re-lay. FWIW.

EnJoy!

Yes, I believe they're straightening the curve going into Bayview. More interestingly though is that they're lifting the Gladstone passing tracks, even after they had left them in place a few months ago when they cut the rails.

PHrenetic · #**2113** Posted **Oct 11, 2020, 3:19 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by OCCheetos

Yes, I believe they're straightening the curve going into Bayview. More interestingly though is that they're lifting the Gladstone passing tracks, even after they had left them in place a few months ago when they cut the rails.

Good Day.

Yeah, I think that had more to do with the probability that TNext was not really ready to lift the rails yet
but had to lift that section fast so that MTO was able to get on with doing the 417 - T-Line bridge which they were totally ready to do.
So they popped it, covered the bed in ground-tex, and let MTO go.
I think TNext got the Gladstone station excavation started early so as to use the rubble for trench fill for the 417 bridge move.
Then TNext could come back to the rest when the excavation for Gladstone was finished, and the 417 was cleaned up,
so as to then proceed with the whole railbed in one swell foop.

IMHO.

J.OT13 · #**2114** Posted **Oct 12, 2020, 1:37 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by PHrenetic

Good Day.

Yep. And I recall reading somewhere in an official release that they were going to examine all the ties, remove the bad or questionable ones,
and have the remaining 'good' ones re-certified for use (whatever that implies). (I cannot recall where I read it.)

As for lifting that stretch of rail, I believe that it is the 'oldest' stretch of both rail / ties and comms / signals cabling (renewed tho it was),
and that it is far easier to replace it all by lifting, replacing the cabling / runs, electronics boxes, and signals, and re-laying the ties / rail.

And, finally, for that stretch, I believe that there is some re-alignment to be done to finally straighten out some now unnecessary curves and reduce some grade change percents.
At least I hope so.

All around easier to lift and re-lay. FWIW.

EnJoy!

I remember this as well. For the old ties that would be salvaged for "other parts of the project", they mentioned Walkley Yard as an example.

For the Carleton image I posted, I find it strange that they are leaving the rails in place while demolishing the underpass underneath. I feel like it would be easier and cheaper to remove the rails an put them back in once the underpass has been re-built.

OCCheetos · #**2115** Posted **Oct 12, 2020, 6:34 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by J.OT13

I remember this as well. For the old ties that would be salvaged for "other parts of the project", they mentioned Walkley Yard as an example.

For the Carleton image I posted, I find it strange that they are leaving the rails in place while demolishing the underpass underneath. I feel like it would be easier and cheaper to remove the rails an put them back in once the underpass has been re-built.

I don't think those are rails, just some I-beams to support the utilities while they excavate the area. The same thing they're doing at South Keys.

The rails were removed earlier this year. Here's mid-July for instance:

PHrenetic · #**2116** Posted **Oct 12, 2020, 10:59 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by OCCheetos

I don't think those are rails, just some I-beams to support the utilities while they excavate the area. The same thing they're doing at South Keys.

The rails were removed earlier this year. Here's mid-July for instance:

Good Day.

Yep - that is exactly what is happening. The technique is common in all areas of construction - comms lines or bunkers, or gas mains, or water mains,
that are being undercut for work on water mains or sewers in road rebuilds, or LRT stations (Rideau), or CSST access shafts, etc., all get slung from supporting I-beams.
That is what the yellow straps are that you see in the Carleton U. photos. And if they underestimate the weight or span of those slung lines, the consequences can be *awkward* !
Sewers are commonly not slung - they get cut, and the flow is piped and pumped around the sides of the construction, or re-routed entirely, for the duration of the open pit or trench.

EnJoy!