Heavy Rail, Commuter Rail, & Intercity Transportation - Page 122

chowhou · #**2421** Posted **Aug 20, 2020, 9:20 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by CivicBlues

What a surprise, instead of solutions the NDP government offers up more studies!

The last time a transportation project was implemented as a "solution" without "studies" was the fast ferries. It pays to do something right instead of rubber stamp possible mistakes.

Bdawe · #**2422** Posted **Aug 21, 2020, 2:22 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by chowhou

The last time a transportation project was implemented as a "solution" without "studies" was the fast ferries. It pays to do something right instead of rubber stamp possible mistakes.

What should be going on is that BC TRansit should have the capabilities to analyze this sort of thing in-house, rather than farming it out to a 'study'

twoNeurons · #**2423** Posted **Sep 16, 2020, 2:41 PM**

The next study perhaps will be Maglev to Seattle.

Vancouver to Seattle, in 20 minutes. ( No, I'm not serious... but I am looking forward to 2027!! )

• Video Link

trofirhen · #**2424** Posted **Sep 17, 2020, 2:50 AM**

I also love the idea of a MAGLEV train between Vancouver and Seattle. And yes, it would give great profile to the two principal cities of Cascadia.
However, being realistic for a moment (and I hate to rain on someone's parade) ... such a concept, even for year 2027 seems, at the present time, somehow unreasistic.
What I could see, as an "icebeaker" to get the project moving, would be a HrSR train, either with powerful diesel engines like the Amtrak Southwest Chief, or the LRT VIA train.
If something is put in place (and I think would also require raibed upgrade, big time) then the public mind will have crossed that hurdle and will theoretically strive for something better.

https://www.seat61.com/images/Canada-via-train1.jpg

VancouverOfTheFuture · #**2425** Posted **Sep 17, 2020, 3:06 AM**

there wont be MagLev between the 2 cities anytime in the near future. especially not with this virus thing expected to be ongoing for the next 3yrs.

chowhou · #**2426** Posted **Sep 17, 2020, 4:58 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by VancouverOfTheFuture

there wont be MagLev between the 2 cities anytime in the near future. especially not with this virus thing expected to be ongoing for the next 3yrs.

Actually, one thing I've been wondering is if rail travel will become more appealing to people who don't want to be kept in an aircraft squeezed in with others.

jollyburger · #**2427** Posted **Sep 17, 2020, 5:01 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by chowhou

Actually, one thing I've been wondering is if rail travel will become more appealing to people who don't want to be kept in an aircraft squeezed in with others.

How is it any better?

Migrant_Coconut · #**2428** Posted **Sep 17, 2020, 5:06 AM**

More space per seat, for one. Given previous experience with flying coach, I'd argue that in this particular commute, legroom and a proper table is well worth losing an extra 45 minutes of your life.

trofirhen · #**2429** Posted **Sep 17, 2020, 8:16 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Migrant_Coconut

More space per seat, for one. Given previous experience with flying coach, I'd argue that in this particular commute, legroom and a proper table is well worth losing an extra 45 minutes of your life.

Yes, and in addition, you are counting actual travel time here, and getting to the airport and boarding a plane is a lengthier procedure than travelling downtown to downtown.
Between neighbouring cities, (and this is true for Paris and London, as well) rail is a much more time-effective option. I woild suggest that HSR to Seattle be made a priority. It would work.

mellowyellow · #**2430** Posted **Sep 17, 2020, 9:35 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by trofirhen

Yes, and in addition, you are counting actual travel time here, and getting to the airport and boarding a plane is a lengthier procedure than travelling downtown to downtown.
Between neighbouring cities, (and this is true for Paris and London, as well) rail is a much more time-effective option. I woild suggest that HSR to Seattle be made a priority. It would work.

The problem is that BC John Horgan seems to prefer the ultra high speed rail to stop at Surrey Central (as opposed to Vancouver pacific central or waterfront). Sigh! Downtown-to-downtown would be a dream come true.

The cascadia ultra high speed rail 2020 study will come out in December so we got that to look forward to: https://wsdot.wa.gov/planning/studies/ultra-high-speed-travel/ground-transportation-study

trofirhen · #**2431** Posted **Sep 17, 2020, 10:07 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by mellowyellow

The problem is that BC John Horgan seems to prefer the ultra high speed rail to stop at Surrey Central (as opposed to Vancouver pacific central or waterfront). Sigh! Downtown-to-downtown would be a dream come true.

The cascadia ultra high speed rail 2020 study will come out in December so we got that to look forward to: https://wsdot.wa.gov/planning/studies/ultra-high-speed-travel/ground-transportation-study

It is possible that Mr. Horgan can be convinced of a non'stop downtown to downtown. Hope for the best ;=)

Migrant_Coconut · #**2432** Posted **Sep 17, 2020, 11:28 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by mellowyellow

The problem is that BC John Horgan seems to prefer the ultra high speed rail to stop at Surrey Central (as opposed to Vancouver pacific central or waterfront). Sigh! Downtown-to-downtown would be a dream come true.

The cascadia ultra high speed rail 2020 study will come out in December so we got that to look forward to: https://wsdot.wa.gov/planning/studies/ultra-high-speed-travel/ground-transportation-study

Keep in mind that BC's share of the HSR will be around the $5 billion mark or more. Given that a route into Vancouver itself would probably have to be tunneled for just as many billions, maybe we settle for Surrey Central right now and provide space for a downtown extension a few decades later.

scryer · #**2433** Posted **Sep 18, 2020, 3:01 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Migrant_Coconut

Keep in mind that BC's share of the HSR will be around the $5 billion mark or more. Given that a route into Vancouver itself would probably have to be tunneled for just as many billions, maybe we settle for Surrey Central right now and provide space for a downtown extension a few decades later.

Wait does the 5 billion include the tunneling or am I missing something?

Migrant_Coconut · #**2434** Posted **Sep 18, 2020, 9:30 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by scryer

Wait does the 5 billion include the tunneling or am I missing something?

IIRC Washington State came up with $42 billion as a highball. We can either split that per distance or per state/province; if the latter, that's $14 billion.

casper · #**2435** Posted **Sep 19, 2020, 5:59 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Migrant_Coconut

IIRC Washington State came up with $42 billion as a highball. We can either split that per distance or per state/province; if the latter, that's $14 billion.

IF this is built it is very likely to part of a post COVID stimulus to kick start the economy and create jobs. Under those conditions it should be proportional to distance in each country.

Ideal situation would be for BC Rail (and they still do exist) to own the track from the station up to the US boarder. Building the right of way upto the boarder and any stations in Canada should be BC contribution.

aberdeen5698 · #**2436** Posted **Sep 20, 2020, 2:57 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by casper

IF this is built it is very likely to part of a post COVID stimulus to kick start the economy and create jobs.

By the time this gets built COVID will be a distant memory. There are so many projects with far bigger benefits for far more people that the money could be used for.

Tvisforme · #**2437** Posted **Oct 6, 2020, 7:41 AM**

From Vancouver Urbanized:

Quote:

60-minute train: High-speed rail proposal linking Whistler, Vancouver, and Fraser Valley
Kenneth Chan (5 October 2020)

Imagine performing an end-to-end trip between Whistler and Chilliwack, and the destinations in between, within an hour on a regional high-speed rail line reaching up to 300 km/hr.

That is the connectivity vision for Mountain Valley Express (MVX) by a new local advocacy group comprised of academics and urban planners, who believe such an infrastructure investment — linking the Sea to Sky Corridor, Metro Vancouver, and the Fraser Valley — will provide a lasting economic engine and a “leaner, greener restart” for BC after COVID-19.

The line will mainly follow existing transportation corridors including the Sea to Sky Highway and Trans-Canada Highway, using dedicated rail tracks to enable fast travel speeds.

There will be a total of 11 stations at major destinations and transfer points to other modes of public transit, including stations for Squamish, Horseshoe Bay, North Vancouver, Waterfront Station in downtown Vancouver, Commercial-Broadway Station in East Vancouver, Lougheed Town Centre Station in Burnaby, Surrey City Centre, Langley, and Abbotsford.

The proposed travel times could revolutionize how the region gets around, with travel times of 31 minutes between Whistler and Waterfront Station, seven minutes between Waterfront Station and Lougheed Town Centre Station, and 10 minutes between Waterfront Station and Surrey City Centre. It would provide an additional option for local trips — a relief line for SkyTrain, especially for the Expo Line which is expected to reach capacity necessitating major upgrades over the coming decades.

The end-to-end travel times between the terminus stations is 59 minutes, which is up to 80% faster than the driving time between Whistler and Chilliwack.

(article continues)

The group proposing this line is "Mountain Valley Express" and they estimate construction costs to be between 7 and 16 billion dollars. The group acknowledges that extensive engineering analysis would be required to stabilize cost estimates. Their emphasis is on the costs savings between this line and an equivalent expansion of highway capacity.

Their estimates include a travel time of four minutes from Horseshoe Bay to North Vancouver. Whether they've factored in the political cost of proposing that infrastructure capable of supporting this being built across West Vancouver remains to be seen.

Migrant_Coconut · #**2438** Posted **Oct 6, 2020, 8:19 AM**

Okay, so now the interurban to Abby and Chilliwack is the second nuttiest train pitch in the Lower Mainland.

nname · #**2439** Posted **Oct 6, 2020, 8:22 AM**

Do they realized how long it takes for HSR to accelerate and decelerate?

To me, the only believable part of the time estimate is the Whistler to Horseshoe Bay segment. With all the stations and curves shown on the map, I would say 95-120min end-to-end for local train would be a more reasonable estimate.

Take a look at Shinkansen, or any HSR timetable. Try to find a travel time of 8min or less between any two station....

Unless their 59min meant running empty trains non-stop from Whistler to Chilliwack... and that might be doable. Stopping at the intermediate or not, the trains are going to be almost empty anyways...

trofirhen · #**2440** Posted **Oct 6, 2020, 10:52 AM**

This is a totally unfeasible, off the wall, "nutty" rail line pitch ..... IF ... it is considered as HSR.
Most of the route, especially through West Vancouver on north, would have to be tunneled much of the way to take out the curves, and banked to allow for high speeds. ($$$$ !!)
However, as a more conventional rail route, this could be better seen as a conventional commuter route with two halves; a northern leg from Whistler to North Van, and a needed Valley leg.
In fact, given the existing trackage, it might be well to consider this as a backbone for what one day may become regional commuter rail Vancouver style, full of tunnels and curves.