West Gatineau Tramway & Downtown Loop | Proposed

[J.OT13]

Originally Posted by OtrainUser

I meant that Gatineau is being greedy by expecting Ottawa let it use their street and denying ottawa taxpayers from using their cars on it even though they paid for it.

Like come on that is being very unreasonable dont you think?

The City of Ottawa has done absolutely nothing to advance the interprovincial transit file (other than buy a bridge 15+ years ago, one that has been left decaying since). Our politicians at City Hall have been sitting on their asses ordering Gatineau to come up with something. Whenever Gatineau makes a proposal, Ottawa City Hall criticizes without offering other solutions.

I'd say Ottawa is being greedy.

[caboose]

Originally Posted by J.OT13

The City of Ottawa has done absolutely nothing to advance the interprovincial transit file (other than buy a bridge 15+ years ago, one that has been left decaying since). Our politicians at City Hall have been sitting on their asses ordering Gatineau to come up with something. Whenever Gatineau makes a proposal, Ottawa City Hall criticizes without offering other solutions.

I'd say Ottawa is being greedy.

I would tend to agree with J.OT13. But it is deeper than that. It's rooted in the linguistic and cultural divide in Canada. English Ottawa resents having French Gatineau residents invading their city, and any proposals to bring more traffic are met with challenges. Never overtly discriminatory, but always "no" to proposals from the Deschenes Bridge, the Champlain Third Lane, the Kettle Island Bridge, the Kanata-Aylmer Bridge, the damn truck traffic on King Edward, Bayview Station capacity etc. This project will suffer the same fate - there will be no trams from Gatineau in Ottawa, not on Wellington, not under Sparks not across the POW bridge...

[Truenorth00]

Originally Posted by J.OT13

I'd say Ottawa is being greedy.

I'd say Ottawa is watching the interests of its taxpayers. Which is the obligation that Ottawa politicians have. An unfortunate consequence of the lack of regional governance.

[Acajack]

Regarding greediness and Ottawans being able to "enjoy" driving down the Wellington St. they've paid for... I've never had the impression that street was that important a through route for Ottawa motorists. It does lead to the SJAM but if I am going there from downtown I'd go down Albert or some other street more to the south, and then up Kent or Bay. I would avoid most of Wellington.

Wellington seems like more of a commuter route for Gatineau motorists and transit riders. (Which is in itself a problem of course.)

But not so much for Ottawans.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by Truenorth00

I'd say Ottawa is watching the interests of its taxpayers. Which is the obligation that Ottawa politicians have. An unfortunate consequence of the lack of regional governance.

Fair enough, though the lack of openness or support for any new crossing solution leads to a cut-your-nose-off-to-spite-your-face situation. As in the King Edward-Rideau-Waller mess which has arguably destroyed part of the heart of the city.

[caboose]

Originally Posted by Acajack

Regarding greediness and Ottawans being able to "enjoy" driving down the Wellington St. they've paid for... I've never had the impression that street was that important a through route for Ottawa motorists. It does lead to the SJAM but if I am going there from downtown I'd go down Albert or some other street more to the south, and then up Kent or Bay. I would avoid most of Wellington.

Wellington seems like more of a commuter route for Gatineau motorists and transit riders. (Which is in itself a problem of course.)

But not so much for Ottawans.

Us vs. them = no Gatineau Tram crossing to Ottawa.

[The Conductor]

Originally Posted by Truenorth00

I'd say Ottawa is watching the interests of its taxpayers. Which is the obligation that Ottawa politicians have. An unfortunate consequence of the lack of regional governance.

For what is in fact be the first time, and most likely last time I find myself in complete agreement with you. We NEED a regional governance plan. Furthermore I would go a step further and insist that all rail discussion and bus discussions be brought into a single entity.

[caboose]

Originally Posted by Acajack

Fair enough, though the lack of openness or support for any new crossing solution leads to a cut-your-nose-off-to-spite-your-face situation. As in the King Edward-Rideau-Waller mess which has arguably destroyed part of the heart of the city.

It will continue because there would be no new crossing of the river and no truck tunnel.

[Truenorth00]

Originally Posted by Acajack

Fair enough, though the lack of openness or support for any new crossing solution leads to a cut-your-nose-off-to-spite-your-face situation. As in the King Edward-Rideau-Waller mess which has arguably destroyed part of the heart of the city.

To be clear, I'm not condoning it in any way. I'm just saying, you can't suggest some nefarious intent where it's just a simple reality of conflicting interests. We already have enough conspiracy theorists in the room pushing uninformed tosh.....

I'm not all that worried. The Feds will show up with a giant cheque and make the tunnel happen. Providing they can get the ball rolling before the Liberals leave....

[The Conductor]

The Wakefield line should never have been allowed to fall apart in the manner that it did after the flood.

It would have been perfect for getting people in and out of Wakefield and all of the communities between.

Instead we had special interest groups demanding the tracks be torn out and and now we have to start from ground zero AGAIN at additional costs...

We need to protect our rails!

[Truenorth00]

Originally Posted by The Conductor

The Wakefield line should never have been allowed to fall apart in the manner that it did after the flood.

Why didn't you mail them a cheque for the repair costs?

Originally Posted by The Conductor

It would have been perfect for getting people in and out of Wakefield and all of the communities between.

Another one of your "modest" ideas on somebody else's dime. I'd be surprised if Wakefield a decade ago could fill a coach bus into downtown. How about we stop facilitating and subsidizing further sprawl?

Originally Posted by The Conductor

Instead we had special interest groups demanding the tracks be torn out

Damn those special interest bicyclists with their tight shorts and chiseled calves!

[The Conductor]

Originally Posted by caboose

It will continue because there would be no new crossing of the river and no truck tunnel.

You might be right!

[zzptichka]

Originally Posted by The Conductor

The Wakefield line should never have been allowed to fall apart in the manner that it did after the flood.

It would have been perfect for getting people in and out of Wakefield and all of the communities between.

Instead we had special interest groups demanding the tracks be torn out and and now we have to start from ground zero AGAIN at additional costs...

We need to protect our rails!

Just like with Bank street subway fantasy, there is no ridership to justify any of this. There are hundreds of better uses for transit money in the Capital Region.

[caboose]

Originally Posted by zzptichka

Just like with Bank street subway fantasy, there is no ridership to justify any of this. There are hundreds of better uses for transit money in the Capital Region.

Like building a skytrain through the fields of Kanata and Stittsville, or building 3 Trillium Line stations in the middle of fields with no population around?

[zzptichka]

Originally Posted by caboose

Like building a skytrain through the fields of Kanata and Stittsville, or building 3 Trillium Line stations in the middle of fields with no population around?

Pretty much. They only thing that justifies them is that they are part of a bigger project.

[Uhuniau]

Originally Posted by Acajack

Wellington seems like more of a commuter route for Gatineau motorists and transit riders. (Which is in itself a problem of course.)

But not so much for Ottawans.

It was a local transit route for central Ottawans until it was replaced by the Queen Street mess.

[Truenorth00]

Originally Posted by Uhuniau

It was a local transit route for central Ottawans until it was replaced by the Queen Street mess.

It was one of several corridors. It's not like some bus routes didn't jog down to Albert/Slater.

And getting the Gatineau LRT under Sparks, will open up options to move OC Transpo routes back to Wellington, if so desired.

[Aylmer]

A surface Wellington option could easily be made in such a way as to also accommodate OC buses, giving them a traffic-free way to get from Rideau to Bank. And should the City decide to go the route of surface rail on Bank and/or Rideau, the major infrastructure hurdle will have already been accomplished for them at no cost.

These are the kinds of opportunities that Ottawa fails to seize when it's too busy cutting off its nose to spite its neighbour.

[Truenorth00]

Originally Posted by Aylmer

These are the kinds of opportunities that Ottawa fails to seize when it's too busy cutting off its nose to spite its neighbour.

I'm curious where this viewpoint comes from. Didn't Gatineau say they preferred the tunnel?

[Aylmer]

Originally Posted by Truenorth00

I'm curious where this viewpoint comes from. Didn't Gatineau say they preferred the tunnel?

From what I hear, the tunnel was only added in at Ottawa's insistence. In any case, Gatineau hasn't taken a position.