Canada's 'housing bubble' deemed close to bursting

[misher]

Originally Posted by whatnext

You'd be tempted to think this was the plot for the next Crazy Rich Asians movie, but no, it is an article from the South China Morning Post documenting yet another shady Vancouver real estate story. So bizarre, it is well worth reading the entire article:

The goddess: a Vancouver Valentine of love, lawsuits, mansions and millionaires
A Chinese tycoon gave Peipei Li US$13 million and bigamously wed her in Las Vegas; four weeks later, another man knelt before Li to promise love and a Ferrari
Li is now involved in a mountain of litigation with the men, but she says one tricked her into an illegal marriage and the other was a — harasser
Ian Young in Vancouver
Published: 5:30am, 14 Feb, 2020

Peipei Li was born, appropriately enough, on Valentine’s Day.
And Luhua Rao told her he loved her just days after they met in Vancouver.
Within a few months the Chinese tech tycoon was wearing an ill-fitting suit and marrying Li in a Las Vegas casino chapel, having already handed over a Tiffany diamond ring and C$17.65 million (US$13.25 million).
Never mind that he already had a wife and family in China.

Then, less than a month after the April 2016 Vegas wedding, lawyer Dongdong Huang knelt down in front of Li in a crowded Vancouver restaurant. He declared his devotion to the woman he called a goddess – by promising to buy her a Ferrari.

The white-haired advocate hoped the flamboyant vow would take his relationship with Li to a “new level”. He says he showered her and her family with gifts and cash worth about C$1.4 million, depleting most of his life’s savings...

...Court documents in a mountain of litigation involving Li depict extraordinary scenes from the courtship rituals of Vancouver’s moneyed Chinese community, against a backdrop of the city’s high-stakes real estate investment scene.

Although the financial dispute between Li and Rao remains unresolved, Li has won a series of prominent Canadian court judgments against him, with millions on the line.

But court documents obtained by the South China Morning Post now show Huang claiming he too believed he was in a romantic relationship with Li at the same time as Rao that cost him a seven-figure sum.

The documents in Huang’s case were only recently unsealed after a request by his estranged wife.

After the two lovestruck men pledged fortunes to Li and the company she set up, she shopped for Vancouver mansions worth millions of dollars, set up a real estate investment office in a downtown skyscraper and bought a Rolls-Royce Ghost costing almost C$500,000...

...Nine days later, Rao signed an agreement to transfer C$20 million to the company in exchange for 50 per cent of its shares, Li owning the other half, documents show. Li contributed C$1,000 to the enterprise, and was its sole director.

Li’s decision to settle on real estate for the business venture was hardly surprising. At the start of her romance with Rao, Vancouver was experiencing a spectacular property boom, with detached house prices up by about 50 per cent in the previous two years, fuelled by a flood of Chinese capital as the country’s rich sought safe havens around the world.

Li had had a front-row seat to the easy fortunes being made, and SunCom was involved in some of the wildest speculative deals of the time. In one set of transactions, a consortium organised by SunCom paid C$60 million for a downtown site valued at just C$16 million – before flipping it to a Chinese investor a month later for C$68 million...

https://www.scmp.com/news/china/soci...s-mansions-and

You realize in CRA they are Singaporean right?

But yeah old man is stupid over young woman, its a story as old as time. I feel bad for the 2nd guy as he appears to have been honest.

[cabotp]

Originally Posted by misher

I feel that it needs to be pointed out that despite all the taxes and the stress test put in by the Liberals and NDP, housing in BC isn't any more affordable. All we've done is screw our luxury housing market so that we receive less tax revenue and economic benefit. I know to many thats what matters though, that we screw the rich. Not that those mansions were paying large tax dollars. I think this more than anything proves that you can't tax your way towards affordability. If we had taken a half billion dollars of the taxes we were getting and used that money towards affordable rentals besides transit, we would have done so much more to help the middle class in Vancouver. Cities have also lost billions of dollars (total) in development funding from development fees which has partially led to large rises in property taxes. The BC NDP is no where near its goal of 114,000 units of housing in 10 years having only completed 4300 in two years with 7700 in progress and 11000 in planning.





https://www.theglobeandmail.com/canada/b...ndp-aim-to-make-housing-more-affordable/

BC NDP improving affordability by making Vancouver less affordable.

The stress test was never meant to make housing more affordable. It was created to stop the average person from over leveraging themselves.

[misher]

Originally Posted by cabotp

The stress test was never meant to make housing more affordable. It was created to stop the average person from over leveraging themselves.

Yes but it did have the effect of slowing the market and lowering prices across Canada temporarily until people got used to it.

[dleung]

Originally Posted by misher

You realize in CRA they are Singaporean right?

But yeah old man is stupid over young woman, its a story as old as time. I feel bad for the 2nd guy as he appears to have been honest.

Rich people being stupid with their money is a long-proven way to fire up the internet.

[Truenorth00]

Originally Posted by cabotp

The stress test was never meant to make housing more affordable. It was created to stop the average person from over leveraging themselves.

It was created to protect the banks and the taxpayer in a country where the government backs a ton of mortgage bonds.

OSFI's primary duty is to stabilize the banks and protect the taxpayer. Not to lower housing prices.

[casper]

Originally Posted by Truenorth00

It was created to protect the banks and the taxpayer in a country where the government backs a ton of mortgage bonds.

OSFI's primary duty is to stabilize the banks and protect the taxpayer. Not to lower housing prices.

No one is going to protest in the streets that we need better protection for big banks. However in this case it is good for all of us. The US banking crisis is a good example of what happens if you don't have this. The value of property falls, construction jobs dry up, people are evicted and homes sit empty in foreclosure. Very bad things happen when the banks get in trouble.

[misher]

Vancouver's housing crisis continues to simmer (with no solution or help in sight) and its office/commercial crisis is coming soon. I suspect (and hope) Vancouverites won't be stupid enough to blame money laundering foreign office buyers for leaving spaces vacant and will instead work to increase supply and reduce development delays. We are building a lot more but we're absorbing more than we build. Retail will likely take a hit with the coronavirus and large increases in property tax rates (to help affordability!).

Suburbs provide alternative space and have not seen the same lease rate rise but I suspect as downtown fills up we will see the lease rates skyrocket in suburbs as companies choose alternative office space.

[Truenorth00]

Mortgage rates are going to drop hard. Housing is going to hit new highs.

[vid]

Will the price go down? I'd like to pick up a nice 2 bedroom, 2 bathroom with a driveway within a 5 minute walk of my work for under $200,000.

[misher]

I felt this is a great article because it really emphasizes how greedy people are. Realtors are not to blame for real estate, they are doing a job and you will get good and bad ones. This realtor recommended a pre-sale buy to his hairstylist. The hair stylist bought it for $654,000 and sold it for $106,000 more. The hair stylist then goes on to report the realtor for alleged wrongs from years ago. The realtor make his stylist a lot of money, but the stylist wanted more and was upset that the realtor made a commission off the referral. Seriously can you imagine what kind of — move it is to report someone that makes you money? All home buyers/sellers act innocent but in the end when your talking about $100,000+ in money very very few people are careless. Everyone does their own research and is very careful with what they agree to. The realtor does not trick you into buying/selling and realtors do not force sellers to sell for higher prices. Every single person whose against foreign buyers and hates realtors would sell to a foreign buyer if they offered more money.

On May 16, 2016, the hairstylist sold the property for $760,000.

The price was $106,000 more than the original purchase price of $654,000.

Lau listed the property for sale for $768,000 without proper authorization from his hairstylist.

In January 2015, the complainant entered into a multiple listing contract with another realtor.

On February 17, 2016, the hairstylist made a complaint against Lau before the RECBC.

About a month later, Lau received a payment of $7,324.80 from the developer as his commission for the purchase of the property.

“At no time did Mr. Lau disclose to the Complainant this remuneration,” according to the consent order proposal made by Lau.

https://www.straight.com/news/1364616/re...list-over-30000-cut-vancouver-deal-price

[misher]

CBRE is predicting massive investment in our cities commercial real estate this year.

TORONTO -- CBRE says Canada could see a record-breaking $50 billion worth of investment in commercial real estate this year as macroeconomic tailwinds and immigration policies support the booming sector.

The commercial real estate services firm says the investment would be about $5 billion higher than 2019 and about a billion dollars higher than the record set in 2018.

Heightened interest in the market is also creating challenges, including rising rents and limited office and industrial space, while climate change is creating its own issues.

https://www.ctvnews.ca/business/cbre-pre...mmercial-real-estate-this-year-1.4826780

[theman23]

Originally Posted by misher

I felt this is a great article because it really emphasizes how greedy people are. Realtors are not to blame for real estate, they are doing a job and you will get good and bad ones. This realtor recommended a pre-sale buy to his hairstylist. The hair stylist bought it for $654,000 and sold it for $106,000 more. The hair stylist then goes on to report the realtor for alleged wrongs from years ago. The realtor make his stylist a lot of money, but the stylist wanted more and was upset that the realtor made a commission off the referral. Seriously can you imagine what kind of — move it is to report someone that makes you money? All home buyers/sellers act innocent but in the end when your talking about $100,000+ in money very very few people are careless. Everyone does their own research and is very careful with what they agree to. The realtor does not trick you into buying/selling and realtors do not force sellers to sell for higher prices. Every single person whose against foreign buyers and hates realtors would sell to a foreign buyer if they offered more money.





https://www.straight.com/news/1364616/re...list-over-30000-cut-vancouver-deal-price

So he mislead her into believing she would be rebated 30,000 and didn’t disclose his conflict of interest?
I’m sorry, but what planet are you from where you think this stuff is OK? The guy got a slap on the wrist.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by theman23

So he mislead her into believing she would be rebated 30,000 and didn’t disclose his conflict of interest?
I’m sorry, but what planet are you from where you think this stuff is OK? The guy got a slap on the wrist.

Spewing the — that most/all RE agents spew and actually got caught for it.

[whatnext]

Originally Posted by theman23

So he mislead her into believing she would be rebated 30,000 and didn’t disclose his conflict of interest?
I’m sorry, but what planet are you from where you think this stuff is OK? The guy got a slap on the wrist.

Where does a hairstylist get money for a $600k + condo?

[misher]

Originally Posted by whatnext

Where does a hairstylist get money for a $600k + condo?

Its a cash business. Money laundering is mostly local businesses and individuals doing work without reporting taxes.

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

Spewing the — that most/all RE agents spew and actually got caught for it.

What the hell is wrong with you? He said she'd get a discount of $30,000, there's no way in hell she thought she'd get cash back after buying (what idiot thinks that)? As for —, every single salesman advertises sales. The buyer went in knowing the price and they made 100k. How selfish can you be to blame the realtor for making you money?

Originally Posted by theman23

So he mislead her into believing she would be rebated 30,000 and didn’t disclose his conflict of interest?
I’m sorry, but what planet are you from where you think this stuff is OK? The guy got a slap on the wrist.

Mislead her? She bought a condo for a set price. No one is stupid enough to think the realtor is going to hand them $30k cash after the purchase. No one is that stupid and he wasn't her realtor. He got a commission from the developer for the referral that's it. Just like a promoter that gets commission for bringing people to the club. And again she made 100k. Hardly a loss. What conflict of interest she made money off a tip he gave her. Notice that she rather punish him than let him gain a small reward. Selfish selfish selfish.


I realize that most of you will just scream about greedy realtors but honestly you are selfish jerks.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by misher

Its a cash business. Money laundering is mostly local businesses and individuals doing work without reporting taxes.

LOL calling hair stylists tax cheats while defending the money laundering kings of Canada.

[theman23]

Originally Posted by whatnext

Where does a hairstylist get money for a $600k + condo?

No clue. Maybe from illegitimate means? I don't know, but that's not really what we're discussing.

Originally Posted by misher

Mislead her? She bought a condo for a set price. No one is stupid enough to think the realtor is going to hand them $30k cash after the purchase. No one is that stupid and he wasn't her realtor. He got a commission from the developer for the referral that's it. Just like a promoter that gets commission for bringing people to the club. And again she made 100k. Hardly a loss. What conflict of interest she made money off a tip he gave her. Notice that she rather punish him than let him gain a small reward. Selfish selfish selfish.

Not sure how you know how much she made when you have no idea how much she leveraged herself or what her financial situation was. Anyways, she made $30K less than what she thought she would which isn't exactly chump change.


And also, he was her realtor:

The other realtor and his agency later had to correct a disclosure statement to properly indicate that Lau was the agent of the buyer.

The real estate council of B.C. agrees - hence the penalty.

Originally Posted by misher

realize that most of you will just scream about greedy realtors but honestly you are selfish jerks.

LOL what?
Did I strike a nerve? Are you Cheung Lau?

[lio45]

Originally Posted by vid

Will the price go down? I'd like to pick up a nice 2 bedroom, 2 bathroom with a driveway within a 5 minute walk of my work for under $200,000.

You've got that "grab an energy drink and get to work!" $50,000 house available, if you want. Probably a good deal, now that Thunder Bay rents are starting to be Torontoesque. (Or at least, that's kinda what I've been hearing - from my one TB source, i.e. you)

[misher]

Have always said that people against the "new luxury condos" (because every new condo is luxury these days) are idiots looking to burn the world down and harm us long-term. The new condo of today is the affordable condo/rental of tomorrow as can be seen by these stats. The more we build now, expensive or not, the better our affordability will be in the future. We should not seek to restrict what gets built.

[someone123]

Those stats don't clearly show that at all. There's nothing in that chart that tells you that the current presale stuff will resemble the older building stock once completed. And the resale prices aren't affordable either.

$674 per square foot in New West means $674,000 for a resold 1,000 square foot place in one of the cheapest parts of town. Depending on how you measure it the typical household earns around $80,000-100,000 a year in metro Vancouver; it's about middle of the pack for Canadian cities. Maybe they could swing it but a $674,000 condo is not affordable for a family earning $100,000 a year.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_cities_in_Canada_by_median_household_income