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  #14161  
Old Posted Feb 6, 2020, 4:14 PM
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Originally Posted by lrt's friend View Post
The Rideau issue probably relates to leaking ancient sewers, the sinkhole and the material that was in that location (who knows what was being dumped there in the last 200 years) and the Bywash that crossed Rideau Street exactly where the station is. If you read early news stories before it was filled in, it was an open sewer. They threw everything in there.
Yet another reason why cut and cover would have been better for Rideau station. They could have removed all the sand above the station and replaced it with clean fill.
     
     
  #14162  
Old Posted Feb 6, 2020, 8:14 PM
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Originally Posted by roger1818 View Post
Yet another reason why cut and cover would have been better for Rideau station. They could have removed all the sand above the station and replaced it with clean fill.
I don't think cut and cover was ever an option because of the canal and the trunk sewer underneath it.
     
     
  #14163  
Old Posted Feb 6, 2020, 8:38 PM
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Originally Posted by lrt's friend View Post
The Rideau issue probably relates to leaking ancient sewers, the sinkhole and the material that was in that location (who knows what was being dumped there in the last 200 years) and the Bywash that crossed Rideau Street exactly where the station is. If you read early news stories before it was filled in, it was an open sewer. They threw everything in there.
Bad excuse. Ottawa is a young city, with a history spanning just a few hundred years. Cities that have existed for 1000s of years, where all types of sketchy pollution has happened over the centuries, have subways and tunnels yet they don't have the smell. I can think of Athens, Greece, being one of them - I don't remember their subway being stinky.
     
     
  #14164  
Old Posted Feb 7, 2020, 3:09 AM
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Originally Posted by Radster View Post
Bad excuse. Ottawa is a young city, with a history spanning just a few hundred years. Cities that have existed for 1000s of years, where all types of sketchy pollution has happened over the centuries, have subways and tunnels yet they don't have the smell. I can think of Athens, Greece, being one of them - I don't remember their subway being stinky.
Athens as a modern city isn’t much older than Ottawa. It was a town of 4000 in 1833.
     
     
  #14165  
Old Posted Feb 7, 2020, 3:11 AM
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I don't think cut and cover was ever an option because of the canal and the trunk sewer underneath it.
They could have cut and covered the Rideau Street section, which is where the geology was most problematic.
     
     
  #14166  
Old Posted Feb 7, 2020, 4:19 AM
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They could have cut and covered the Rideau Street section, which is where the geology was most problematic.
How would that be accomplished after diving under the Rideau Canal? That would be one deep cut and cover. I am not sure that would accomplish anything. Seepage would still occur.
     
     
  #14167  
Old Posted Feb 7, 2020, 5:15 AM
TheMatth69 TheMatth69 is offline
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I don't know if some of you guys know french, but this is a very interesting interview from STM's CEO. A lot of subject are being talked about, and especially delays in the metro. Interesting to see how STM seperates Delays in two categories "Service interruptions" and "mechanical failure". Also we're talking about 1000 major /minor delays per year in Montreal. Reflections about platform doors and more trains during rush hour.
They also talk about fair integration with Laval and Longueuil, witch is funny since we have that for years now between STO and OC Transpo despite the Interprovincial border.
All of this to say that all cities face the same problems, we are not alone. Also seems like their trains have door issues as well.
Video Link below:
https://youtu.be/AAg-KrMjmw4

Last edited by TheMatth69; Feb 7, 2020 at 5:30 AM.
     
     
  #14168  
Old Posted Feb 7, 2020, 4:15 PM
OTownandDown OTownandDown is offline
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Originally Posted by Radster View Post
Bad excuse. Ottawa is a young city, with a history spanning just a few hundred years. Cities that have existed for 1000s of years, where all types of sketchy pollution has happened over the centuries, have subways and tunnels yet they don't have the smell. I can think of Athens, Greece, being one of them - I don't remember their subway being stinky.
Remember also that the Confederation Tunnel is passively ventilated, meaning that the suction from the trains ventilates the stations.

Perhaps it's time to buy a nice big fan?
     
     
  #14169  
Old Posted Feb 7, 2020, 4:53 PM
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Perhaps it's time to buy a nice big fan?
They mayor could give it an award for being Ottawa's biggest fan.
     
     
  #14170  
Old Posted Feb 7, 2020, 7:56 PM
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They mayor could give it an award for being Ottawa's biggest fan.
There used to be four big jet engines at the tunnel entrance to St. Laurent. Given the tunnel is just a big long tube, once the air is moving, it shouldn't be a problem. Although it'll be mighty cold in there with active air flow.
     
     
  #14171  
Old Posted Feb 7, 2020, 9:28 PM
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Ken Woods, aka @drivesincircles, is off Twitter. I don't know what led him to that decision, but I'm not going to speculate out of respect.

That's a huge loss.

https://twitter.com/drivesincircles
     
     
  #14172  
Old Posted Feb 7, 2020, 10:00 PM
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Ken Woods, aka @drivesincircles, is off Twitter. I don't know what led him to that decision, but I'm not going to speculate out of respect.

That's a huge loss.

https://twitter.com/drivesincircles
If I had to guess, he was told to stop.
     
     
  #14173  
Old Posted Feb 7, 2020, 10:18 PM
OCCheetos OCCheetos is offline
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Originally Posted by roger1818 View Post
If I had to guess, he was told to stop.
I think it's far more likely that the vast amount of cynicism in local residents got to him. He's obviously always wanted things to work, and when they don't it's upsetting, and then toss in the people who celebrate the failures and it becomes tough to manage.

He had always stated that management was supportive of his presence on Twitter.
     
     
  #14174  
Old Posted Feb 8, 2020, 12:00 AM
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Originally Posted by OCCheetos View Post
I think it's far more likely that the vast amount of cynicism in local residents got to him. He's obviously always wanted things to work, and when they don't it's upsetting, and then toss in the people who celebrate the failures and it becomes tough to manage.

He had always stated that management was supportive of his presence on Twitter.
He did say he was taking February off Twitter. Hopefully we’ll see him back.
     
     
  #14175  
Old Posted Feb 8, 2020, 3:31 AM
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Originally Posted by lrt's friend View Post
How would that be accomplished after diving under the Rideau Canal? That would be one deep cut and cover. I am not sure that would accomplish anything. Seepage would still occur.
You could have the tunnel portal before the canal.

It would have prevented the sinkhole fiasco, and probably this problem as well.

How deep are the Canada Line stations in Vancouver. Those construction sites were quite deep.
     
     
  #14176  
Old Posted Feb 8, 2020, 4:25 AM
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Don't blame stagnant water for smell at Rideau LRT station, says expert

Tom Spears, Ottawa Citizen
Updated: February 7, 2020


Stagnant water is unlikely to cause the foul “rotten eggs” smell that has assailed LRT riders at Rideau Station for more than a week, says an environmental engineer and groundwater expert.

The City of Ottawa and RTG have identified stagnant water as a suspected cause of the sulphur smell. LRT passengers say it is different from the well-known sewage smell centred at Parliament station.

But a prominent hydrology expert from Western University isn’t buying that theory.

“Water at that depth cannot be stagnant. It’s obviously some kind of mix of polluted water or something else coming into this area” and entering the groundwater, said Slobodan Simonovic.

“At that depth the water is mixed with the soil and soil is providing usually positive effects (by) cleaning the water.

“I do not recall reading, hearing, or talking to anyone who would mention something like that (stagnant water deep underground).”

The platform of Rideau is 26.5 metres deep — the deepest of any on the Confederation line.

Deep wells are usually the best sources for clean drinking water, he noted, “because the water in the well is the water that comes through the soil either from precipitation or from a nearby river or stream. Going through the soil, if the path is longer, the water gets cleaner.”

Soil “is basically functioning as a natural filter,” he said.

There are places where natural minerals in the ground mix with water and create the type of water used in spas, Simonovic said. Banff has hot springs with natural sulphur, for instance. But he said he would be “highly suspicious” about the chance that this could happen at Rideau.

“I think that in the urban area there must be some kind of connection with a drainage system” or buried waste.

The normal construction protocol would call for a waterproof exterior on the tunnel “and pretty good drainage around the tunnel is also done to divert water.”

A rotten egg smell is sometimes caused by hydrogen sulphide gas, though this has not been confirmed here by the city. This can come from a natural gas field, where it is called sour gas, and also from rotting organic material. Hydrogen sulphide is heavier than air and tends to collect in underground spaces.

Allan Hubley, who chairs the transit commission, announced Thursday afternoon that tests showed there is no danger from the air quality.

Quote:
Update on the air quality at Rideau Station:
RTG has completed tests of the air quality. There is no risk to our customers or staff. Results have been shared with @ottawahealth and they have expressed no concerns about the preliminary results. 2/2 #ottnews— Allan Hubley (@AllanHubley_23) February 6, 2020
However, riders are still unhappy with what some call an overpowering stench.

Quote:
Of all the complaints about #OttawaLRT the one I'd not have believed a year ago would be: "LRT Stinks! Literally smells bad" 🤦♂️ & I'm sorry, I don't care that the standing water doesn't pose a structural threat to the tunnel, our LRT tunnel/stations/trains shouldn't stink 🙄— (((b McPherson))) a 🚲'ng dad (@muddybike) February 6, 2020
This week a local historian has raised another possibility: What if an ancient drainage ditch — which ran very close to the modern Rideau station — is releasing the smell of ancient waste?

Andrew King traced the course of the ByWash — a ditch, and later an official sewer, winding generally north through the ByWard Market area. An old Ottawa Citizen story called it a “fetid, beer-coloured ditch” that was suspected of spreading cholera. It was covered over to form a sewer in 1872, King said.

“It had dead animals and sewage and swamp water,” King said. Local meat packers threw carcasses into it.

Quote:
This 1845 map of downtown Ottawa shows large swampland which had to be drained. The stagnant swamp water was released through a sluice gate, called the By Wash. Since covered over & forgotten, it coincidentally runs through what is now “RIDEAU STATION” (to the right on map) #TBT pic.twitter.com/KsBJv01xK7— Andrew King (@twitandrewking) February 6, 2020
“So maybe there’s a leftover 1870s sewer that’s full of 🞵🞵🞵🞵 and… it’s leaching” and contaminating the ground near the station.
King is the author of Ottawa Rewind: A Book of Curios and Mysteries.

[email protected]
twitter.com/TomSpears1

https://ottawacitizen.com/news/local-new...-smell-at-rideau-lrt-station-says-expert
     
     
  #14177  
Old Posted Feb 8, 2020, 2:08 PM
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City paid LRT contractor $4.5M despite claims to the contrary
RTM received payment for September, city now confirms


Joanne Chianello · CBC News
Posted: Feb 08, 2020 4:00 AM ET | Last Updated: 5 hours ago


After weeks of declaring it hadn't paid a penny for LRT maintenance since the glitch-plagued Confederation Line launch, it turns out the City of Ottawa did fork over $4.5 million last fall.

The city was "contractually obligated" to pay Rideau Transit Maintenance (RTM) for the month of September, according to Troy Charter, OC Transpo's director of operations. But that's not what city officials have been saying for months.

Following a transit commission meeting on Nov. 6, OC Transpo boss John Manconi told reporters the city would be holding back funds from RTM for "September and then October."

"Also, the mayor told us we're not paying them until this is rectified," Manconi added at the time.

As recently as mid-January, during a news conference about a downed electrical cable, Charter said: "RTM, I don't believe, has received a monthly payment."

But that turned out to be untrue. On Friday, Charter confirmed an invoice for $4,562,000 was paid to RTM in mid- to late-November, adding "they haven't received a penny since then."

RTM, an extension of Rideau Transit Group, the consortium that built the $2.1-billion Confederation Line, is responsible for keeping it in good working order for 30 years, a contract worth $1 billion over its decades-long lifespan.

The city pays RTM month by month, but there are certain performance measures the company needs to meet to be paid in full; for example, the trains must travel a minimum number of kilometres.

Because the Confederation Line has experienced a litany of delays, shortages and service interruptions, the city maintained RTM hadn't been paid since the system opened its doors to the public in mid-September.

But what hasn't been known until now is that the contract compelled the city to pay RTM for that first month, no matter what. Any issues that arise are to result in deductions in subsequent months.

Asked why the city didn't appear to understand this, or at least failed to clearly convey this detail to the public, Charter said: "We have been following all the requirements under the [project agreement] and we're leveraging everything we can to make sure that they are providing that reliable service that our customers expect."

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/city-lrt-rtm-4-5m-september-1.5456093
     
     
  #14178  
Old Posted Feb 8, 2020, 3:36 PM
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Confederation Line problems are not getting better. A number of service interruptions yesterday and again this morning due to power failure at Belfast yard, disabled trains, brake and switch problems.

https://ottawa.ctvnews.ca/another-nightm...s-switch-issues-and-heavy-snow-1.4801695

Quote:
O-Train Line 1: Please be advised that R1 replacement bus service is being implemented from Hurdman to St-Laurent. Please allow extra travel time. We apologize for the inconvenience.
9:28 AM · Feb 8, 2020·OC Transpo Live Updates
Quote:
O-Train Line 1: Replacement bus service now from Blair to St-Laurent and Lyon to Rideau. Please allow extra travel time. We apologize for the inconvenience.
2:42 PM · Feb 7, 2020·OC Transpo Live Updates
Quote:
O-Train Line 1: Please be advised that due to a stopped train, replacement bus service is being implemented from Lyon to Hurdman. Please allow extra travel time. We apologize for the inconvenience. https://octranspo.com/en/alerts/#alerts-24667
1:59 PM · Feb 7, 2020·OC Transpo Live Updates
Quote:
O-Train Line 1: We are now recovering from delays due to an earlier disturbed switch between Blair and Cyrville. Thank you for your patience.
9:36 AM · Feb 7, 2020·OC Transpo Live Updates
Quote:
Ottawa Transit Riders Retweeted
Maddy Eisenberg
@maddyeisenberg
SIX separate issues on #ottawalrt today, and the afternoon commute is still going.

Power outage
+ 3 different switch issues
+ 2 stalled trains

= One nightmare of a commute.

Last edited by lrt's friend; Feb 8, 2020 at 3:48 PM.
     
     
  #14179  
Old Posted Feb 8, 2020, 4:19 PM
MalcolmTucker MalcolmTucker is online now
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I was surprised to see that outdoor switches don’t seem to have natural gas heating. What did they expect? To keep them clear of packed snow and ice requires a lot of heat or someone sitting there cleaning them out.
     
     
  #14180  
Old Posted Feb 8, 2020, 5:07 PM
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Citizen transit commissioner Sarah Wright-Gilbert is now expressing concern that the trains and the rail infrastructure are not adequately designed for this climate and that easy fixes may not solve the problems that we are experiencing. It may be necessary to make expensive improvements.

https://omny.fm/shows/580-cfra/ottawa-now-we-have-disrupted-their-lives-to-a-degr
     
     
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