HomeDiagramsDatabaseMapsForum About
     

Go Back   SkyscraperPage Forum > Regional Sections > Canada > Ontario > Hamilton > Downtown & City of Hamilton


Reply

 
Thread Tools Display Modes
     
     
  #321  
Old Posted Jan 25, 2020, 5:44 PM
Djeffery's Avatar
Djeffery Djeffery is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: London
Posts: 6,085
Quote:
Originally Posted by king10 View Post
Yes the new operators may ask for increased rent, but they cant ask for too much or else they will be left without a main tennant.

With regards to Burlington, yes he said that. Doesnt seem like Burlington has any appetite to spend public dollars on an arena though. Especially with the mayor now being so against the idea of a publically funded ticats stadium as a Councillor 9 years ago. So doubt that goes anywhere. Probably just a negotiating tactic to leverage against Hamilton during the Limeridge debate. But with two new deep pocketed players, Andlaeur lost a lot of leverage.

Some of those comments from 2011

“It’s the costs,” she said, adding residents are concerned about the possible operating costs, capital costs and the lost opportunity cost of losing 10 acres of prime commercial land for a stadium use.

Meed Ward said no one is clamouring for a stadium. Burlingtonians want council to finish its capital projects and keep taxes low.


https://www.thespec.com/news-story/2...ngton-stadium/
I'm sure the appetite is low, as it is anywhere, to spend tax money on sports facilities. But I think her comments are easily brushed aside by comparing a stadium getting used very few days a year for large crowds and other times for next to no crowds, to an arena that will be used many nights a year. And she did say last summer in this Spec article that, while not actively trying to lure the Bulldogs, the city is open for business (based on a lot of "ifs", granted).

https://www.thespec.com/opinion-stor...the-bulldogs-/

Andlauer also isn't interested in waiting a ton of time for Hamilton to figure things out. And to be honest, given Hamilton's OHL history, I don't think there is a big appetite for the city to work with him. Even looking at the comments on this board, the citizens aren't willing to give up their NHL dreams and build a useful OHL arena. Will be interesting to see how deep into his deep pockets he wants to actually dig. I mean, he can probably stroke a check and put his own arena up across the road from FOC if he wanted. But rich people prefer others spend their money for them, so it will be interesting to see what he does if the only option facing him in Hamilton is to still be in an NHL-sized arena, drawing 3800 a game, that he also now has to actually pay real money to be in.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #322  
Old Posted Jan 25, 2020, 6:13 PM
thistleclub thistleclub is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 3,729
Ah, yes. Scott Radley, keeper of the junior hockey flame.

OHL hockey in Burlington?
(Hamilton Spectator, Scott Radley, Jan 20 2015)

A local businessman says the pieces may be falling into place to bring an Ontario Hockey League team to Burlington.

Is he right?

Burlington business owner Tim Wilson says he's aware of an out-of-town buyer with deep pockets — he only knows the man's first name — who likes the city as a hockey market and is interested in bringing a major junior team there.
Meanwhile, he says a local builder he wouldn't name, but knows personally, is ready to begin work on a new 7,500 to 9,000-seat arena, financed entirely with private money….

There's little doubt a new arena that size — and an OHL team occupying it — would have an impact on the Golden Horseshoe entertainment market. Many of the smaller concert offerings that presently perform at FirstOntario Centre might look there instead. And a building that size could be enticing to more than one team.

Back when Paletta threw out his idea four years ago, Hamilton Bulldogs owner Michael Andlauer said if a 9,000-seat arena suddenly opened in this area, he'd at least consider putting his team there. It would certainly be more appropriate for an AHL franchise than where he is now.…

This isn't the first time there's been interest in the market. Even recently.

"About a year ago, we were visited by a gentleman who had plans for an OHL club and an arena," Ward One Coun. Rick Craven says.

The man — who was only identified as a builder — was apparently interested in the land off the 403 by the Aldershot GO station owned by Burlington businessman Angelo Paletta. Craven directed the interested man to the city manager who arranged a meeting with the mayor.

"It didn't go very far," Mayor Rick Golding says, mainly because the man wanted the city to pay for most of the project. And Goldring says he sees
little to no likelihood of Burlington paying for most of a $50-million-or-so arena project any time soon.

Read it in full here.



Municipalities routinely describe themselves as "open for business". As practical positioning, however, it is borderline meaningless, and in this particular case, developers might scoff.

Even aside from the Ticats' stadium canard, Meed Ward has a history of cost-cutting in service of lower taxes. The 2011 Aldershot stadium debate partly hinged on the highest use of employment lands in a city running out of places to site jobs, a concern that the then-councillor identified ("My focus is on ensuring the long term prosperity of Burlington," she said, “including attracting high-paying jobs and investment, and keeping our city finances healthy"). A publicly owned facility of any kind sited on prime employment land displaces private investment and undermines tax base growth. Meed Ward seemed unconvinced by talk of the stadium's promised $1.4B in regional economic activity spin-off from a 60-year-old pro sports franchise, so it's unclear how much more lucrative a five-year-old OHL team with dramatically lower attendance would be perceived.
__________________
"Where architectural imagination is absent, the case is hopeless." - Louis Sullivan

Last edited by thistleclub; Jan 25, 2020 at 7:22 PM.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #323  
Old Posted Jan 25, 2020, 9:21 PM
Berklon's Avatar
Berklon Berklon is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Hamilton
Posts: 3,129
Quote:
Originally Posted by Djeffery View Post
Andlauer also isn't interested in waiting a ton of time for Hamilton to figure things out. And to be honest, given Hamilton's OHL history, I don't think there is a big appetite for the city to work with him. Even looking at the comments on this board, the citizens aren't willing to give up their NHL dreams and build a useful OHL arena.
I'm pretty sure there's no one on this board who still has hopes of Hamilton getting an NHL team. Wanting to keep an NHL sized arena has nothing to do with an NHL team.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #324  
Old Posted Jan 26, 2020, 4:39 AM
king10 king10 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Hamilton
Posts: 2,776
Quote:
Originally Posted by Berklon View Post
I'm pretty sure there's no one on this board who still has hopes of Hamilton getting an NHL team. Wanting to keep an NHL sized arena has nothing to do with an NHL team.
Agreed. That ship has sailed. Call it a “major event size arena”.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #325  
Old Posted Jan 29, 2020, 3:00 PM
king10 king10 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Hamilton
Posts: 2,776
One of the city's biggest developers says he has a $200-million plan to redevelop Hamilton's aging downtown entertainment facilities, and build two new office buildings to boot.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/hamil...ncor-1.5443446
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #326  
Old Posted Jan 29, 2020, 9:47 PM
LikeHamilton's Avatar
LikeHamilton LikeHamilton is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Hamilton, Ontario
Posts: 2,756
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #327  
Old Posted Jan 29, 2020, 11:17 PM
HamiltonBoyInToronto HamiltonBoyInToronto is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Hamilton
Posts: 478
YES PLEASE!!! but include more digital screens outside
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #328  
Old Posted Jan 29, 2020, 11:20 PM
johnnyhamont's Avatar
johnnyhamont johnnyhamont is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Posts: 1,115
It looks better but will it still stink like ten thousand asses stinks?

Last edited by johnnyhamont; Jan 31, 2020 at 7:53 PM.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #329  
Old Posted Jan 29, 2020, 11:29 PM
king10 king10 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Hamilton
Posts: 2,776
Looks good to me. Adding a third level of suites in between the existing first and second level as well as adding new access points probably sheds capacity to around 15k like Winnipeg which isnt all that bad for us. Lower bowl probably in btw 7 and 8k.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #330  
Old Posted Jan 30, 2020, 12:36 AM
Berklon's Avatar
Berklon Berklon is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Hamilton
Posts: 3,129
The exterior looks a lot better than how it currently looks, but the renders are pretty basic so it could still be a disappointment... hard to tell.

I like their approach to blocking off the upper deck. Better than using big curtains, and definitely better than some arenas that just cover the seats.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #331  
Old Posted Jan 30, 2020, 1:06 AM
JakeLRS's Avatar
JakeLRS JakeLRS is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Posts: 877
Looks great and it will offer a very intimate scene. But the lower bowl legroom is still going to reek.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #332  
Old Posted Jan 30, 2020, 1:14 AM
TheRitsman TheRitsman is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Hamilton
Posts: 3,055
Quote:
Originally Posted by Berklon View Post
The exterior looks a lot better than how it currently looks, but the renders are pretty basic so it could still be a disappointment... hard to tell.

I like their approach to blocking off the upper deck. Better than using big curtains, and definitely better than some arenas that just cover the seats.
What exactly is being proposed to block off upper decks? It's not extremely clear from the photos.
__________________
Hamilton Downtown. Huge tabletop skyline fan. Typically viewing the city from the street, not a helicopter. Cycling, transit and active transportation advocate 🚲🚍🚋

Follow me on Twitter: https://x.com/ham_bicycleguy?t=T_fx3...SIZNGfD4A&s=09
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #333  
Old Posted Jan 30, 2020, 2:48 AM
king10 king10 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Hamilton
Posts: 2,776
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheRitsman View Post
What exactly is being proposed to block off upper decks? It's not extremely clear from the photos.
Looks like something similar to what they use in Atlanta(Mercedes Benz Stadium) to switch from NFL to MLS.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #334  
Old Posted Jan 30, 2020, 4:35 AM
Berklon's Avatar
Berklon Berklon is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Hamilton
Posts: 3,129
Quote:
Originally Posted by king10 View Post
Looks like something similar to what they use in Atlanta(Mercedes Benz Stadium) to switch from NFL to MLS.
Yes, you can see it here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q9tmjluKoBw

Although I think it'll look better at FOC with a very light colour which may be reflecting some light to eliminate a dreary look. In the BOOM 101.9 radio interview the other day they mentioned that they'd be using "technology and visual effects to shrink the appearance of the size of the arena". Not sure exactly what technology is involved, but I do like the effort they intend to put into it.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #335  
Old Posted Jan 30, 2020, 3:52 PM
SteelTown's Avatar
SteelTown SteelTown is offline
It's Hammer Time
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Hamilton
Posts: 20,304
I'm curious to see Hamilton Urban Precinct Entertainment Group's plans, they have some of Hamilton's heavy hitters part of the group, LiUNA, Paletta International, Joyce family, etc.

However, at the same time, Vrancor has a great record and I'm not worried if Darko was awarded the deal that he won't sit on it for long. Hell, he'll probably erect a crane within five months lol
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #336  
Old Posted Jan 30, 2020, 11:36 PM
SteelTown's Avatar
SteelTown SteelTown is offline
It's Hammer Time
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Hamilton
Posts: 20,304
I wonder how Vrancor intends to expand the Convention Centre at its current location, it's already a tight spot.

A cool idea that I thought about would be to expand over the MacNab terminal, the terminal would now be underneath the Convention Centre. Sort of like the St Catharines terminal.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #337  
Old Posted Jan 31, 2020, 12:12 AM
King&James's Avatar
King&James King&James is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Hamilton
Posts: 1,321
He could bridge over MacNab onto the old Robinson Royal Bank site where they could add a hotel and condo tower.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #338  
Old Posted Jan 31, 2020, 12:58 AM
StEC's Avatar
StEC StEC is offline
Burger Connoisseur
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Hamilton
Posts: 581
Quote:
Originally Posted by King&James View Post
He could bridge over MacNab onto the old Robinson Royal Bank site where they could add a hotel and condo tower.
This would be brilliant!
__________________
Living in and loving Hamilton since Jan. 2014!
Follow me on Instagram & Threads where I feature the beauty of Hamilton, Niagara & Toronto!
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #339  
Old Posted Jan 31, 2020, 6:32 PM
thistleclub thistleclub is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 3,729
Quote:
Originally Posted by SteelTown View Post
I wonder how Vrancor intends to expand the Convention Centre at its current location, it's already a tight spot.
If Second Real Properties were inclined to sell off the Robert Thomson Building, that would yield up to 143,000 square feet of exhibition and meeting space next door to the Sheraton and above underground parking, potentially in addition to the 52,000 square foot HCC, which is puny (the Sheraton itself offers 18,000 square feet of meeting and convention space).

Not sure if it was engineered to offer the potential for vertical expansion, but doubling the capacity of the convention centre, as Vrancor has pledged, would require adding 2-3 additional storeys to the existing complex. Doubling size sounds like an epic target but the HCC is remarkably tiny. In 2011, HECFI's auditors noted that it was "Ontario's smallest convention centre".
__________________
"Where architectural imagination is absent, the case is hopeless." - Louis Sullivan
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #340  
Old Posted Jan 31, 2020, 7:20 PM
SteelTown's Avatar
SteelTown SteelTown is offline
It's Hammer Time
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Hamilton
Posts: 20,304
Typically when a Convention Centre are expanded, it's not to add another floor to the existing building, its to add more floor space within the same floor.

So I imagine Vrancor would plan to go over the MacNab terminal and right up to the Church. Another example would be the Winnipeg Convention Centre, which was recently expanded.


https://lmnarchitects.com/project/rb...ntre-expansion
Reply With Quote
     
     
This discussion thread continues

Use the page links to the lower-right to go to the next page for additional posts
 
 
Reply

Go Back   SkyscraperPage Forum > Regional Sections > Canada > Ontario > Hamilton > Downtown & City of Hamilton
Forum Jump



Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 8:21 PM.

     
SkyscraperPage.com - Privacy Statement - Top

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2026, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.