Does Western Alienation exist, and how can we fix it?

[Hali87]

Originally Posted by MacLac

Breaking Knee caps, robbery, thievery, overcharging the stupid and the poor Maritimers for Hydro, Strip club Senator hang outs, Gangsters, HA's...ummmmm

Could you enlighten us poor, stupid Maritimers on how Quebec has been overcharging us for Hydro?

[MacLac]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

You are indeed correct, a thank you note would indeed be appreciated. I suspect I am personally supporting an entire rural village in Alberta.

Really? 3.20Billion transferred to NB this year....Alberta paying the bills of Have-not'ers again.....

[theman23]

Originally Posted by MacLac

Really? 3.20Billion transferred to NB this year....Alberta paying the bills of Have-not'ers again.....

I think the point is that unless you earn more than the average Canadian (which monctonrad probably does but you probably don’t given how stupid you sound), you aren’t paying anyone’s bills and are just as much of a have not.

[OldDartmouthMark]

Originally Posted by MacLac

Really? 3.20Billion transferred to NB this year....Alberta paying the bills of Have-not'ers again.....

Dude. Just put the meth pipe down. You are not impressing anybody with your ignorance.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by MacLac

Haha!!! "Hottest housing market?" Define "Hottest." I heard that they can't even give away homes there....let alone be "Hot." Too funny, whatever makes you sleep better at night I guess. Tell that to the 10,000's of NB'ers who left in droves and whom will never move back......

NBers now? I guess making friends is not your strong suit.

[Razor]

Any minute, one of their fellow Albertans will come in to shut those two down I'm sure.
Pretty pathetic job boys, when you get more laughs at your pathetic comments then creating discord which is what you were both looking for..

[MonctonRad]

Originally Posted by Acajack

NBers now? I guess making friends is not your strong suit.

Yevgeney's only purpose on this thread is to stir the pot. I don't take him seriously in the least. Thankfully, most SSPers know what he's up to. If he starts spilling his vitriol on Facebook though, he could cause some serious trouble........

[kel]

Originally Posted by Razor

Any minute, one of their fellow Albertans will come in to shut those two down I'm sure.
Pretty pathetic job boys, when you get more laughs at your pathetic comments then creating discord which is what you were both looking for..

Problem is nobody’s laughing unless of course you’re on the receiving end of other people’s hard work but I’m sure the laughing will come to a sudden stop when the welfare cheque’s (call it what it is) disappear.

[Docere]

I've noticed that Evan Solomon refers to "Prairie alienation" rather than "Western alienation."

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by kel

Alberta is tired of some people in Canada pillaging and raping it for its wealth and than attacking Alberta for the very thing that supplies that wealth.

So I guess you're also mad at the Billions of Alberta wealth that has ended up outside Canada's borders? The US and other multinationals that have been raping and pillaging our resources?

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by Corndogger

I'm one of the few people here who has things figured out.

I lol'd.

[Doug]

Originally Posted by kwoldtimer

Are there voices in Alberta making clear what they would want to happen to the federal revenue if equalization payments were stopped or reduced? Or is the expectation that Canada would just stop collecting the revenue?

The Scott More proposal seems most reasonable. Change federal transfers to provinces ex EI and CPP to be the midpoint of current and per capita. Even better would be reduce all federal tax rates and apportion the lost revenue per capita against federal transfers ex EI and CPP. Provinces can raise their rates to compensate.

[misher]

Originally Posted by Doug

The Scott More proposal seems most reasonable. Change federal transfers to provinces ex EI and CPP to be the midpoint of current and per capita. Even better would be reduce all federal tax rates and apportion the lost revenue per capita against federal transfers ex EI and CPP. Provinces can raise their rates to compensate.

The second sounds best to me. I like competition and feel that keeps us honest. By making provinces compete against each other more it helps ensure they don’t go too crazy/inefficient.

[Doug]

Originally Posted by CityTech

https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/t1/tbl1/en/...kMembers%5B0%5D=1.6&pickMembers%5B1%5D=2.

2018 data.

Total federal revenue: $332.546B

Federal revenue from Alberta: $46.728B (14.05% of total)
Federal revenue from Quebec: $60.101B (18.07% of total)

Federal spending in Quebec: $72.957B

(72.957B - 60.101B) X 14.05% = $1.806B.

A lot less than both Quebec's surplus and Alberta's deficit.

This narrative that Alberta is being sucked dry to pay for Quebec is completely untrue.

The equation is wrong as it misleadingly uses the same percentage for both revenue and expenditure.

Total federal spending is: $325.515B (not really a surplus as this is due to EI contributions)

Federal spending in AB: $29.553B (9.05% of total)
Federal spending in QC: $72.957B (22.34% of total)

Net transfer from AB to QC using this proportional allocation methodology: 14.05% X $332.546B - 22.34% X $325.515B = $46.723B - $72.727B = -$26B

A better methodology would exclude EI from both sides of ledger. It would then look at which provinces are in surplus with the Feds and which are in deficit. The next step would look at what percentage AB represents of the provinces in surplus and what percentage QC represents of the provinces deficit. TGR number would likely be less than $26B.

[casper]

Originally Posted by Docere

I've noticed that Evan Solomon refers to "Prairie alienation" rather than "Western alienation."

As he should........

BC very clearly voted a mix of Liberal, NDP, Conservative and Green. We even voted for the former justice minister who is likely to get under Justin's skin like no one else. A divided minority Parliament reflects the thinking in BC.

BC is also much more concerned and focused on pipelines than anywhere else.

It is extremely unlikely that Alberta will ever separate. If it did, I would expect BC would separate as well and go back to the pre-confederation structure under the Cascadia name. Highly unlikely, bit if it happened what happens to Washington State and Oregon would be an interesting question to ask.

[kwoldtimer]

Originally Posted by casper

As he should........

BC very clearly voted a mix of Liberal, NDP, Conservative and Green. We even voted for the former justice minister who is likely to get under Justin's skin like no one else. A divided minority Parliament reflects the thinking in BC.

BC is also much more concerned and focused on pipelines than anywhere else.

It is extremely unlikely that Alberta will ever separate. If it did, I would expect BC would separate as well and go back to the pre-confederation structure under the Cascadia name. Highly unlikely, bit if it happened what happens to Washington State and Oregon would be an interesting question to ask.

I'm not sure why "interesting". The answer is "nothing".

[kwoldtimer]

Originally Posted by Doug

The equation is wrong as it misleadingly uses the same percentage for both revenue and expenditure.

Total federal spending is: $325.515B (not really a surplus as this is due to EI contributions)

Federal spending in AB: $29.553B (9.05% of total)
Federal spending in QC: $72.957B (22.34% of total)

Net transfer from AB to QC using this proportional allocation methodology: 14.05% X $332.546B - 22.34% X $325.515B = $46.723B - $72.727B = -$26B

A better methodology would exclude EI from both sides of ledger. It would then look at which provinces are in surplus with the Feds and which are in deficit. The next step would look at what percentage AB represents of the provinces in surplus and what percentage QC represents of the provinces deficit. TGR number would likely be less than $26B.

What is the relevance of whether a province is in "surplus" or "deficit" with GofC?

[Docere]

Originally Posted by casper

As he should........

BC very clearly voted a mix of Liberal, NDP, Conservative and Green. We even voted for the former justice minister who is likely to get under Justin's skin like no one else. A divided minority Parliament reflects the thinking in BC.

BC is also much more concerned and focused on pipelines than anywhere else.

It is extremely unlikely that Alberta will ever separate. If it did, I would expect BC would separate as well and go back to the pre-confederation structure under the Cascadia name. Highly unlikely, bit if it happened what happens to Washington State and Oregon would be an interesting question to ask.

Vancouver Island has only NDP and Green MPs, pretty much the antithesis of Alberta/Saskatchewan.

[dleung]

Not sure why some people are too proud to admit that Alberta is disproportionately subsidizing Quebec through equalization... that's like saying "taxpayers don't pay for my welfare cheque, the government does!"

One can say that Alberta's resources are Canada's (what about that of other provinces?), or that it's shouldn't be exploited at such environmental cost (which they bear the brunt of), or French Canada is a cultural asset deserving of artificial life support like with the Indigenous peoples, etc. I'm against pipelines, but credit where it's due.

[Chadillaccc]

Originally Posted by dleung

Not sure why some people are too proud to admit that Alberta is effectively paying Quebec's bills...

Because they've entrenched themselves so deep into their opinion that to renege now would make them look like almost as much of an idiot as they already look. It's basically what's happened to all Trump supporters as well, and it's happening more and more due to social media echo chambers.