Expo Line - Surrey Langley Extension: Planning & Pre-Construction

[Migrant_Coconut]

"Light metro" is the term we're looking for. And aberdeen, thanks, good info.

[fredinno]

Originally Posted by CanSpice

That site is also heavily sloped, with about a 40-meter elevation change from top to bottom. That probably removes it from the potential of being an OMC expansion.

And the old Edmonds site had to be filled in from a gravel pit. It's called using infill.

Originally Posted by Galaxy

If you build at Langley Airport just build the line there at grade just like the part at YVR or in Port Moody! Once you pass 56 around [Kodiak Aerospace] have the guideway go above grade again and up the hill towards Murrayville using the Fraser Highway right of way...

That section is literally only 750m-ish long (assuming you start the at-grade section after Old Yale Road. It's also heavily sloped (the area is kind of a small valley for the Nicolmekl River). So it's not even worth it.

Originally Posted by officedweller

The MKIIs are in married pairs so trains can be divided easily for servicing, whereas the MKIIIs are joined in 4s.
Just wondering whether the existing shed can hold a full length 4 car MKIII train or if it has to be divided up.

The Edmonds one? Yes. Not OMC3, and I'm not sure about OMC2 (it should be)

Originally Posted by Migrant_Coconut

Original concept. That's been thrown out for something more practical.
So no Granville Bridge elevator?


Definitely not, but the guideway is (RRT can't go at-grade on a bridge to my knowledge).

So no Granville Is. Elevator?

[aberdeen5698]

Originally Posted by officedweller

"Light" is usually meant to refer to capacity (even though they are "intermediate" capacity), not weight of the vehicles.

I remember that back in the days when Skytrain was still called "ALRT", one of its touted advantages was that guideway construction was much cheaper specifically because it was "light". Guideways to carry heavy rail vehicles like traditional subway trains would have to be structurally more substantial.

I don't know if the industry jargon has changed from those days, but back then "light" meant exactly that: i.e., "not heavy".

[Migrant_Coconut]

Originally Posted by fredinno

So no Granville Is. Elevator?

So a Granville Island Elevator to the side of the bridge.

[Alex Mackinnon]

Originally Posted by aberdeen5698

I remember that back in the days when Skytrain was still called "ALRT", one of its touted advantages was that guideway construction was much cheaper specifically because it was "light". Guideways to carry heavy rail vehicles like traditional subway trains would have to be structurally more substantial.

I don't know if the industry jargon has changed from those days, but back then "light" meant exactly that: i.e., "not heavy".

My impression is that light usually refers to the vehicles not being able to stand up to collision requirements for mainline rail vehicles.

There is a minimum strength requirement for heavy rail passenger vehicles in North America that results in cars being built like bank vaults. In the US, they would require the passenger vehicles to stand up to 800k lbs of force without buckling.

[officedweller]

Whatever the jargon has evolved to, "Light Rail" is not light in weight and is heavier than "Light Metro" (exclusive RoW vehicles).

[Tvisforme]

Originally Posted by scryer

Skytrain to Langley Memorial would make this extension legendary.... Let's build it.

That would make sense, given that it's just a continuation down the Fraser Highway. If there is ever a push to extend Skytrain to Abbotsford then the Abbotsford airport would be a natural stop as well.

[Xrayal]

Pulled this from the Environmental Screening Review document:Link on the surreylangleyskytrain.ca website.

2.2.3 Operations and Maintenance Centre
A new Operations and Maintenance Centre (OMC) is required to support a fully built Surrey Langley SkyTrain. It will be located in an industrial area near the alignment to support the project’s additional operations and maintenance requirements.

The only industrial area nearby the line I could spot was in Langley.

[officedweller]

The display boards also reference the "full" extension, which might suggest Langley

A new Operations and Maintenance Centre to service the full extension

https://surreylangleyskytrain.ca/Documents/Phase%202_Display%20Boards%20for%20Web.pdf

[Dengler Avenue]

Just wondering, if Expo Line is extended to Langley Memorial Hospital, should the 503 end there or still serve Langley Centre?

[BCPhil]

Originally Posted by officedweller

The display boards also reference the "full" extension, which might suggest Langley


https://surreylangleyskytrain.ca/Documents/Phase%202_Display%20Boards%20for%20Web.pdf

In the Environmental Screening Review Process document, it clearly states "Construction of an Operations and Maintenance Centre (OMC) when the line is extended to Langley"

https://surreylangleyskytrain.ca/Documen...reening%20Review%20Process%20Summary.pdf

Page 3

[Migrant_Coconut]

Originally Posted by Dengler Avenue

Just wondering, if Expo Line is extended to Langley Memorial Hospital, should the 503 end there or still serve Langley Centre?

2018 TSPR app. I count less about a hundred people between Langley Memorial and Aldergrove, so I suppose TransLink could cut the line and introduce a less-frequent one at the terminus.

[Dengler Avenue]

Originally Posted by Migrant_Coconut

2018 TSPR app. I count less about a hundred people between Langley Memorial and Aldergrove, so I suppose TransLink could cut the line and introduce a less-frequent one at the terminus.

Less frequent? Is even 20-minute rush-hour frequency an overkill?

[Migrant_Coconut]

Ah, you were asking if the 503 should extend to Langley Memorial along with the Expo. That sounds like a good idea.

[Dengler Avenue]

503 already serves the hospital currently (Fraser Highway @ 221st Street). I’m just wondering whether it should just end there when the Expo Line also gets there or still serve Langley Centre via 216th Street and 56 Avenue.

[Migrant_Coconut]

End service west of Langley? That's improbable - we're not going to cut the 9 or 14 once the M-Line reaches UBC. People still need a first/last mile option.

[jlove390]

Kennedy Stewart will be meeting with Trudeau to discuss funding for the full extension to Langley as well as UBC.

https://dailyhive.com/vancouver/kennedy-stewart-justin-trudeau-transit-funding-meeting

[fredinno]

Originally Posted by Migrant_Coconut

End service west of Langley? That's improbable - we're not going to cut the 9 or 14 once the M-Line reaches UBC. People still need a first/last mile option.

503 is now an express bus, so that means conversion back to normal local service west of Murrayville, or a new express line to service Aldergrove.

[Dengler Avenue]

Originally Posted by fredinno

503 is now an express bus, so that means conversion back to normal local service west of Murrayville, or a new express line to service Aldergrove.

503’s basically an express between 48 Avenue and 264th Street even right now.

“Next stop: 232nd Street”
“Next stop: 240th Street”

And so on...

But I figured. Keeping 503 at Langley Centre means people don’t have to transfer more than once. I just wasn’t sure how many people would get off, let’s say, 320, 342 or 501 to transfer to 503 to go to Aldergrove. On another note, I still think a shuttle from Carvolth to Aldergrove will make sense down the road: It’s quite the detour to go down 200th Street then Fraser Highway when one can stay on TCH until 264th Street. Again, that’s only if demand grows, which is unlikely for Aldergrove. It’ll be weird to see a cluster of high rises in the middle of farm land.

=====

About talks about funding: Getting both U.B.C. and Langley Extension done concurrently sounds pretty ambitious but there’s definitely no harm in asking. Plus, automated trains sure come in handy when bus drivers go on strike. Koodos to the person who had the foresight to automate skytrains back in the 80s.

Edit: I came off demeaning towards bus drivers but I didn’t mean to. My apologies. I wonder how they can be helped without making a huge dent in the budget though.

[Alex Mackinnon]

Originally Posted by Dengler Avenue

503’s basically an express between 48 Avenue and 264th Street even right now.

“Next stop: 232nd Street”
“Next stop: 240th Street”

And so on...

But I figured. Keeping 503 at Langley Centre means people don’t have to transfer more than once. I just wasn’t sure how many people would get off, let’s say, 320, 342 or 501 to transfer to 503 to go to Aldergrove. On another note, I still think a shuttle from Carvolth to Aldergrove will make sense down the road: It’s quite the detour to go down 200th Street then Fraser Highway when one can stay on TCH until 264th Street. Again, that’s only if demand grows, which is unlikely for Aldergrove. It’ll be weird to see a cluster of high rises in the middle of farm land.

=====

About talks about funding: Getting both U.B.C. and Langley Extension done concurrently sounds pretty ambitious but there’s definitely no harm in asking. Plus, automated trains sure come in handy when bus drivers go on strike. Koodos to the person who had the foresight to automate skytrains back in the 80s.

Edit: I came off demeaning towards bus drivers but I didn’t mean to. My apologies. I wonder how they can be helped without making a huge dent in the budget though.

It wasn't really forethought. It was just thought, the Socreds we never in the good books of the unions. That move was preemptive on their part.