PHILADELPHIA | Highrise Development Thread X

[mcgrath618]

Originally Posted by Urbanthusiat

New thread?

Already on it.

[Londonee]

Fantastic infill. Assuming it's going on the massive parking lot right there?

[summersm343]

Incredible! North Broad is on fire!

[Tatts]

Originally Posted by 3rd&Brown

The most interesting tidbit in this article for me is that Jefferson Health System's Headquarters will be in a tower at 1101 Market. I don't recall that ever being explicitly stated.

Aramark left 1101 Market back in the spring and moved to their new HQ in the old Design Center along the Schuylkill River and took their ugly lighted sign with them. It now infests the riverbank.

Jefferson is taking over the top half of the building from 15th floor and up and bought naming rights. This was covered well in the Inquirer; for the first time, all of Jefferson's administrative offices will be in the same building. The lower half is still largely city offices--Water Dept. and Health--and some smaller tenants (Bar Association) and some empty space. Renovations to the future Jefferson office spaces have been going on all this time, with the front entrance exterior and lobby getting a major makeover since August, possibly finishing later this month.

This Sunday (10/20) from 6AM to possibly as late as 7PM, all surrounding streets (Chestnut to Arch and 10th to 13th) will be closed for a helicopter lift of the new Jefferson signage to the top of the building. It will be installed during the next few weeks--north and south sides. 11th street will close Friday evening for staging and remain closed until they're done on Sunday.

[iheartphilly]

https://www.bizjournals.com/philadelphia...seven.html?iana=hpmvp_phil_news_headline

Interesting tidbit from the developer Oliver Tyrone Pulver in the above article:

In the meantime, Pulver continues to work on getting a proposed office building constructed at 13th and Market streets, which is directly across from the Macy's. Again, landing tenants is the key.
"We're making good headway," he said.

Don't want to read too much into it, but at least we know it is not dead.

[3rd&Brown]

Originally Posted by cardeza

arent jobs at a 25 year high in the city? More is better, but the way the status quo is being described it sounds like we're talking about Detroit in the 80s. The initial comment was about cars and the inference that people wouldnt need them if we had lower taxes- something that sounds extremely theoretical and disconnected from how people outside of Center City and its adjacent neighborhoods live.

So what?

And other cities are doing even better. It still has a lower share of regional jobs compared to its peer cities.

Further, Philadelphia has a lot of punitive taxes (specific to Philadelphia) that large global corporations can manage and/or avoid but smaller companies just starting out cannot, particularly in less sophisticated industries. I mean, Philadelphia has a "BUSINESS PRIVILEGE TAX". Give me a break. You have to pay a tax to deal with Jannie Blackwell? No thanks. It also has a gross receipts tax and a net profits tax. This has been discussed ad nauseum but I'm just telling you making reforms against those taxes and simplifying the code would do just as much to remove reliance on cars by moving jobs into the city as it would any law about parking minimums. And it sure as hell would remove resistance to them.

It should be clear that we should be growing all types of jobs, not just Center City office jobs. We want the entire city to flourish, not just the core.

You actually sound like quite the elitist.

[iamrobk]

FWIW if people want to debate tax policy, I'd suggest starting by reviewing the PICA tax revenue update so you can get a sense of what taxes the city collects and roughly how much money we're talking about when these taxes are discussed.

Most recent report (keep in mind property taxes won't really be reflected on here since most people pay them in February-April): http://www.picapa.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/09/Monthly-Tax-Update-August-20-FINAL-.pdf
Older reports: http://www.picapa.org/our-work/monthly-city-tax-revenue-update/

[mcgrath618]

Originally Posted by iheartphilly

https://www.bizjournals.com/philadelphia...seven.html?iana=hpmvp_phil_news_headline

Interesting tidbit from the developer Oliver Tyrone Pulver in the above article:

In the meantime, Pulver continues to work on getting a proposed office building constructed at 13th and Market streets, which is directly across from the Macy's. Again, landing tenants is the key.
"We're making good headway," he said.

Don't want to read too much into it, but at least we know it is not dead.

It would be awesome to have 5 500’ers going up at once, with three of them being mostly or entirely office. I still give this one a 50% chance of happening though

[Insoluble]

People are still bitching about taxes hurting business growth too much right after this get's posted?

Originally Posted by Milksteak

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/10/12/glassdoo...es-with-high-growth-in-job-openings.html

We made the list for cities with the highest job growth according to a CNBC article. Here is the breakdown:

2. Philadelphia
Job openings: 112,692

Year-over-year growth: 6.4%

Median base pay: $57,502 per year

Fastest-growing industries: government, media and publishing, restaurant and bars

*sigh* must be the Philly thread. Seriously though folks, there are about a dozen serious issues holding the city back that have a bigger impact than the tax bogyman. If only we'd focus as much ire and energy on those...

[summersm343]

Nice to get an update on 1301 Market. Build it!!

[cardeza]

Originally Posted by 3rd&Brown

So what?

And other cities are doing even better. It still has a lower share of regional jobs compared to its peer cities.

Further, Philadelphia has a lot of punitive taxes (specific to Philadelphia) that large global corporations can manage and/or avoid but smaller companies just starting out cannot, particularly in less sophisticated industries. I mean, Philadelphia has a "BUSINESS PRIVILEGE TAX". Give me a break. You have to pay a tax to deal with Jannie Blackwell? No thanks. It also has a gross receipts tax and a net profits tax. This has been discussed ad nauseum but I'm just telling you making reforms against those taxes and simplifying the code would do just as much to remove reliance on cars by moving jobs into the city as it would any law about parking minimums. And it sure as hell would remove resistance to them.

It should be clear that we should be growing all types of jobs, not just Center City office jobs. We want the entire city to flourish, not just the core.

You actually sound like quite the elitist.

I'm all for all jobs. I was talking specifically about increasing job concentration in the CBD since we were talking about people working where cars aren't a necessity for the commute. Obviously the most transit connected part of the city is CC, followed by UC. Warehouses are nice, but having more warehouse jobs likely means those jobs are in the outer parts of the city (ie. NE Philly etc.) which are very car dependent.

I did not say taxes are good (actually they are a necessity) but I am saying that SHIFTING the tax burden is not easy under PA state law. A major coalition pushed an initiative to get the constitution changed so that the SAME TAXES you mentioned could be lowered in exchange for a higher tax rate on commercial buildings. Most of the "experts" have contended this is the most advantageous way to lower business taxes without killing the budget or homeowners. The State did not pass the law. Those are the facts- I didn't vote on it and I'm not sure why I'm being criticized for stating what actually took place. There are no easy solutions under these circumstances.

[cardeza]

Originally Posted by Insoluble

People are still bitching about taxes hurting business growth too much right after this get's posted?


*sigh* must be the Philly thread. Seriously though folks, there are about a dozen serious issues holding the city back that have a bigger impact than the tax bogyman. If only we'd focus as much ire and energy on those...

People ignore positive news like that if it doesnt fit the narrative- no matter how much job growth we experience you will still hear the same thing- "others" are doing much better and whatever growth we've experienced is far too little.

This is the refrain of the CCD under Levy- but since their grand plan for the tax burden shift has failed I have not heard of a "plan B" from the anti-tax lobby.

[3rd&Brown]

Originally Posted by cardeza

I'm all for all jobs. I was talking specifically about increasing job concentration in the CBD since we were talking about people working where cars aren't a necessity for the commute. Obviously the most transit connected part of the city is CC, followed by UC. Warehouses are nice, but having more warehouse jobs likely means those jobs are in the outer parts of the city (ie. NE Philly etc.) which are very car dependent.

I did not say taxes are good (actually they are a necessity) but I am saying that SHIFTING the tax burden is not easy under PA state law. A major coalition pushed an initiative to get the constitution changed so that the SAME TAXES you mentioned could be lowered in exchange for a higher tax rate on commercial buildings. Most of the "experts" have contended this is the most advantageous way to lower business taxes without killing the budget or homeowners. The State did not pass the law. Those are the facts- I didn't vote on it and I'm not sure why I'm being criticized for stating what actually took place. There are no easy solutions under these circumstances.

Tax revenue is a record high and Kenney has increased spending by $1 Billion.

He doesn't need to shift anything. Here's a novel idea. He could have used that Billion with a B to cut some of those onerous annoying taxes, some of them out of oblivion.

I'm not a trickle down moron but I know complicated when I see it. Simplification and streamlining the process of doing business, which could also involve wholesale elimination of (some taxes).

[3rd&Brown]

Originally Posted by cardeza

People ignore positive news like that if it doesnt fit the narrative- no matter how much job growth we experience you will still hear the same thing- "others" are doing much better and whatever growth we've experienced is far too little.

This is the refrain of the CCD under Levy- but since their grand plan for the tax burden shift has failed I have not heard of a "plan B" from the anti-tax lobby.

Here's some news for you.

Others are doing better. Their cities account for a much higher percentage of their region's jobs when compared to Philadelphia.

And I'm sure that number is for the entire region, not just Philadelphia. So unless we know the methodology, let's not toot our own horns. It could just as likely include job openings in Montgomery County as it does Center City.

[cardeza]

Originally Posted by 3rd&Brown

Tax revenue is a record high and Kenney has increased spending by $1 Billion.

He doesn't need to shift anything. Here's a novel idea. He could have used that Billion with a B to cut some of those onerous annoying taxes, some of them out of oblivion.

I'm not a trickle down moron but I know complicated when I see it. Simplification and streamlining the process of doing business, which could also involve wholesale elimination of (some taxes).

Every gov budget is mostly fixed cost. "Kenney" didnt magically increase the budget by 1B- paying off prior debts, making a pension fund whole (based on decisions made in the 70s and 80s), increased salaries and increased benefits costs make up most of any budget increase. Much of what makes up the increase is determined by law or by contract- you cannot make these costs vaporize on a whim because you want to cut taxes. Maybe 1/3 of the budget can be manipulated in any given year. Every big city is taxing people in some significant way- it's just that this structure is more focused on wages and business receipts than it is real estate. Even the pro-change groups aren't calling for massive budget cuts, they want a more business friendly distribution of the burden.

[cardeza]

Originally Posted by 3rd&Brown

Here's some news for you.

Others are doing better. Their cities account for a much higher percentage of their region's jobs when compared to Philadelphia.

And I'm sure that number is for the entire region, not just Philadelphia. So unless we know the methodology, let's not toot our own horns. It could just as likely include job openings in Montgomery County as it does Center City.

Someone posted something (BLS data I think) recently showing how the city and region were doing vs other regions in job growth numbers- we were in the middle but above some notable players (perhaps NY or DC or Boston- or all 3). The claim that the city is trailing peers by a notable margin in recent performance isn't accurate. And the claim that the only factor in job growth numbers is tax rate is definitely inaccurate.

[3rd&Brown]

Originally Posted by cardeza

Every gov budget is mostly fixed cost. "Kenney" didnt magically increase the budget by 1B- paying off prior debts, making a pension fund whole (based on decisions made in the 70s and 80s), increased salaries and increased benefits costs make up most of any budget increase. Much of what makes up the increase is determined by law or by contract- you cannot make these costs vaporize on a whim because you want to cut taxes. Maybe 1/3 of the budget can be manipulated in any given year. Every big city is taxing people in some significant way- it's just that this structure is more focused on wages and business receipts than it is real estate. Even the pro-change groups aren't calling for massive budget cuts, they want a more business friendly distribution of the burden.

You really think Kenney used the billion dollars to make the pension fund whole?

I gotta bridge to sell to you.

Also. Our costs just went up a billion dollars like that? Who says?

[UrbanRevival]

Originally Posted by cardeza

Someone posted something (BLS data I think) recently showing how the city and region were doing vs other regions in job growth numbers- we were in the middle but above some notable players (perhaps NY or DC or Boston- or all 3). The claim that the city is trailing peers by a notable margin in recent performance isn't accurate. And the claim that the only factor in job growth numbers is tax rate is definitely inaccurate.

For the record, here are the latest BLS nonfarm payroll changes, available for August 2019 (% year-over-year change) for the Philadelphia Division of the metro area (which I believe includes only the city and Delaware County), as compared to some peer urban core divisions.

Dallas: 3.8%
Seattle: 3.2%
SF: 3.1%
Philadelphia: 2.1%
Boston: 1.7%
New York: 1.5%
DC: 1.3%
LA: 1.3%
Chicago: 0.9%

https://www.bls.gov/news.release/metro.t04.htm


So, at least in terms of per capita growth, it seems that Philly is comparing pretty favorably to most peers. To only be surpassed by mega-growth or tech boom towns like Dallas, Seattle, and SF is a big accomplishment.

That's not to say there couldn't be a plethora of legislative improvements to Philly's economic attractiveness/competitiveness, but I do think the reality of how far the city's economy has come is still lost on some people (I've been tracking the BLS numbers since around the "Great Recession," and the numbers definitely had not been so consistently solid for Philly until about 18 months ago).

What's even more encouraging about this is that, if Philly did have much more of its proverbial s**t together, think about how much more growth the city could see.

[eixample]

I recall reading somewhere (maybe here) that Philadelphia is a relatively steady performing job market - taking longer to take off after a downturn, never hitting the real boom that others experience, but keeping the growth going longer than other markets and then never busting as hard as some others. Maybe that is all BS or I am misremembering but that kind of fits in with the situation - took a little longer to get going but also taking a little more to slow us down. Anyway, those BLS numbers are for one year so nothing to really read that much into. I definitely wouldn't be patting Kenney on the back for that or be making a judgment about tax burdens....

[3rd&Brown]

Originally Posted by UrbanRevival

What's even more encouraging about this is that, if Philly did have much more of its proverbial s**t together, think about how much more growth the city could see.

I guess this is my point.

Yes, y'all. I'm proud of how far the city has come. But in many respects, I think it is in spite of city leadership, not because of it.

That being said, I stand corrected and have just researched that the city is making extra payments against it's pension obligations. So much so that by 2029 or so (not that far into the future), the pension will be in the neighborhood of 80% funded and the revenue devoted to pension obligations will be almost 10% less of the city's revenue in absolute terms than compared to today. Today, 13% of city revenue goes to pension obligations. The prediction is that by 2029, it will be a mere 3%.

So can we get some street sweeping already?

And a building at 13th & Market