O-Train Line 2 [Stage 1 | Bayview to Greenboro] | In Service

[CityTech]

Ridership will almost certainly fall within the first year and rebound afterwards and then grow; by 2021 or so ridership will likely be higher than it is today. The new system is unquestionably a net win but there's winners and losers and the winners may not realize they're winners before giving up transit entirely. In particular Ottawans need to learn that number of transfers isn't the main determinant of the quality of a commute. Something that people in other cities understand perfectly well but Ottawans do not yet.

[TransitZilla]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

Can the city do anything right with the Trillium Line?
Of course, the Trillium Line continues to operate as an entity to itself with no consideration to whether it connects with local buses at Greenboro. Again, it arrived one minute after my local bus departed. Fortunately, I had been on the previous train, which made an inefficient transfer.

No matter when the train arrives or departs, there are going to be some missed connections. The only way to mitigate this is to improve the train's frequency.

They are now making a big deal of taking your bike to the transit at Greenboro Station. Unfortunately, no bike path actually goes to Greenboro Station, with all the dedicated paths ending several blocks away or blocked by the Trillium Line. At South Keys, it appeared that the MUP connecting the station to the pedestrian bridge was closed.

We are making excellent progress.

The MUP connecting South Keys station to the pedestrian bridge is not closed. What was closed for Stage 2 construction is the ramp that provided secondary access to the southbound platform.

I've taken my bike to Greenboro and to the O-Train many times but I agree there is lots of room for better bike infrastructure. A protected intersection at Bank & Johnston and cycle tracks on Johnston between Bank and Southgate would be a good start.

[kevinbottawa]

After travelling the Confederation Line I transferred to the Trillium and rode it for the first time yesterday. It was very underwhelming after experiencing the new line, particularly because of the speed and the quality of the stations. My whole family got bored pretty quickly. A single track line is such an inferior service, having to sit there and wait for the other train to pass. I don't know how they could be making such a major investment in the line for phase 2 and not double tracking it. Seems like a wasted opportunity.

[daud]

Originally Posted by kevinbottawa

After travelling the Confederation Line I transferred to the Trillium and rode it for the first time yesterday. It was very underwhelming after experiencing the new line, particularly because of the speed and the quality of the stations. My whole family got bored pretty quickly. A single track line is such an inferior service, having to sit there and wait for the other train to pass. I don't know how they could be making such a major investment in the line for phase 2 and not double tracking it. Seems like a wasted opportunity.

Did the same. Trillium was dog slow. Painful really. Hope it will improve with phase 2.

[CityTech]

My hope is that now that people have experienced the Confederation Line, public demand for improving Trillium will increase and we'll see it in Phase 3.

Remember that the reason why Watson chose to extend Trillium rather than upgrade, is because that's what popular opinion demanded.

[RomanR27]

It would be nice if they extend the hours to line-up with line 1 in Stage 2 as well.

[citydwlr]

I'm not sure if anyone posted this here or not, but O-Train Fans posted up the new O-Train livery on Twitter:

A new look for the future Stadler FLIRT vehicles for the Trillium Line Stage 2 was shown today. Design and livery lines up more with the new fleet look of Line 1 (Confederation Line). #ottlrt #ottawa



Sep 10, 2019

[kevinbottawa]

Originally Posted by citydwlr

I'm not sure if anyone posted this here or not, but O-Train Fans posted up the new O-Train livery on Twitter:

The new trains look like they'll be longer than the Line 2 platform at Bayview.

[lrt's friend]

Yes, since the upgrade around 3 years ago, the Trillium Line has become painfully slow, making it difficult to predict for transfers. The FLIRT trains will require platforms that are twice as long as the current platforms. Don't worry, the platforms will be extended when we shut down the Trillium Line next spring for almost 2.5 years. Too bad, we couldn't do all the double tracking now rather than another shutdown at some unknown point in the future. But this is what the experts told the city to minimize the cost of improvements.

[corynv]

Originally Posted by kevinbottawa

The new trains look like they'll be longer than the Line 2 platform at Bayview.

they will be. That's why all platforms will be lengthened during the trillium line's shutdown (that wasn't decided on at the point when bayview station was under construction for stage 1, so has to be done after the fact)

[lrt's friend]

I took the Trillium Line yesterday, one way when there were 4 trains operating and the return trip when there were two trains operating. The difference was night and day. With two trains, service was swift with no slow downs. It is quite clear the slight improvement in frequency and significantly longer trip times that came with the last upgrade provided a net loss in service.

[le calmar]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

Yes, since the upgrade around 3 years ago, the Trillium Line has become painfully slow, making it difficult to predict for transfers.

What caused service to be slower after the upgrade?

[Multi-modal]

Originally Posted by le calmar

What caused service to be slower after the upgrade?

Before the upgrade OC Transpo ran two trains on the line, with one passing track at Carleton where the trains past eachother while serving a busy station. Frequency was every 15 minutes.

After the upgrade OC Transpo runs four trains on the line, with passing tracks at at Gladstone, Carleton, and between Brookfield and Walkley. The two new passing tracks don't happen at stations, so it introduces two additional spots where trains have to slow down and even stop occasionally. After the upgrade the frequency improved from 15 minutes to 12 minutes, but travel time increased noticeably.

[TransitZilla]

Originally Posted by Multi-modal

Before the upgrade OC Transpo ran two trains on the line, with one passing track at Carleton where the trains past eachother while serving a busy station. Frequency was every 15 minutes.

After the upgrade OC Transpo runs four trains on the line, with passing tracks at at Gladstone, Carleton, and between Brookfield and Walkley. The two new passing tracks don't happen at stations, so it introduces two additional spots where trains have to slow down and even stop occasionally. After the upgrade the frequency improved from 15 minutes to 12 minutes, but travel time increased noticeably.

My understanding is that the switches at the end of the passing tracks take something like 30 seconds to clear after a train passes, so that's why the trains have to slow way down and sometimes stop until the signal clears.

With Stage 2 the trains will pass at Gladstone station so this will no longer be an issue, but it could still be an issue at the Brookfield passing track unless the switches are upgraded.

But I double Stage 2 will make the trip any faster since there are 2 new stations (Gladstone and Walkley) being added.

[TransitZilla]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

It is quite clear the slight improvement in frequency and significantly longer trip times that came with the last upgrade provided a net loss in service.

I wouldn't say that; they did increase the capacity of the line from 4 trains per hour to 5.

Of course they were hoping to increase it to 6 or 7 trains per hour, so it's fair to say it was a disappointment.

[CityTech]

It should ease up after the Phase 2 upgrade. The Gladstone siding stop is being replaced with a station stop and they're switching to PTC signalling. Right now a big reason why the sidings slow down so much is because after a train passes onto the second track, it takes 30 seconds for the signals to allow the train in the other direction to proceed. With PTC that 30 seconds won't be needed anymore; trains will be able to proceed instantly once the track is clear. This will speed up the passing significantly. It will also drop dwell times in places like Carleton.

[lrt's friend]

Originally Posted by bradnixon

I wouldn't say that; they did increase the capacity of the line from 4 trains per hour to 5.

Of course they were hoping to increase it to 6 or 7 trains per hour, so it's fair to say it was a disappointment.

The increase in capacity usually does not impact individual customers. Since ridership has been flat on the Trillium Line for a number of years, travel times are the most important consideration. Net average travel times have increased.

[Catenary]

Originally Posted by CityTech

It should ease up after the Phase 2 upgrade. The Gladstone siding stop is being replaced with a station stop and they're switching to PTC signalling. Right now a big reason why the sidings slow down so much is because after a train passes onto the second track, it takes 30 seconds for the signals to allow the train in the other direction to proceed. With PTC that 30 seconds won't be needed anymore; trains will be able to proceed instantly once the track is clear. This will speed up the passing significantly. It will also drop dwell times in places like Carleton.

The Trillium Line is already equipped with PTC. I believe it's CBTC that's proposed for Phase 2.

Dwell times at Carleton are long because that location is the timepoint for the entire line. Even if the signals clear, the trains will wait there until the schedule departure time. Trains depart Greenboro and Bayview when the other trains depart Mooney's Bay and Carling, so the endpoints can't be timepoints.

[Allandale25]

Cool pictures here:

https://twitter.com/davidmccphoto/status/1175824794220138497

https://twitter.com/davidmccphoto/status/1175863716455301121

https://twitter.com/davidmccphoto/status/1175863943346249728

https://twitter.com/davidmccphoto/status/1176100607494688768

[TransitZilla]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

The increase in capacity usually does not impact individual customers. Since ridership has been flat on the Trillium Line for a number of years, travel times are the most important consideration. Net average travel times have increased.

I recall being unable to get on an O-Train at Greenboro before the upgrade. The lack of capacity certainly did have an impact if you couldn't get on a train.