Confederation Line (Stage 1) | In Service 1.0

[OCCheetos]

When considering the risk involved with investing $2.1 billion into a transit line, being concerned with the quality of a new product from a reputable manufacturer is dumb.

And besides, no one took any issue with these vehicles years ago when they were selected and frankly no one would have cared if nothing had gone wrong. This isn't bleeding edge tech, it's "leading edge" I guess if you consider the "winterization" to be special, but we are not the guinea pigs people are making us out to be.

[J.OT13]

From Chris Rands' Twitter.

"Exciting goings on at Tunney’s Pasture station-the platform part of Derek Root’s art installation “Gradient Space” is being put together(coloured panels along the platform retaining walls) #ottlrt @CBCOttawa"



https://twitter.com/chrisrands/status/1149676985829998592

[Badyouken]

I'm always impressed how snug everything all fits together - the train, platform, overhead, etc. Small clearances all around.

[kmcamp]

Originally Posted by Gat-Train

I understand going with LRT instead of light metro. What doesn't make sense is using a vehicle that hasn't been used once in North America. There are literally dozens of LRT systems on this continent—we could easily have gone with a proven model if we hadn't insisted on this absurd policy of municipal protectionism.

By far the most common model in North America is the Siemens s70, which was automatically disqualified due to the lawsuit around the previous lrt plan. I think it would have been a poorer choice due to its short configuration (and if you change it turns are no longer going with the proven choice). Really it's not the delay that bugs me such as the perpetual "everything is on time, just peachy, oops not so much), also delays on the construction part, which really can't be excused, slowed everything down, slowing testing, which in turn slowed construction because they didn't want to finish too early. I really feel like RTG created a feedback loop that made the delays worse than they needed to be. Octranspo compounded things by running ahead with changes when they knew the train wasn't close to ready

[OCCheetos]

https://twitter.com/JimWatsonOttawa/status/1150411239576743936
https://twitter.com/drivesincircles/status/1150410242288750593

A pretty big milestone. 15 trains at once! Finally!
A little more hopeful now..

[Badyouken]

Originally Posted by OCCheetos

https://twitter.com/JimWatsonOttawa/status/1150411239576743936
https://twitter.com/drivesincircles/status/1150410242288750593

A pretty big milestone. 15 trains at once! Finally!
A little more hopeful now..

Terrific. Starting to believe that we'll really ride this thing in September!

[Capital Shaun]

Lots of trains out this morning. Seems to be one every couple minutes in each direction.

I'm cautiously optimistic and a little excited!

[RomanR27]

I'm not sure if this is new or not but I noticed this morning at Tunney's the display for the next trains was showing which platform the train would be on as well.

[TransitZilla]

Stopped by Lees station while out biking yesterday.

Definitely lots of trains running and they were all doubles. The headway wasn’t exactly consistent but I did notice the announcements were much better timed than I had seen before (e.g. the warning that the train is approaching is played before the train actually approaches).

[Richard Eade]

Originally Posted by OCCheetos

https://twitter.com/JimWatsonOttawa/status/1150411239576743936
https://twitter.com/drivesincircles/status/1150410242288750593

A pretty big milestone. 15 trains at once! Finally!
A little more hopeful now..

If ALL of the LRVs are, indeed, ready, then let's see them running 16 doubles. Why is it sufficient to test only 15 doubles? That is the MINIMUM that will be needed during peak periods. In the 'olden days', if a boiler had to run at pressure 'X', then the boiler-maker had to 'stand-by-his-work' while the pressure was taken up to 'X+Y'. If the boiler blew at less than the higher test pressure, the boiler-maker was at risk. Is it only lost old-time wisdom that says that the bare minimum is not sufficient - that there are likely to be times when a little more is needed?

[J.OT13]

Originally Posted by Richard Eade

If ALL of the LRVs are, indeed, ready, then let's see them running 16 doubles. Why is it sufficient to test only 15 doubles? That is the MINIMUM that will be needed during peak periods. In the 'olden days', if a boiler had to run at pressure 'X', then the boiler-maker had to 'stand-by-his-work' while the pressure was taken up to 'X+Y'. If the boiler blew at less than the higher test pressure, the boiler-maker was at risk. Is it only lost old-time wisdom that says that the bare minimum is not sufficient - that there are likely to be times when a little more is needed?

The closest thing to testing the system beyond base capacity was running 20 singles at the end of February. That tested the Thales system through frequency and not power generation (needless to say, we now have the equivalent of 30 singles on the track).

The 4 single units left in the yard are spares. Maybe it's in the maintenance contract, or a legal requirement, to have a certain amount of spares parked in the yard ICE. With the reliability of the trains currently, that were fixed only a week ago, they might not want to push their luck and keep those spares in case something goes wrong. I don't know if any of the Stage 2 trains are also ready and used as spares.

In any case, RTG will do the minimum required to achieve substantial completion and RSA. They don't want to "waste" time going beyond their contractual obligations.

I understand your point though. It would be good for the system to be tested for additional capacity now in case it is needed sooner than we think. I'm sure many of us still question why the City decided that the initial capacity would be only slightly higher than the current volumes on Albert and Slater.

[OCCheetos]

Originally Posted by bradnixon

Stopped by Lees station while out biking yesterday.

Definitely lots of trains running and they were all doubles. The headway wasn’t exactly consistent but I did notice the announcements were much better timed than I had seen before (e.g. the warning that the train is approaching is played before the train actually approaches).

I noticed that too. The full English and French announcement plays through just before the train reaches the platform.

Originally Posted by Richard Eade

If ALL of the LRVs are, indeed, ready, then let's see them running 16 doubles. Why is it sufficient to test only 15 doubles? That is the MINIMUM that will be needed during peak periods. In the 'olden days', if a boiler had to run at pressure 'X', then the boiler-maker had to 'stand-by-his-work' while the pressure was taken up to 'X+Y'. If the boiler blew at less than the higher test pressure, the boiler-maker was at risk. Is it only lost old-time wisdom that says that the bare minimum is not sufficient - that there are likely to be times when a little more is needed?

They may do more stress tests between now and launch. It's been one day since they got 15 full trains on the tracks so it's kind of soon to assume that they won't do more testing between now and launch.

[CityTech]

If the line opens, and leads to a surge in ridership thus making the trains overcrowded (a "victim of its own success" scenario), how quickly could RTG get a few of the Stage 2 trains on the track? Could they add an extra peak period trainset or two for say, the December service changes? Last I heard they had 9 stage 2 trains complete (enough for 4 complete train sets) but I imagine they haven't done full testing on those?

[J.OT13]

Originally Posted by CityTech

If the line opens, and leads to a surge in ridership thus making the trains overcrowded (a "victim of its own success" scenario), how quickly could RTG get a few of the Stage 2 trains on the track? Could they add an extra peak period trainset or two for say, the December service changes? Last I heard they had 9 stage 2 trains complete (enough for 4 complete train sets) but I imagine they haven't done full testing on those?

I imagine the few Stage 2 trains are parked there until the Confederation Line opens. Testing Stage 2 trains could delay progress on Stage 1. And considering how many issues S1s had, who knows if S2s have similar problems. No time to troubleshoot those as well.

Cool picture from OCCheetos, aka Derek Ellis, on Twitter of a northbound train coming into Lees.


https://twitter.com/deellisd?lang=en

Also posted on O-Train Fan's photo gallery. Some great shots on that site!

https://www.otrainfans.ca/forum/gallery/

[kmcamp]

Originally Posted by J.OT13

I imagine the few Stage 2 trains are parked there until the Confederation Line opens. Testing Stage 2 trains could delay progress on Stage 1. And considering how many issues S1s had, who knows if S2s have similar problems. No time to troubleshoot those as well.

Cool picture from OCCheetos, aka Derek Ellis, on Twitter of a northbound train coming into Lees.


https://twitter.com/deellisd?lang=en

Also posted on O-Train Fan's photo gallery. Some great shots on that site!

https://www.otrainfans.ca/forum/gallery/

I'm curious what the s2 testing plan is anyway, as they won't have the benefit of a closed line anymore to run trains though their paces. I imagine they might run out-of-service test trains interlaced with regular service outside peak times, though it's going to be a much slower process than before, nor is there a big test track at Belfast to do the testing there.

[J.OT13]

Originally Posted by kmcamp

I'm curious what the s2 testing plan is anyway, as they won't have the benefit of a closed line anymore to run trains though their paces. I imagine they might run out-of-service test trains interlaced with regular service outside peak times, though it's going to be a much slower process than before, nor is there a big test track at Belfast to do the testing there.

That seems to be the standard testing procedures for other cities like Montreal, Vancouver and others that acquire new vehicles.

I'm curious to see if the new trains will be part of the regular "rotation", considering they will be ready much earlier than the first new leg. I imagine a few trains will be added to the current service (beyond the 15 doubles) once increased capacity is required.

For the bulk of the trains, if they aren't used as part of the regular "rotation", they will have a "test track" between Blair and Trim, likely around 2023 and in the west in 2024. This is assuming the tracks and centenaries will be complete at least a year before service availability of the line extensions.

[corynv]

Originally Posted by kmcamp

I'm curious what the s2 testing plan is anyway, as they won't have the benefit of a closed line anymore to run trains though their paces. I imagine they might run out-of-service test trains interlaced with regular service outside peak times, though it's going to be a much slower process than before, nor is there a big test track at Belfast to do the testing there.

They can also schedule testing for new units after-hours.

[Truenorth00]

I don’t know what the contract says about Stage 1 and Stage 2 trains. But, I, for one, have no confidence that 15 trains at launch will keep them on schedule and not prevent overcrowding. I wish they at least managed to get 2-3 doubles from Stage 2 certified and added to the train count. Starting with 18 trains would be a lot more comfortable.

[J.OT13]

Originally Posted by Truenorth00

I don’t know what the contract says about Stage 1 and Stage 2 trains. But, I, for one, have no confidence that 15 trains at launch will keep them on schedule and not prevent overcrowding. I wish they at least managed to get 2-3 doubles from Stage 2 certified and added to the train count. Starting with 18 trains would be a lot more comfortable.

I understand why they (RTG and the City) want to complete the bare minimum, that is the Stage 1 contract, and avoid any "unnecessary" delays by adding trains considering the difficulties they had so far.That said, the system will be launching nearly a year and a half late during the highest ridership period of the year. 15 double trains would have been adequate for a June-Jul opening, but not for September.

The three weeks of parallel bus service should help to alleviate this, but I'm hoping they'll be able to add at least one double (extra 1,200+ pphpd) in a short period of time.

[roger1818]

I thought the city had bought a few more trains (not the spares) for increasing capacity, though I think they ended up getting rolled into the Stage 2 build. Hopefully they will be able to get them online quickly if demand warrants.