Confederation Line (Stage 1) | In Service 1.0

[Gat-Train]

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/ottawa-light-rail-montreal-metro-transit-1.5187623

A tale of 2 subways: Comparing Ottawa's LRT to Montreal's Metro
Ottawa's 13-stop, 12.5-kilometre Confederation Line has been under construction for more than six years and missed four deadlines.

More than 50 years ago, the City of Montreal managed to build a complex, 26-stop subway system — including a connection below the St. Lawrence River — in less than five years, on time and on budget.

So how was Montreal able to pull off a project twice the size, and do it in less time?

1. Keeping deadlines
The City of Montreal designed and built its $213-million Metro with an eye on Expo 67, and in a 1963 interview then mayor Jean Drapeau promised the rubber-tired subway would be ready in time and on budget.

Drapeau delivered, and the Metro opened in 1966.

Ottawa Mayor Jim Watson made no such promises. However, he had originally hoped to have the above-ground portion of the Confederation Line completed by Canada Day 2017, and for the trains to be up and running by the following spring.

The Rideau Street sinkhole put a wrench in those plans.

2. Different safety standards
According to Benoît Clairoux, the Montreal Transit Corporation's unofficial historian, 70 per cent of the Metro's tunnels were blasted through the rock using explosives. The rest involved ripping up streets or vacant lots.

Ottawa's $2.1-billion system is less disruptive, at least on the surface: its 2.5-kilometre tunnel was dug entirely with three subterranean boring machines.

The Montreal project was also marred by a series of serious construction accidents, claiming the lives of 12 workers before the first trains ran.

With more stringent safety standards, the Confederation Line project has seen a few injuries, but no fatalities.

"We want to ensure that during construction and after, we always have something safe and reliable," said OC Transpo spokesperson André Brisebois.

3. Different technology
You might assume that as technology advances, the length of time it takes to complete such major infrastructure projects shrinks. But you'd be wrong.

According to Brisebois, the Confederation Line is a much more sophisticated system than the Montreal Metro when it was first introduced.

In 1966, human operators controlled the Metro trains. When Ottawa's LRT system finally opens its doors to passengers, human operators will still be in the driver's seat, but machines will be running the system.

Everything is computerized, but that takes more time to develop, install and to test. OC Transpo said it doesn't want to compromise the safety and efficiency of its LRT network.


Ottawa's LRT system, including these turnstiles at Parliament station, will be far more technologically advanced than Montreal's Metro when it was introduced in 1966. (City of Ottawa)

4. Public vs. private
From beginning to end, the City of Montreal was the prime contractor on its Metro project. Ottawa hired a private consortium, Rideau Transit Group (RTG).

University of Ottawa law professor Gilles LeVasseur said there's an assumption the private sector is more effective at managing projects and reducing costs, but that's not always the case.

Just ask the City of Ottawa.

"We trust the private sector because the private sector makes promises, with delivery and deadlines that seem very attractive. The problem is that they're often not able to meet the requirements, and are always asking for delays," LeVasseur said in French.

The latest deadline for Ottawa's light rail project is now August.

[Uhuniau]

Originally Posted by OTownandDown

I wonder what's less annoying for those poor apartment dwellers at Lees. The extreme loudness of the turbo-charged buses exiting the station, or the shrill whine of the tracks as trains go by at slightly less frequency?

Anyone there, or, worse, in the near-west end, who complains about the train noise, needs to haul their posteriors down to the closest station while both buses and trains are in operation, and listen with their own ears what happens when bus noise and train noise are happening simultaneously.

Hint: the trains are a lot quieter, even with their supposed noise.

[Uhuniau]

Originally Posted by caveat.doctor

while others just say the name, without any indication of distance, or even that it's for a station

The distance indicator only appears when its over a certain distance, but there should be one at that Tunneys-pointing location for sure.

[Uhuniau]

Originally Posted by OCCheetos

Well, although there are plenty of inconsistencies and oddities with the signage, one nice feature I noticed at Hurdman today is that the stop flags now have small placards at about chest level that indicate the platform letter and stop code in print as well as in braille. A useful accessibility feature.

This has been a bug of mine for years: why is it always so hard to find the four-digit stop number at stations? This problem was supposed to have been fixed two councils ago.

[kmcamp]

Originally Posted by Uhuniau

This has been a bug of mine for years: why is it always so hard to find the four-digit stop number at stations? This problem was supposed to have been fixed two councils ago.

Better late than never, though this doesn't do anything for regular bus stops

[harls]

Originally Posted by Uhuniau

This has been a bug of mine for years: why is it always so hard to find the four-digit stop number at stations? This problem was supposed to have been fixed two councils ago.

Use the Transit app. Way more reliable.

(I am not a shill)

[Truenorth00]

Originally Posted by harls

Use the Transit app. Way more reliable.

(I am not a shill)

I love it. And every transit user I know uses it.

But..... For Ottawa, the integration with STO —. Not always the most sensible connection. Or delayed updates recommends connections with buses already passed.

[pattherat]

Now this is a more balanced article from Chianello. States that not only trains could delay a full 15 coupled running, mentions rail kinks from heat, and also mentions that they are being repaired. Also mentions assembly move, but also mentions workers in Ottawa won’t lose their jobs. More like this and I would decrease my criticism of her:

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/finishing-lrt-sunday-achievable-1.5199690

[J.OT13]

SNC Lavalin's poposed LeBreton Station, part of their N/S LRT submission.



http://strasmanarch.com/projects/ottawa-north-south-light-rail-transit/

[J.OT13]

Some great shots from David Bellerive.

Pimisi













Bayview





https://twitter.com/dbellerive15/status/1147678432727359488

[Badyouken]

Great shots - Pimisi and Bayview are beautiful stations.

Can't say the same about those SNC renderings...

[J.OT13]

Originally Posted by Badyouken

Great shots - Pimisi and Bayview are beautiful stations.

Can't say the same about those SNC renderings...

SNC lost the 2006 bid to Siemens, which was subsequently canceled of course. I assume the winning bid had a similar bare-bones design. I thought it would be interesting to see the contrast between what would have been built in 2006-2009 and what we ended up with, which is much more elaborate, yet takes a whole lot less space.

[Truenorth00]

Originally Posted by J.OT13

SNC lost the 2006 bid to Siemens, which was subsequently canceled of course. I assume the winning bid had a similar bare-bones design. I thought it would be interesting to see the contrast between what would have been built in 2006-2009 and what we ended up with, which is much more elaborate, yet takes a whole lot less space.

It's also interesting to see the changes from the Transitway stations themselves. At least to me living beside Cyrville. The LRT station is much larger and better equipped than the bus station that was there. And I am sure there's developers (like Richcraft) just waiting for the LRT to open before their construction crews swarm the area.

What's also interesting to me is St-Laurent. I kinda wish they had budgeted for a new bus terminal. Can be done later. And not necessary. But that infrastructure is really showing its age. And all the shelters reflect the same crappy design ideas of decades past.

[Truenorth00]

Originally Posted by pattherat

Now this is a more balanced article from Chianello. States that not only trains could delay a full 15 coupled running, mentions rail kinks from heat, and also mentions that they are being repaired. Also mentions assembly move, but also mentions workers in Ottawa won’t lose their jobs. More like this and I would decrease my criticism of her:

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/finishing-lrt-sunday-achievable-1.5199690

One of many reasons I dislike the coupling strategy. I just wish they bought longer trains and managed the frequency. The other surprising thing is that RTG can't manage to provide 15 serviceable doubles despite having 9 Stage 2 trains built. Alstom really dropped the ball here. I am going to bet on another month long delay being announced tomorrow.

I am just wondering if RTG is using this time to burn down on the station deficiencies list, or we'll end up with years of disruption and annoyance with construction crews working while we use the system.

[Richard Eade]

It is no surprise to me that we are having problems with the new Light Rail Vehicles (LRVs). How many of you would buy a brand-new car that was assembled from parts by the mechanic in the service garage down the street? Probably none of you (unless the price was phenomenal).

In the procurement process, we wanted the LRVs to be assembled here in Ottawa. We were building a maintenance facility so we decided to use that. Yes, we deliberately chose to build the LRVs in our maintenance bays instead of having them built in a proper factory and then shipped here. It strikes me that the LINTs are a good reference point. They were manufactured in a factory and delivered to Ottawa. I don’t remember hearing that we had to fix five of the six before they worked properly.

I can just imagine what the Alstom guy said when he came to see what the problem was: “Yeah, this is ridiculous. Any future LRVs will be assembled in a proper facility. The Stage 2 LRVs are not going to be done here.” And, so, the announcement of the new Brampton facility taking on the Stage 2 LRV assembly.

The Brampton factory will have the capacity to finish 3 LRVs per month. In Ottawa, we have started 9 Stage 2 LRVs (No, they are not complete and tested!); but that has taken us how long? It surely takes a lot longer when the original LRVs need so much re-working. Remember, there are only so many resources available at the Belfast Yard. Once those resources can be dedicated to assembling the new LRVs, things should move a bit faster; which means that they are expecting to have 13 in production in November – so four more in four months.

[Badyouken]

So, FEDCO on Wednesday? Will we find out whether they have successfully fixed all the LRVs by July 7, as had been predicted?

[J.OT13]

Originally Posted by Badyouken

So, FEDCO on Wednesday? Will we find out whether they have successfully fixed all the LRVs by July 7, as had been predicted?

I think so. I assume that was the main motivation for moving up the meeting from last Tuesday.

[kmcamp]

Originally Posted by Richard Eade

It is no surprise to me that we are having problems with the new Light Rail Vehicles (LRVs). How many of you would buy a brand-new car that was assembled from parts by the mechanic in the service garage down the street? Probably none of you (unless the price was phenomenal).

In the procurement process, we wanted the LRVs to be assembled here in Ottawa. We were building a maintenance facility so we decided to use that. Yes, we deliberately chose to build the LRVs in our maintenance bays instead of having them built in a proper factory and then shipped here. It strikes me that the LINTs are a good reference point. They were manufactured in a factory and delivered to Ottawa. I don’t remember hearing that we had to fix five of the six before they worked properly.

I can just imagine what the Alstom guy said when he came to see what the problem was: “Yeah, this is ridiculous. Any future LRVs will be assembled in a proper facility. The Stage 2 LRVs are not going to be done here.” And, so, the announcement of the new Brampton facility taking on the Stage 2 LRV assembly.

The Brampton factory will have the capacity to finish 3 LRVs per month. In Ottawa, we have started 9 Stage 2 LRVs (No, they are not complete and tested!); but that has taken us how long? It surely takes a lot longer when the original LRVs need so much re-working. Remember, there are only so many resources available at the Belfast Yard. Once those resources can be dedicated to assembling the new LRVs, things should move a bit faster; which means that they are expecting to have 13 in production in November – so four more in four months.

It had a lot to do with Canadian content rules, which didn't apply to the Lint purchase, but is always required with multibillion dollar projects like these. Alstom didn't have a factory in Canada, nor was our order in and of itself large enough to justify one. Now with Metrolinx on board for additional trains, there's enough to justify a full fledged facility here.

However, I doubt that would have made a big difference on initial quality for the first production run ever of a Citadis spirit. Ask Toronto and KW how well factory built and assembled worked for them when it came to streetcars and LRVs.

[Richard Eade]

Your comment about multi-billion-dollar procurements needing Canadian content is, generally, true, but the contract was for RTG to design, build, maintain, and finance (to a certain extent) an LRT system. This is a lot bigger than the $2.1B that is being bandied about. The majority of the value of that contract was to be spent at home, already. There should have been no requirement for RTG to buy LRVs that were assembled in Ottawa any more than forcing them to use Ottawa-made road-headers. Do you think that the rails all came from a Canadian manufacturer?

Alstom didn’t need to have a factory in Canada, since there should have been no requirement for the LRVs to be assembled in Canada. That was simply a vanity addition.

And, had the LRVs been produced in Europe, I doubt that there would have been a need for the design to have undergone such a radical reworking. We have been able to live with European designed and built trains from both Bombardier and Alstom for the Trillium Line. The main reason that this is an ‘all-new’ LRV design is because it needed to be built here; with our technology, tools, and supplies.

As for Bombardier’s problems setting up a factory, that is an entirely different matter. Every new factory has teething-pains to work through. Once running properly, though, the factory will turn out reliably similar vehicles. We opted to have every LRV produced by hand in a maintenance bay.

[danishh]

Originally Posted by Richard Eade

Your comment about multi-billion-dollar procurements needing Canadian content is, generally, true, but the contract was for RTG to design, build, maintain, and finance (to a certain extent) an LRT system. This is a lot bigger than the $2.1B that is being bandied about. The majority of the value of that contract was to be spent at home, already. There should have been no requirement for RTG to buy LRVs that were assembled in Ottawa any more than forcing them to use Ottawa-made road-headers. Do you think that the rails all came from a Canadian manufacturer?

Alstom didn’t need to have a factory in Canada, since there should have been no requirement for the LRVs to be assembled in Canada. That was simply a vanity addition.

And, had the LRVs been produced in Europe, I doubt that there would have been a need for the design to have undergone such a radical reworking. We have been able to live with European designed and built trains from both Bombardier and Alstom for the Trillium Line. The main reason that this is an ‘all-new’ LRV design is because it needed to be built here; with our technology, tools, and supplies.

As for Bombardier’s problems setting up a factory, that is an entirely different matter. Every new factory has teething-pains to work through. Once running properly, though, the factory will turn out reliably similar vehicles. We opted to have every LRV produced by hand in a maintenance bay.

i know the original rfp is kicking around here somewhere, but i havent gone through it. Normally cancon requirements in federally funded procurements allow bidders to score points on canadian content in their bid. Assembling the cars in Ottawa was likely the bidders' choice, not forced on them. IIRC Bombardier would have built their vehicles at their NY factory.