Gas Prices

[misher]

Originally Posted by WestCoastEcho

Exactly. Consider how much Site C dam is going to cost, and consider that you are looking at roughly 3-4 or more projects the same size of Site C to meet all of the demand, plus all of the infrastructure to support the transmission and distribution of the power to communities; the end bill is going to be in the hundreds of billions just to do all of that.

And it is not like these projects are easy to get approved and built; consider the ongoing opposition to Site C, and the timeframe in which such large projects get built. Even if we started today to lay the groundwork for all of these projects and upgrades, it could take until the mid 2050's, assuming no delays, before all of this capacity is available.

That doesn’t even count that we need another 1-2 site C’s to power LNG should LNG be done electrically as was recently announced, more site C’s should we expand LNG. Also imagine if we start having to charge planes, boats, transport trucks, etc?

You're talking out of your ass again. EVs are great in the snow due to weight distribution (close to 50/50). AWD models are plentiful.

EVs can be made for snow but they generally have low resistance tires that do not do well in the snow. Also they use up a ton of power on heating both to keep the passengers and the batteries warm. So yes an EV can do well in the snow with the right tires but it would decrease the range significantly.

[Bdawe]

Originally Posted by MIPS

If you live in the city and commute on a highway, yes.
For everyone else Tesla's offerings are pretty useless when the snow falls and the pavement ends.

Where the pavement ends sure, but they can do a whistler round trip just fine.

many of them are even 4 wheel drive, though battery capacity does suffer in the cold.

Now the rest of that is what plug-in hybrids are for. Hell subaru even makes a Plug-in hybred cross trek

[SpongeG]

Originally Posted by Migrant_Coconut

Then as the article says, all that Alberta's done is cut off one of its biggest customers. BC can find another source, or get off oil faster - whichever comes first.

we can get it from the saudis like they do in eastern canada

[MIPS]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

You're talking out of your ass again. EVs are great in the snow due to weight distribution (close to 50/50). AWD models are plentiful.

I'm not buying 25+ year old 4WD vehicles because I want to baby rust buckets like a second child. Most people don't. Thing is that right now the only thing on the cheap end for EV's are crappy sedans. Cheap SUV's and trucks are probably another decade away.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by MIPS

I'm not buying 25+ year old 4WD vehicles because I want to baby rust buckets like a second child. Most people don't. Thing is that right now the only thing on the cheap end for EV's are crappy sedans. Cheap SUV's and trucks are probably another decade away.

Sounds like you're a niche case anyway.

[MIPS]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

Sounds like you're a niche case anyway.

No, I just live in a rural area.

[VancouverOfTheFuture]

i saw 173.9 the other day at Oak & King Ed.

i also noticed today that the price at one station was 160.9 and just down the road 170.9. talk about crazy.

[whatnext]

Originally Posted by SpongeG

we can get it from the saudis like they do in eastern canada

Or we could press the Feds to allow the import of new cars like these, so we could run on Clean BC Natural Gas.

https://www.audi.de/de/brand/de/neuwagen/a5/a5-sportback-g-tron.html

[GMD]

Originally Posted by MIPS

No, I just live in a rural area.

That *is* a niche case.

[Bdawe]

Originally Posted by GMD

That *is* a niche case.

So niche that in 2011 only 14% of british columbians were found to live in a rural area (live outside the defined boundaries of a population centre) Of that population, many are functionally suburban but simply live beyond the population centre definition, or live and work in smaller towns,

[bluefox]

Originally Posted by VancouverOfTheFuture

i saw 173.9 the other day at Oak & King Ed.

i also noticed today that the price at one station was 160.9 and just down the road 170.9. talk about crazy.

Yeah, a Chevron was selling @ 174.9 somewhere in Metro Vancouver today... but, then, by afternoon several stations were already at 159.9 or even lower. The two gas stations at 41st and Granville were in a mini "price war" and selling at 155.9 around 4pm.

The margin swings are getting crazy; usually they're only 6-8 cents a litre.

According to McTeague, the capacity issues are now trailing off along the west coast and prices will start to drop back down after the long weekend.

Plus I'm honestly skeptical "I'll turn off the taps the minute I'm sworn in" was anything more than campaign bluster. What we heard from Horgan and Kenney last night and today was encouraging as far as finding a suitable compromise that makes everyone as happy as possible. They both sounded ready to get to work. The wild card might end up being Trudeau/Ottawa.

[Trainguy]

Originally Posted by bluefox

Yeah, a Chevron was selling @ 174.9 somewhere in Metro Vancouver today... but, then, by afternoon several stations were already at 159.9 or even lower. The two gas stations at 41st and Granville were in a mini "price war" and selling at 155.9 around 4pm.

The margin swings are getting crazy; usually they're only 6-8 cents a litre.

According to McTeague, the capacity issues are now trailing off along the west coast and prices will start to drop back down after the long weekend.

Plus I'm honestly skeptical "I'll turn off the taps the minute I'm sworn in" was anything more than campaign bluster. What we heard from Horgan and Kenney last night and today was encouraging as far as finding a suitable compromise that makes everyone as happy as possible. They both sounded ready to get to work. The wild card might end up being Trudeau/Ottawa.

Paid $1.18 Can/L in Bellingham this week on my monthly shopping trip. Lots of people are crossing and gassing and it will only get worse.

[Alex Mackinnon]

Originally Posted by WestCoastEcho

Exactly. Consider how much Site C dam is going to cost, and consider that you are looking at roughly 3-4 or more projects the same size of Site C to meet all of the demand, plus all of the infrastructure to support the transmission and distribution of the power to communities; the end bill is going to be in the hundreds of billions just to do all of that.

And it is not like these projects are easy to get approved and built; consider the ongoing opposition to Site C, and the timeframe in which such large projects get built. Even if we started today to lay the groundwork for all of these projects and upgrades, it could take until the mid 2050's, assuming no delays, before all of this capacity is available.

More like $50B if you did 4 of those sized projects in 2019 dollars. Keep in mind the LNG Canada project in Kitimat is worth $40B and doesn't do actually produce any energy, it just repackages natural gas for export. Energy spends are typically really big numbers, and scaling general is a positive thing.

$50B would be something like 20% of BC's annual GDP. Alberta has had several years where that much in capital was spent in the oil sands in a given year. Repurpose some of that capital spending on electrical generation in BC and you could easily produce enough energy in BC with a few big projects. It would hardly be impossible.

So far the province has barely tapped it's wind potential, solar, geothermal, pumped storage, and still has many potential hydro sites.

[WestCoastEcho]

Originally Posted by Alex Mackinnon

More like $50B if you did 4 of those sized projects in 2019 dollars. Keep in mind the LNG Canada project in Kitimat is worth $40B and doesn't do actually produce any energy, it just repackages natural gas for export. Energy spends are typically really big numbers, and scaling general is a positive thing.

$50B would be something like 20% of BC's annual GDP. Alberta has had several years where that much in capital was spent in the oil sands in a given year. Repurpose some of that capital spending on electrical generation in BC and you could easily produce enough energy in BC with a few big projects. It would hardly be impossible.

So far the province has barely tapped it's wind potential, solar, geothermal, pumped storage, and still has many potential hydro sites.

Problem is that 4 Site C equivalents is actually an estimate on the very low end; some estimates lean more towards the 7-8 Site C equivalents, excluding any power demands for things such as changing every building over to electrical heating.

Don't forget the cost of transmission line upgrades, and the fact that it's very likely that many native groups will scream bloody murder over more dams...

[SpongeG]

169.9 at the Esso on North Road. 127.9 in Ft St John up north, 145.9 in High Level Alberta and 129.9 in Peace River Ab area today.

[bluefox]

Originally Posted by SpongeG

169.9 at the Esso on North Road. 127.9 in Ft St John up north, 145.9 in High Level Alberta and 129.9 in Peace River Ab area today.

Here's an even better swing that you didn't even need to leave the city to see.

178.9 at the Husky in Tilbury at noon.

146.9 at the Chevron at Granville/SW Marine at 8pm.

[casper]

Originally Posted by WestCoastEcho

Problem is that 4 Site C equivalents is actually an estimate on the very low end; some estimates lean more towards the 7-8 Site C equivalents, excluding any power demands for things such as changing every building over to electrical heating.

Don't forget the cost of transmission line upgrades, and the fact that it's very likely that many native groups will scream bloody murder over more dams...

I know this is not popular in BC, however the logical choice are a few CANDU nuclear power plants up in northern BC near Prince Rupert or Terrace to keep loses low.

Despite being the most logical next step, anyone who suggests such a thing must .....

[Alex Mackinnon]

Originally Posted by WestCoastEcho

Problem is that 4 Site C equivalents is actually an estimate on the very low end; some estimates lean more towards the 7-8 Site C equivalents, excluding any power demands for things such as changing every building over to electrical heating.

Don't forget the cost of transmission line upgrades, and the fact that it's very likely that many native groups will scream bloody murder over more dams...

That really depends where you are in the province. Some FN groups are pretty active in resource development and energy. I wouldn't be surprised if the Tahltan or other groups up north would jump on the chance to have a geothermal plant.

When I was helping build the Forrest Kerr RoR a few years ago, there was lots of involvement from FN Development Corps. It really depends where in the province you are, and if there is a desire for industrial development. The more northerly FN groups tend to be more active in looking for industry to boost their economic prospects. Unlike groups down in the southwest of the province, they can't rest on their laurels with valuable land holdings.

[SpongeG]

I was in Richmond this evening and gas 155.9 at Superstore with a long lineup and as I was turning around down the road by Domo they dropped from 159.9 to 155.9 and no line up.

[Trainguy]

Originally Posted by SpongeG

I was in Richmond this evening and gas 155.9 at Superstore with a long lineup and as I was turning around down the road by Domo they dropped from 159.9 to 155.9 and no line up.

But SS gives you another 7 cents off in points if you have one of their MC like I do. Still 155.9 is a rip off...