The Butterfly | 178.6m | 57Fl | Completed - Page 23

officedweller · #**441** Posted **Apr 16, 2019, 7:36 AM**

It may become more common if punched windows become preferred to reduce solar gain.
i.e. Mondrian towers in Downtown South.

Dimswitch · #**442** Posted **Apr 17, 2019, 1:58 AM**

So who has to change status from proposed to under construction?

retro_orange · #**443** Posted **Apr 17, 2019, 4:59 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dimswitch

So who has to change status from proposed to under construction?

Still gotta dig the parkade.

osirisboy · #**444** Posted **Apr 17, 2019, 2:23 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by retro_orange

Still gotta dig the parkade.

Hilarious 😂

LeftCoaster · #**445** Posted **Apr 17, 2019, 5:56 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dimswitch

So who has to change status from proposed to under construction?

It's not under construction yet. They're just excavating.

osirisboy · #**446** Posted **Apr 18, 2019, 12:52 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by LeftCoaster

It's not under construction yet. They're just excavating.

Lol well in the real world it's under construction

Dimswitch · #**447** Posted **Apr 18, 2019, 1:38 AM**

So why is that sign right there at the site saying it's now under construction? Think we need clarification as to what under construction actually means.

VancouverOfTheFuture · #**448** Posted **Apr 18, 2019, 1:42 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dimswitch

So why is that sign right there at the site saying it's now under construction? Think we need clarification as to what under construction actually means.

on here it seems to mean the crane is up.

even though excavating it is under construction. just like how an approved project is still considered proposed here as there is no such thing...

Dimswitch · #**449** Posted **Apr 18, 2019, 1:59 AM**

So I ask, who is this "here" person (hope it's not that goof in Toronto I've clashed with before)? If the people putting up the Butterfly say it's under construction, then it is, and how can some outside party say it's not? Especially a party that has nothing to do with the building or the City or any official status other than this skyscraper web-site.

Prometheus · #**450** Posted **Apr 18, 2019, 2:20 AM**

Do you see any building yet, even the tiniest portion of the foundational floor? If you do, point it out.

Metro-One · #**451** Posted **Apr 18, 2019, 3:03 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dimswitch

So I ask, who is this "here" person (hope it's not that goof in Toronto I've clashed with before)? If the people putting up the Butterfly say it's under construction, then it is, and how can some outside party say it's not? Especially a party that has nothing to do with the building or the City or any official status other than this skyscraper web-site.

It is just how things go on this forum for a few reasons:

One, nothing is yet being constructed (no foundation, no structure). The same reason why site demolition does not count as under construction.

Second, the 2008 recession taught us that many many projects can stop at the excavation phase. (Of course they can stop at any phase, but digging a hole is far less of a commitment than actually having a structure underway, therefore it is a far more common phase to stop at).

Third, we could add other titles such as approved, site prep, topped out, etc... but then that becomes too much to handle.

In the end there is a good case for officially stating “under construction” at both phases (at excavation and at starting the foundation) which then means it is not really worth arguing over to have changed.

osirisboy · #**452** Posted **Apr 18, 2019, 3:11 AM**

Lol well I think there were more projects stopped after they started the foundation than after excavation lol. And besides if it does get cancelled or on hold then it should be noted as such regardless of what stage it's at.

osirisboy · #**453** Posted **Apr 18, 2019, 3:13 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Prometheus

Do you see any building yet, even the tiniest portion of the foundational floor? If you do, point it out.

Ugh. The "project" is under construction. Don't be so literal.

I don't think people appreciate the amount of work that goes into the excavation for a project and how specific it is done for each project. Do you think it's just some random hole they are digging. They are clearly constructing something with concrete and rebar.

Join the rest of the world.

red-paladin · #**454** Posted **Apr 18, 2019, 3:20 AM**

Until the foundation is poured, it's not under construction for the purposes of this forum.

osirisboy · #**455** Posted **Apr 18, 2019, 3:53 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by red-paladin

Until the foundation is poured, it's not under construction for the purposes of this forum.

That's actually not at all true. For example in the Canada section things are U/C once excavation begins. Unless you meant "this forum" to mean just the Vancouver section

VancouverOfTheFuture · #**456** Posted **Apr 18, 2019, 4:01 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by red-paladin

Until the foundation is poured, it's not under construction for the purposes of this forum.

i still think we should get an "approved" stage. it would help so much to know what was proposed like 10yrs ago but never was approved.

we all know when these are approved thanks to the work of some forumers here, so i don't know why it isn't possible to put the word "approved" to better know that "okay the city agreed, now we are just waiting for constriction" instead everything is proposed, even things that have failed, been cancelled, or been approved. literally the 1 word "approved" would actual help people know if something most likely will happen.

but, yeah, i will never agree with the forums definition of "U/C" since digging a giant pit for it means construction has started.

if i am building a house I'm not going to be like "oh yeah nope my house is still only proposed even though I've already started digging the foundation". not it is approved with construction started.

but that is my opinion on the matter and i am out.

Prometheus · #**457** Posted **Apr 18, 2019, 4:58 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by VancouverOfTheFuture

if i am building a house I'm not going to be like "oh yeah nope my house is still only proposed even though I've already started digging...”

And yet if you stopped digging at any point prior to pouring the foundation, all you would be left with is an empty hole in the ground. Nobody could point to even the tiniest portion of a house. But surely if even a small part of your house had in fact been constructed, then you should have no problem pointing to that part.

Zepfancouver · #**458** Posted **Apr 18, 2019, 5:09 AM**

I'm exhausted from this page's thread

logan5 · #**459** Posted **Apr 18, 2019, 6:25 AM**

Who's "that goof in Toronto"? Lol.

WhipperSnapper · #**460** Posted **Apr 18, 2019, 3:10 PM**

I am and I take it as a compliment coming from Dimswitch. Beyond stubborn. It's his way or the highway. There's no rational discussion with him. Best to ignore his appeal.

Excavation is neither. It comes down to personal preference which way you lean. I've change it to under construction for now in the database to provide consistency with other developments, lists, etc.