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  #1  
Old Posted Feb 28, 2019, 2:31 AM
HypoteMoose HypoteMoose is offline
 
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New "Downtown" Arena location?

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Originally Posted by Marshsparrow View Post
Melnyk is scouting other central locations? Where? What locations? This guy needs to be run out of town.
I think that replacing the baseball stadium in Overbrook with a multi-purpose arena makes the most sense. It's adjacent to both the highway and the Confederation Line, and close enough to downtown that it could be walking distance for many people. It doesn't really matter though since Melnyk can't afford to build anything anyways.
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  #2  
Old Posted Feb 28, 2019, 5:08 PM
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Harley613 Harley613 is online now
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HypoteMoose View Post
I think that replacing the baseball stadium in Overbrook with a multi-purpose arena makes the most sense. It's adjacent to both the highway and the Confederation Line, and close enough to downtown that it could be walking distance for many people. It doesn't really matter though since Melnyk can't afford to build anything anyways.
Not even CLOSE to enough space there for an arena and parking
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  #3  
Old Posted Feb 28, 2019, 7:53 PM
HypoteMoose HypoteMoose is offline
 
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Originally Posted by Harley613 View Post
Not even CLOSE to enough space there for an arena and parking
How do you figure? The baseball stadium has a larger footprint than the CTC, it already has its own parking lot and is next door to a massive parking lot for the Canadian Tire/Best Buy. Sure you won't have as much parking as at CTC, but there's more than enough for a stadium that is directly connected to mass transit. And it's also tons more space for parking than what would have been available at Lebreton so I'm not sure why you would think that's even an issue.
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  #4  
Old Posted Feb 28, 2019, 7:54 PM
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Jamaican-Phoenix Jamaican-Phoenix is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HypoteMoose View Post
I think that replacing the baseball stadium in Overbrook with a multi-purpose arena makes the most sense. It's adjacent to both the highway and the Confederation Line, and close enough to downtown that it could be walking distance for many people. It doesn't really matter though since Melnyk can't afford to build anything anyways.

There's not enough space there for an arena and parking, even if it's right next to the Confederation Line. Also, though closer to downtown, the area is still very much an isolated island of sorts.

Anyone south of the train station is screwed in terms of walkability, especially considering everything north of Industrial Ave. is an urban desert. There are no restaurants or pubs anywhere near the area, essentially turning it into a CTC only physically closer to downtown. Oh yay, commute times may be better but that would be the only "positive."

And all of the above is rendered moot anyway by the fact that the stadium is occupied and they don't want to sell and plenty fools still want to make baseball work in this city.

And before anyone suggests Hurdman, I'd basically raise the same points. LeBreton iis really the only good place for a new downtown/centrally located arena.
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  #5  
Old Posted Feb 28, 2019, 7:59 PM
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waterloowarrior waterloowarrior is offline
 
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New Downtown Arena location?

Let the speculation begin... going to use a loose definition of downtown for this thread.

https://ottawacitizen.com/news/local-news/lebreton-flats-redevelopment-talks-have-failed-ncc-says
Quote:
“We are devastated that the dream has been shattered,” Melnyk said in a written statement. He said Capital Sports Management Inc. has invested thousands of hours of planning time to make the bid succeed. He suggested the company was still looking at other central locations for the new arena.

“More than ever, we are determined and committed to explore alternative approaches in central locations that could accommodate a world-class hub. We are here for the longterm and want a world class venue where Ottawans will live, work, play and enjoy the best the city has to offer.

Last edited by waterloowarrior; Feb 28, 2019 at 8:12 PM.
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  #6  
Old Posted Feb 28, 2019, 8:01 PM
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Wouldn't shock me at all if Melnyk's next attempt was some sort of lame duck attempt at building an arena paired with the Rideau-Carleton Raceway casino. The sooner he's gone as owner the sooner we can all move on from this nonsense.
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  #7  
Old Posted Feb 28, 2019, 8:03 PM
HypoteMoose HypoteMoose is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jamaican-Phoenix View Post
Anyone south of the train station is screwed in terms of walkability, especially considering everything north of Industrial Ave. is an urban desert. There are no restaurants or pubs anywhere near the area, essentially turning it into a CTC only physically closer to downtown. Oh yay, commute times may be better but that would be the only "positive."
Well I'm not suggesting just leaving the area as is and directly swapping out the baseball stadium for a hockey rink. I think that whole stretch of Coventry is primed for redevelopment.
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  #8  
Old Posted Feb 28, 2019, 8:11 PM
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The federal government owns most of the large sites near the core. 530 Tremblay, Confederation Heights, and Tunney's Pasture, could be options.
http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?t=198948

The inner suburbs could also be looked at. Centrepoint could be a good option for a City or Provincially owned site and help create the downtown for Nepean. Maybe a new Sensplex for Barbara Ann Scott arena
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  #9  
Old Posted Feb 28, 2019, 8:24 PM
c_speed3108 c_speed3108 is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by waterloowarrior View Post
The federal government owns most of the large sites near the core. 530 Tremblay, Confederation Heights, and Tunney's Pasture, could be options.
http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?t=198948

The inner suburbs could also be looked at. Centrepoint could be a good option for a City or Provincially owned site and help create the downtown for Nepean. Maybe a new Sensplex for Barbara Ann Scott arena
The Hurdman area jumped out to me.
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  #10  
Old Posted Feb 28, 2019, 8:25 PM
c_speed3108 c_speed3108 is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HypoteMoose View Post
Well I'm not suggesting just leaving the area as is and directly swapping out the baseball stadium for a hockey rink. I think that whole stretch of Coventry is primed for redevelopment.
What could be interesting is if Canadian Tire decided to move to St Laurent (like Carlingwood).
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  #11  
Old Posted Feb 28, 2019, 8:33 PM
dougvdh dougvdh is offline
 
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Originally Posted by c_speed3108 View Post
What could be interesting is if Canadian Tire decided to move to St Laurent (like Carlingwood).
I was wondering about this a couple days ago. Physically it fit, but to make a good mixed use project would require some additional land acquisition beyond just the ball diamond and the parking lot.

Also, the transit connections are not as good since it would have access to only one LRT line vs the two for the Lebreton site.

canadian tire center by Doug van den Ham, on Flickr
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  #12  
Old Posted Feb 28, 2019, 8:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by c_speed3108 View Post
The Hurdman area jumped out to me.
Me as well, but it is also NCC owned. I don't think they would touch Melnyk with a 10-foot pole anymore (rightly so).
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  #13  
Old Posted Feb 28, 2019, 8:36 PM
TransitZilla TransitZilla is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dougvdh View Post
I was wondering about this a couple days ago. Physically it fit, but to make a good mixed use project would require some additional land acquisition beyond just the ball diamond and the parking lot.

Also, the transit connections are not as good since it would have access to only one LRT line vs the two for the Lebreton site.

canadian tire center by Doug van den Ham, on Flickr
What about the RCMP campus across Vanier Pkwy? Is there anything actually still going on there? Hasn't most of what was there moved to Barrhaven?
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  #14  
Old Posted Feb 28, 2019, 8:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HypoteMoose View Post
Well I'm not suggesting just leaving the area as is and directly swapping out the baseball stadium for a hockey rink. I think that whole stretch of Coventry is primed for redevelopment.
It would be a shame to go to the trouble of moving the arena from Kanata only to have it land there. While sort of central, if you consider the train station central, it is decades from being a walkable urban neighbourhood that could become a true entertainment district. It's also far from the downtown workforce, and not easily accessible from Gatineau. Also, it would mean we lose a perfectly good baseball stadium.
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  #15  
Old Posted Feb 28, 2019, 8:47 PM
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Hurdman is really the only other viable option. That said, constructing on the garage dump lands would be fairly expensive so the devil would be in the details of the engineering analysis.

For those saying the baseball stadium doesn't have enough land for parking- the plans for LeBreton didn't involve a sea of surface parking.

The only option for a downtown walkable entertainment district is the Flats.

But that does not mean you could not have a great stadium district at Hurdman, the baseball stadium/RCMP campus or other non-blank slate site.
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  #16  
Old Posted Feb 28, 2019, 8:51 PM
Mikeed Mikeed is offline
 
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This is an urban planning students work on a Hurdman TOD development.

https://www.queensu.ca/geographyandplann...ocuments/Hurdman_Executive%20Summary.pdf
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  #17  
Old Posted Feb 28, 2019, 8:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikeed View Post
Hurdman is really the only other viable option. That said, constructing on the garage dump lands would be fairly expensive so the devil would be in the details of the engineering analysis.

For those saying the baseball stadium doesn't have enough land for parking- the plans for LeBreton didn't involve a sea of surface parking.

The only option for a downtown walkable entertainment district is the Flats.

But that does not mean you could not have a great stadium district at Hurdman, the baseball stadium/RCMP campus or other non-blank slate site.
Hurdman with a bridge over the river to access Main St. is a possibility. Probably not one that Old Ottawa East locals would relish. But unless you have access to an area that can sustain bars and restaurants on non-event nights, you'll never have a proper entertainment district.


I know it's not on the train, but Billings Bridge is actually a reasonable option. On the transitway, access to the bars in Old Ottawa South and lots of potential to jumpstart the traditional Main St. on Bank St. south of the river. The RA Centre also has potential for redevelopment that way.

Still, both are hard to access from Gatineau, and a long way from where people work. It keeps coming back to Lebreton. I really hope that they keep an arena parcel when they redevelop.
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  #18  
Old Posted Feb 28, 2019, 8:58 PM
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Kitchissippi Kitchissippi is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by c_speed3108 View Post
What could be interesting is if Canadian Tire decided to move to St Laurent (like Carlingwood).
Or tear down the old Sears and tack the arena on to the mall

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  #19  
Old Posted Feb 28, 2019, 9:09 PM
Capital Shaun Capital Shaun is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bradnixon View Post
What about the RCMP campus across Vanier Pkwy? Is there anything actually still going on there? Hasn't most of what was there moved to Barrhaven?
There's still a lot of staff (mostly civilian) located there.
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  #20  
Old Posted Feb 28, 2019, 9:28 PM
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https://ottawacitizen.com/news/local-new...ottawa-senators-consider-for-a-new-arena

If not LeBreton Flats, what other central location could the Ottawa Senators consider for a new arena?
JON WILLING Updated: February 28, 2019
OTTAWA CITIZEN

If the Ottawa Senators want to relocate to a central site, and if that site isn’t going to be LeBreton Flats, then the hunt is on for a big chunk of land along the LRT line.

LeBreton Flats isn’t completely out of the question for the Senators after its RendezVous LeBreton partnership with Trinity Developments failed. No one has said team owner Eugene Melnyk wouldn’t be able to participate in a future procurement process by the National Capital Commission. A public appetite to build an arena at LeBreton, and Mayor Jim Watson’s interest in the move, works in the club’s favour.

But there’s no guarantee the Senators would convince the NCC to give them another shot.

So, where’s the best place to put an arena, if not the Flats?

“That’s not an easy question to ask and there would be experts in siting and marketing who would look into what the team’s needs actually are,” said Stephen Willis, the city’s general manager of planning, infrastructure and economic development.

A building the size of an NHL-calibre arena would likely require a land rezoning application for locations in much of the city, he noted.

“There would be significant public process around that. They would have to bring a site, bring a proposal, bring all their studies to demonstrate it,” Willis said. “If that’s what they wish to do, we look forward to having that conversation with them, but it’s very early days.”

Willis said the city’s planning department hasn’t considered where else in the central area, along the LRT system, the Senators could build a new arena.

The LRT part is critical: one of the reasons for spending more than $6 billion on a municipal rail system is to keep people from driving their cars to major destinations.

There has been some work done by the city on locating new sports facilities, although the research is 10 years old and many of the land uses have changed.

When the city was faced with a decision on whether to back a return of the Canadian Football League or a bid by the Senators to pursue a Major League Soccer franchise, it commissioned a study to look at possible sites for a new sports and entertainment facility. A consultant in 2008 identified 23 sites, and of those, only eight could be considered somewhat central, and only six are close to a current or future Confederation Line or Trillium Line station.

As for government-owned land, the city-owned baseball stadium on Coventry Road is connected by a pedestrian bridge to a future LRT station at the Via Rail terminal, but the land probably isn’t large enough to hold a major entertainment facility like an NHL arena. Plus, it could mean kicking out the Can-Am League baseball team, which has the lease until the end of 2024, and tearing down the stadium.

City-owned land near Bayview Station might have been attractive 10 years ago, but the city backed the construction of the Innovation Centre, which is expected to expand on the municipal property. (For this option, the 2008 study also lumped in the Tom Brown Arena property.)

The study highlighted the federal land at the far east end of the Central Experimental Farm, but now a new Ottawa Hospital Civic campus will be constructed there.

As for private property, the study suggested Lincoln Fields mall, which will have an LRT stop after the Stage 2 construction, but the mall owner, RioCan, is already pursuing a redevelopment.

The City Centre complex and the old Plouffe Park federal warehouse land, between Somerset Street and Gladstone Avenue, were raised as possibilities in 2008, but much of the Plouffe Park land has been scooped up by Ottawa Community Housing. City Centre has been eyed for future high-rise development.

In spitballing other possibilities, the redevelopment vision for the 49-acre Tunney’s Pasture land closely resembles the NCC’s vision for LeBreton Flats. Both contemplate a new mixed-use community near an LRT station. There’s already a redevelopment blueprint for Tunney’s Pasture in the form of a master plan approved in 2014. It has been a long-term redevelopment plan, though, since the campus is still very much a federal employment node.

There are other large chunks of federal land along the east-west LRT route through the central area that might hold potential.

There are 38 hectares of city and NCC-owned land available around Hurdman Station, and the city has sketched out a transit-orientated development plan for the property, but one downside is it’s a bit secluded. Plus, some of the land is a former landfill, so there could be costly soil remediation required.

At the easternmost part of the central area, the feds own land where St. Laurent Boulevard meets Highway 417. Coun. Jean Cloutier wants the community to be involved in the planning process for any future development on the property.

Of course, any land would come with a price and the federal and municipal governments, just like the private sector, would likely want market value. And that’s before the cost of an arena and not accounting for complementary developments, like restaurants and other mixed-use buildings, requiring more land.

This is why the LeBreton Flats site has seemed so perfect for both the Senators and the landowner. The Senators would have a very central location with room to create complementary attractions, while the landowner — the NCC, on behalf of Canadian taxpayers — wants to see the urban wasteland transformed into a mixed-use community anchored by a major facility.

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