O-Train Line 2/4 [Stage 2 | Greenboro to Limebank/Airport] | In Service

[Multi-modal]

Originally Posted by J.OT13

Bayview: Based on the renderings, I don't understand how people will access the east side platform. The description talks about a covered walkway at the Line 1 entrance that links the two Line 2 platforms, but I can't see that on the renderings.

This is my concern as well. Getting dropped off at the east Trillium line platform and transferring to westbound confederation line seems terrible. You'd have to walk all the way around the end of the trillium line tracks to get to the elevators and escalators, and it seems like you'd have to exit and re-enter the fair paid zone. I'm disappointed another set of escalators and elevators won't be added to the east side of the station.

Originally Posted by J.OT13

Gladstone: Protecting for a second level to accommodate skywalks to adjacent developments (as proposed for Trinity's Gladstone Towers) is not necessary IMO. The station building is easily accessible from the sidewalk.

Agreed. Trinity should instead build a second entrance from their more northern two towers to the north end of the platform. That would at least be helpful.

Originally Posted by J.OT13

Carling: This line in the description provided a sense of relief "Design and construction of the station will not preclude a future double tracking, as well as a potential connection to the future hospital site, south of Carling Avenue." This is extremely important.

It's important, but also seems to me like a pretty hollow statement... Its nice words but also means they aren't doing anything.

[J.OT13]

I too was hoping they would add a common entrance to Confederation and Trillium on the north-east corner of the station. If LeBreton goes ahead, that will the direction most patron's destination.

For Gladstone, an additional entrance on the north end of the Trinity development hadn't even crossed my mind. That's brilliant.

It worries me that 5-10 years down the line when the City is ready to reconfigure Carling Station for the new Civic, they'll need to shut down the station or even the entire line for a period of time to complete the work. Knowing how much upgrading will be needed to Trilllum now and forever, they need to future-proof any potential work so that shut-downs are no longer required.

[PHrenetic]

Good Day.

I would be hoping (silly me) for AT LEAST the complete trench excavation for double tracks all the way from Bayview right up to the Dow's Lake tunnel entrance, even if they do not plant any tracks - a bit of future-proofing. That would help reduce any future shutdowns a little. But probably not ! I am still hoping they are going to double track the Rideau River bridge at the south end of Carleton - same reason. Again - silly me !

[GoTrans]

Originally Posted by Multi-modal

This is my concern as well. Getting dropped off at the east Trillium line platform and transferring to westbound confederation line seems terrible. You'd have to walk all the way around the end of the trillium line tracks to get to the elevators and escalators, and it seems like you'd have to exit and re-enter the fair paid zone. I'm disappointed another set of escalators and elevators won't be added to the east side of the station.

You would think that the city would learn from its previous mistakes with the Trillium line, but it just keeps on making more mistakes. The first mistake was not keeping the original alignment and elevation of the CPR trackage. This would have moved the further west under the bridge on Scott Street and the Transitway. So given that they didn't do that when they built the Trillium line for supposed ease of access to the Transitway they should have changed the alignment back to the original when the tender was issued for the Confederation Line.

The best long term option would have been to build a concourse level from between the Trillium Line and the Confederation Line to provide access to both the eastbound and westbound Confederation Line. There may not be enough height to do this now. This would mean lowering the Trillium Line tracks back to their original elevation and rebuilding the escalators and stairs from the current platform.

If phase 3 ever proceeds with a link to Gatineau the problem becomes compounded because you will have both eastbound and westbound Confederation Line users transferring to north bound trains. This is why a concourse is required. Other wise you will have to build up and down escalators, stairs and elevators to allow for transfers in any direction.

As a short term solution until phase 3 is built, you could temporarily shorten the current track by moving the bumper post further south and extending the current platform at Bayview further east to connect to the new platform on the east side of the current tracks. By expanding the Fare Paid Area you would avoid the cost of additional escalators, stairs and elevators.

Once again; the city is penny wise and pound foolish. Bayview will be under construction for years and we will never have a station that will be able to handle the volume.

Originally Posted by Multi-modal

Agreed. Trinity should instead build a second entrance from their more northern two towers to the north end of the platform. That would at least be helpful.

Why should Trinity pay for the city's prior mistakes?

[lrt's friend]

Limebank: As someone mentioned, the design precludes the line from extending further. Looking at the rendering, their seems to be stairs at the back of the station that goes from one platform to another. Not sure what that one is for.

This is dumb when they have a right of way all the way to Vimy Bridge and a major underutilized Park n Ride lot just east of the bridge. The conversion of part of the N-S route to BRT since 2006 was equally stupid. The first thing they did was build Park n Ride lots that will never be on the Confederation Line nor the Trillium Line. This is the city wasting our tax money by adjusting the TMP on the fly and building infrastructure that will be permanently poorly used. Why would people use a park n ride and have to transfer 1 or 2 km away? And what kind of transit service will be offered at those locations, every 30 or 60 minutes?

[caetura]

They should drop the Bowesville station to save some costs. There is nothing built up around Bowesville today and even the long term Riverside South CDP shows nothing built on the east side of Bowesville where the station will be going. Bowesville Rd is a rural connector, not built for a lot of traffic. Earl Armstrong, even if upgraded through to Albion and Bank would not incentivize people to use Bowesville. People coming from the west (Riverside South & East Barrhaven) would use Limebank, people coming from the south (Greely) and east (Findlay Creek) would use Letrim. I'm guessing it's projected ridership will be very low and would mostly just move to other stations if it were eliminated.

[lrt's friend]

Originally Posted by caetura

They should drop the Bowesville station to save some costs. There is nothing built up around Bowesville today and even the long term Riverside South CDP shows nothing built on the east side of Bowesville where the station will be going. Bowesville Rd is a rural connector, not built for a lot of traffic. Earl Armstrong, even if upgraded through to Albion and Bank would not incentivize people to use Bowesville. People coming from the west (Riverside South & East Barrhaven) would use Limebank, people coming from the south (Greely) and east (Findlay Creek) would use Letrim. I'm guessing it's projected ridership will be very low and would mostly just move to other stations if it were eliminated.

Just remember the plans for Rideau-Carleton raceway and Earl Armstrong Road. This will make Bowesville Station more useful and much more accessible than Leitrim Station for those living to the south. Traffic is already problematic around Leitrim Station and the plans for improving Leitrim Road will likely not be implemented for decades.

[Multi-modal]

Originally Posted by GoTrans

Why should Trinity pay for the city's prior mistakes?

What do you mean prior mistakes? I was referring to Gladstone not Bayview.

At Gladstone - Trinity is currently proposing an enclosed walkway to Gladstone's southern (currently only) entrance. This is (almost) useless as people can just walk on the sidewalk to the expanded plaza. The reason Trinity is doing this is because it is seen as a public investment that will convince the City to give them the additional height for their 951 Gladstone development.

So, if Trinity built a northern entrance they would be re-allocating their public investment into an amenity that is actually useful and would improve TOD. They are not fixing a City mistake (the station would still function fine if Trinity did nothing), but they are adding to the station in a way that benefits the City and their future residents.

By the way, a pedestrian O-train trench crossing, approximately located at an extended Larch Street, is proposed as part of the Gladstone CDP... but of course these sorts of CDP recommendations are often promptly forgotten.

I sent all of this in as a comment on the 951 Gladstone development file on the City's development application website... but I'm not confident the comment be seen among all the other community comments, and if it is seen its doubtful Trinity will listen; I recall an article after the public consultation where Trinity's architect was very defensive regarding the location of their current proposed walkway.

[Multi-modal]

*Double post - deleted*

[J.OT13]

Bayview has been value engineered into something that isn't usable as a proper transfer station. The original design way back when Confederation was in early planning stages had the two lines staked east of the current location (with Trillium turning east to terminate under Line 1's Bayview platform). This also secured future interlining.

[lrt's friend]

Originally Posted by J.OT13

Bayview has been value engineered into something that isn't usable as a proper transfer station. The original design way back when Confederation was in early planning stages had the two lines staked east of the current location (with Trillium turning east to terminate under Line 1's Bayview platform). This also secured future interlining.

What are your concerns about Bayview not being a proper transfer station? It has to be, because they eliminated possible future interlining.

[Multi-modal]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

What are your concerns about Bayview not being a proper transfer station? It has to be, because they eliminated possible future interlining.

The issue is all the vertical circulation elements to / from the Confederation Line are on the west side of the Trillium Line, which creates long awkward walks for users transferring from the future east platform of the trillium line to the Confederation Line and vice versa.

[Uhuniau]

Originally Posted by OCCheetos

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/fr...wa-lrt-delays-longer-shut-down-1.5031347

Students, understandably upset that the Trillium Line will be shut down for 22 months (I mean, I am too a little) but apparently while being interviewed none of them were informed by the reporter about the replacement bus service and additional traffic measures that will be implemented to make up for it? The article makes no mention of it at all either. 10/10.

Also, why place so much emphasis on the sub-par Trillium Line replacement bus, a jostling and uncomfortable ride that doesn't follow much in the way of natural transport desire lines, when adding service to regular routes that serve Carleton could accomplish many of the same goals?

In particular, why has OC Transpo starved route 7 of resources the last number of years?

[lrt's friend]

Originally Posted by Multi-modal

The issue is all the vertical circulation elements to / from the Confederation Line are on the west side of the Trillium Line, which creates long awkward walks for users transferring from the future east platform of the trillium line to the Confederation Line and vice versa.

I presume this is the issue at Limebank also, that the user has walk around the end of the train to transfer to a bus or to walk to their destination if it happens to be on the opposite side of the train. Just so we don't have to build proper pedestrian accesses including elevators.

We make the trains twice as long and then don't adjust the design of the station accordingly.

We have designed a Phase 1 station without considering plans for Phase 2.

I just think of all those who claimed how easy the Bayview transfer is going to be.

[lrt's friend]

Originally Posted by Uhuniau

Also, why place so much emphasis on the sub-par Trillium Line replacement bus, a jostling and uncomfortable ride that doesn't follow much in the way of natural transport desire lines, when adding service to regular routes that serve Carleton could accomplish many of the same goals?

In particular, why has OC Transpo starved route 7 of resources the last number of years?

Yes, the replacement bus takes you to a transfer station instead of to your destination, even if a large portion are going somewhere other than Bayview. Even Tunney's would make sense during peak hours. And then it follows a convoluted route. Imagine a Phase 2 bus replacement. As I said, double the time.

[Gat-Train]

Originally Posted by GoTrans

You would think that the city would learn from its previous mistakes with the Trillium line, but it just keeps on making more mistakes. The first mistake was not keeping the original alignment and elevation of the CPR trackage. This would have moved the further west under the bridge on Scott Street and the Transitway. So given that they didn't do that when they built the Trillium line for supposed ease of access to the Transitway they should have changed the alignment back to the original when the tender was issued for the Confederation Line.

Not only would it be better for passengers, doing that would also have allowed them to avoid the whole legal battle with MOOSE and the CTA

[J.OT13]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

I presume this is the issue at Limebank also, that the user has walk around the end of the train to transfer to a bus or to walk to their destination if it happens to be on the opposite side of the train. Just so we don't have to build proper pedestrian accesses including elevators.

So as soon as we're ready to build Stage 3 to Gatineau (in 5-10 years), that handy little walkway at the end of the line will be torn out, at which point we will have no way to cross to the other platform or concourse.

[OCCheetos]

Originally Posted by J.OT13

So as soon as we're ready to build Stage 3 to Gatineau (in 5-10 years), that handy little walkway at the end of the line will be torn out, at which point we will have no way to cross to the other platform or concourse.

They will almost certainly put the pathway in an underpass to maintain connectivity.

[Ottawaresident]

Does anyone have the plans / maps?

[J.OT13]

Originally Posted by OCCheetos

They will almost certainly put the pathway in an underpass to maintain connectivity.

I hope you're right.