Confederation Line (Stage 1) | In Service 1.0

[TransitZilla]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

CBC late night news confirmed that only 14 trains are fully operational.

I think that wording is misleading. They are not yet certified but that doesn't mean they don't work; just that there are issues to resolve. How long it will take to resolve those issues is obviously a big question.

There was some skepticism on how much testing has actually occurred during extreme weather.

That one seems bizarre to me... they have been running trains all winter and all of last winter as well.

[Kitchissippi]

I didn't see them testing on Wednesday after the big storm and the tracks seemed covered in snow at the western end.

[kmcamp]

Originally Posted by 11a2b3

Looks neat.

For all the griping here about Lyon's asethetics, it's still easily among the most impressive subway stations in North America, although i have to admit the competition isn't exactly fierce. The grand majority of subway stations in North America have all the charm of a public men's washroom (and smell about the same too)

[jcphoenix]

Originally Posted by kmcamp

For all the griping here about Lyon's asethetics, it's still easily among the most impressive subway stations in North America, although i have to admit the competition isn't exactly fierce. The grand majority of subway stations in North America have all the charm of a public men's washroom (and smell about the same too)

Yeah count me also in the camp that thinks Lyon looks completely fine. It's certainly nicer looking than most of the Toronto stations or Montreal stations so like

[CityTech]

Lyon looks very 1960s-1970s ish and I personally detest architecture from that era, but putting aside my personal feelings and looking at it objectively its nice I guess. It matches the aesthetic of the area, so that's something.

[J.OT13]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

CBC late night news confirmed that only 14 trains are fully operational. The remaining 20 have varying deficiencies including 2 trains that are in such poor shape that it is considered expedient to bring in two upgraded replacements. Effectively, it sounds like 2 trains are next to scrap or will take a long time to bring to operational condition.

There was some skepticism on how much testing has actually occurred during extreme weather.

Although an official update about the March 31st deadline will take place as part of a March 6th meeting, it was reported that we will probably know within a week.

We'll get an idea of the status of the trains by March 6th. Even if they get 34 trains ready to go, the 12 days of continuous testing could make or break the March 31st deadline.

[swimmer_spe]

Originally Posted by kmcamp

I'd take the media reports with a grain of salt. They are on an attack angle right now, so they are being aggressively negative. For example the line that CBC is going with is "no proven track record". Incidentally the only two trains with a track record in our climate (Minneapolis specifically, which is even harsher than ours)are Bombardier's flexity and Siemens. I doubt things would have ended up much better with either. We'd be reading about Bombardier's general incompetence with various GTA projects or how were using a train that cost us tens of millions of dollars in cancellation fees when we aborted the 2006 plan.

The two "junk" trains are the ones they lost the parts for, and 10 are close to being certified, CBC is being overly dramatic.

That being said, obviously we have a problem since we're supposed to have 34, and I'm not letting Alstom of the hook.

How do you loose parts? How can the shipper be let off with an "oh well" and then not replace the parts?

[zzptichka]

How many trains we need to get going? For 4-minute interval there needs to be 15 on the rails at a time, so assuming they'll be running coupled trains that'd be 30?
I guess if some are not ready they'll be running a few single ones.

[OCCheetos]

Originally Posted by zzptichka

How many trains we need to get going? For 4-minute interval there needs to be 15 on the rails at a time, so assuming they'll be running coupled trains that'd be 30?
I guess if some are not ready they'll be running a few single ones.

The city won't accept a handover unless they have 34 operational trains.
They need the hot spare (two trains) and the maintenance spare (two more trains) to ensure operations.

[OTSkyline]

I did read in another article that some of the "unfinished" trains were only missing minor things like a handlebar or signage (which should be relatively easy and quick fixes).

Only question is how may of the incomplete trains are "near completion" with a few final touches and how many are half-complete and weeks/months away from being ready...

[kmcamp]

Originally Posted by swimmer_spe

How do you loose parts? How can the shipper be let off with an "oh well" and then not replace the parts?

Rtg lost the parts. That's why trains 35 and 36 from Stage 2 were sped up, to replace 33 and 34 until they can become operational. It all works out the same in the end

[J.OT13]

So those aren't two extra trains. They are Stage 2 trains?

Still confused. Why not just get replacements for the parts instead of two entire trains. Is it not easier to add a few parts to a couple nearly completed vehicles instead of building new ones from scratch? We're still left with two non-functioning trains wasting space in the yard.

[kmcamp]

Originally Posted by J.OT13

So those aren't two extra trains. They are Stage 2 trains?

Still confused. Why not just get replacements for the parts instead of two entire trains. Is it not easier to add a few parts to a couple nearly completed vehicles instead of building new ones from scratch? We're still left with two non-functioning trains wasting space in the yard.

It's a new batch from the factory down in New York, maybe there's some sort of minor technical difference between the two orders, or they didn't want to cannibalize parts from the new order while they try to get/find/replace/whatever the original parts.

The order for 38 additional trains had already been given back in 2017.

[pattherat]

Originally Posted by kmcamp

I'd take the media reports with a grain of salt. They are on an attack angle right now, so they are being aggressively negative. For example the line that CBC is going with is "no proven track record". Incidentally the only two trains with a track record in our climate (Minneapolis specifically, which is even harsher than ours)are Bombardier's flexity and Siemens. I doubt things would have ended up much better with either. We'd be reading about Bombardier's general incompetence with various GTA projects or how were using a train that cost us tens of millions of dollars in cancellation fees when we aborted the 2006 plan.

The two "junk" trains are the ones they lost the parts for, and 10 are close to being certified, CBC is being overly dramatic.

That being said, obviously we have a problem since we're supposed to have 34, and I'm not letting Alstom of the hook.

This guy gets it.

Just look at the history of Joanne Chiannello’s articles overall. Almost always an angle of negativity and attack, no matter if the subject is LRT or anything else.

[Admiral Nelson]

Originally Posted by pattherat

This guy gets it.

Just look at the history of Joanne Chiannello’s articles overall. Almost always an angle of negativity and attack, no matter if the subject is LRT or anything else.

I'm glad she's there, so at least someone will try to cut through the smoke blowing and obfuscation at city hall. For years city officials have cited the RTG contract as reasons for not disclosing problems to the public and have stonewalled attempts to get information publicized. And you realize that it was only last week, approaching a third blown deadline, that city officials were willing to haul RTG representatives in front of council to answer directly to elected officials in a public forum?

Separately I also appreciate that she called out the mayor and his allies for their repeated media line about only delivering a safe system, which waves away legitimate questions about the project delivery and insinuates that trying to hold RTG and the City to account for continuing delays and mounting costs is in some way irresponsible.

[pattherat]

Originally Posted by Admiral Nelson

I'm glad she's there, so at least someone will try to cut through the smoke blowing and obfuscation at city hall. For years city officials have cited the RTG contract as reasons for not disclosing problems to the public and have stonewalled attempts to get information publicized. And you realize that it was only last week, approaching a third blown deadline, that city officials were willing to haul RTG representatives in front of council to answer directly to elected officials in a public forum?

Separately I also appreciate that she called out the mayor and his allies for their repeated media line about only delivering a safe system, which waves away legitimate questions about the project delivery and insinuates that trying to hold RTG and the City to account for continuing delays and mounting costs is in some way irresponsible.

I don’t. She blows things out of proportion and seems to wantingly mislead with sensationalist headlines. She fans the flames of people looking for corruption and politicians ‘hiding’ things.

The reality is the public rarely wants to find the full picture or reasoning behind decisions/delays/etc...and are more than happy to latch onto the first thing that affirms their already held view. She exploits this for clicks.

Of course, we are both free to our opinions of the ‘service’ she provides.

[McC]

Saw a steel-wheeled maintenance vehicle of some sort with a snow blower clearing the tracks at Bayview yesterday evening. Hadn’t seen a train on the western track all week, so it seems likely that they weren’t using the tried and true method to keep snow from accumulating on the tracks, nor testing heavily through the storm and aftermath.

Also have noticed the usual copious amounts of salt being used in front of the Stations, which unless something changes after opening day, will make a right mess of everything.

[OCCheetos]

Originally Posted by McC

Saw a steel-wheeled maintenance vehicle of some sort with a snow blower clearing the tracks at Bayview yesterday evening. Hadn’t seen a train on the western track all week, so it seems likely that they weren’t using the tried and true method to keep snow from accumulating on the tracks, nor testing heavily through the storm and aftermath.

Also have noticed the usual copious amounts of salt being used in front of the Stations, which unless something changes after opening day, will make a right mess of everything.

That's not necessarily true. Running regular trains over a track during heavy snowfall can keep enough snow off to keep things running smoothly, but they'll always send proper snow clearing vehicles out afterwards to do a proper job.

On the Trillium Line the tracks are properly plowed a few days after heavy snowfalls.

[Kitchissippi]

Originally Posted by OCCheetos

That's not necessarily true. Running regular trains over a track during heavy snowfall can keep enough snow off to keep things running smoothly, but they'll always send proper snow clearing vehicles out afterwards to do a proper job.

That's not the point. What happened to the rationale that one of the "advantages" of the delay is that it would give RTG a chance to test the trains in the worst of weather? The recent storm was the best example of the heavy snowfall Ottawa can get in a short period, and that opportunity might not come around again this season (at least I'm hoping it doesn't )

[OCCheetos]

Originally Posted by Kitchissippi

That's not the point. What happened to the rationale that one of the "advantages" of the delay is that it would give RTG a chance to test the trains in the worst of weather? The recent storm was the best example of the heavy snowfall Ottawa can get in a short period, and that opportunity might not come around again this season (at least I'm hoping it doesn't )

I'm just saying that just because the snow blower vehicle is out doesn't mean that no trains were tested. I saw two near Hurdman on Thursday afternoon for instance.

Even if vehicles had been testing in or after the snow, the snowblower would have been sent out anyway.