[Surrey] Century City Holland Park | 49m, 65m, 117m, 135m | 11, 19, 36, 42fls | U/C

[Shift]

Nice to see an office tower in there. Will start to create a nice cluster around King George Station with the 2 office buildings at Hub across the street.

[Blease]

Originally Posted by Shift

Nice to see an office tower in there. Will start to create a nice cluster around King George Station with the 2 office buildings at Hub across the street.

There’s an acute shortage of office space downtown at this time, I sense Burnaby’s going to be picking up some of the slack, especially with the new office towers under construction in the Brentwood area. It could be a real coup if Surrey could grab some of this action and create a corporate district in central Surrey.

[officedweller]

and Central City 2 to the north.

[Aroundtheworld]

Originally Posted by Blease

There’s an acute shortage of office space downtown at this time, I sense Burnaby’s going to be picking up some of the slack, especially with the new office towers under construction in the Brentwood area. It could be a real coup if Surrey could grab some of this action and create a corporate district in central Surrey.

Just because there's a shortage downtown doesn't necessarily mean the demand will spill over into Metrotown and Surrey. The office vacancy rate is quite high in the suburbs and this is because companies want to be Downtown and their employees want to be Downtown.

If the office markets in the suburbs are to do better, the neighbourhoods themselves have to be better destinations where employees will enjoy being. I can't think of one that currently is.

[kh177]

Originally Posted by Aroundtheworld

Just because there's a shortage downtown doesn't necessarily mean the demand will spill over into Metrotown and Surrey. The office vacancy rate is quite high in the suburbs and this is because companies want to be Downtown and their employees want to be Downtown.

If the office markets in the suburbs are to do better, the neighbourhoods themselves have to be better destinations where employees will enjoy being. I can't think of one that currently is.

I hear what you're saying (demand for office in downtown doesn't necessarily mean there's demand for office in the suburbs). That said, "vacancy rate is quite high" is just wrong. As of Q4, the downtown office vacancy is 3.4% while suburban vacancy is 5.8%. I think 5.8% is lower than everywhere in Canada except for Downtown Vancouver, Downtown Toronto, and Midtown Toronto. These are basically historic lows in vacancy rates and the suburban market can easily absorb a total inventory increase of 3%-5% over the next several years. Also, rents are much lower in Surrey than Downtown - some demand does spill over other parts of the region.

[Flynn86]

I know of some companies looking for places outside of downtown because their employees don't want to pay for parking and do the commute downtown.

[Vin]

Originally Posted by Aroundtheworld

Just because there's a shortage downtown doesn't necessarily mean the demand will spill over into Metrotown and Surrey. The office vacancy rate is quite high in the suburbs and this is because companies want to be Downtown and their employees want to be Downtown.

If the office markets in the suburbs are to do better, the neighbourhoods themselves have to be better destinations where employees will enjoy being. I can't think of one that currently is.

The suburbs are getting more desirable as time goes by, while downtown remains pretty stagnant. So there will definitely be a drain out to the burbs over time.

[officedweller]

Once the town centres (ie on SkyTrain) develop amenities (retail, restaurants and services, etc) they'll become more attractive.
I don't think businesses will move back to suburban business parks except those who need lab or warehouse space in the same office / facility.

[Shift]

Originally Posted by Flynn86

I know of some companies looking for places outside of downtown because their employees don't want to pay for parking and do the commute downtown.

Exactly this. With the population boom in Surrey / Langley - growing at twice the rate of Vancouver proper - people are going to want to work closer to home. Downtown Vancouver is not very central to the region.

It will be a very long SkyTrain ride from Langley to Downtown. Surrey City Centre is well positioned to become a more attractive downtown within shorter commute to people living South of the Fraser - and even nearby North Fraser suburbs like New West / Coquitlam.

[Cypherus]

Originally Posted by Shift

Exactly this. With the population boom in Surrey / Langley - growing at twice the rate of Vancouver proper - people are going to want to work closer to home. Downtown Vancouver is not very central to the region.

It will be a very long SkyTrain ride from Langley to Downtown. Surrey City Centre is well positioned to become a more attractive downtown within shorter commute to people living South of the Fraser - and even nearby North Fraser suburbs like New West / Coquitlam.

Exactly this for me. I moved to Surrey Central from Langley and walk to work - 5 days a week. My car is parked in the garage and I save on gas, parking, and car insurance (pleasure use only). I think the Skytrain extension to Langley and far reaching to downtown Vancouver will make Surrey a centrifugal hub in the region.

[Blease]

Originally Posted by Cypherus

Exactly this for me. I moved to Surrey Central from Langley and walk to work - 5 days a week. My car is parked in the garage and I save on gas, parking, and car insurance (pleasure use only). I think the Skytrain extension to Langley and far reaching to downtown Vancouver will make Surrey a centrifugal hub in the region.

Vancouver’s downtown is very oddly placed and is convenient only for people living in municipalities immediately surrounding the downtown area. Surrey city Centre on the other hand is sort of the centre of gravity for the greater region, especially as people continue to pile into the regions south of Fraser. During a recent visit to Seattle to discuss the development of a high-speed train between Seattle and Vancouver, Premiere Horgan mentioned central Surrey as the proposed terminus at the Canadian end of the train line. Forward thinking for a man, who I don’t normally consider very forward thinking.

[Aroundtheworld]

Originally Posted by kh177

I hear what you're saying (demand for office in downtown doesn't necessarily mean there's demand for office in the suburbs). That said, "vacancy rate is quite high" is just wrong. As of Q4, the downtown office vacancy is 3.4% while suburban vacancy is 5.8%. I think 5.8% is lower than everywhere in Canada except for Downtown Vancouver, Downtown Toronto, and Midtown Toronto. These are basically historic lows in vacancy rates and the suburban market can easily absorb a total inventory increase of 3%-5% over the next several years. Also, rents are much lower in Surrey than Downtown - some demand does spill over other parts of the region.

Turns out you are right. Vacancy rates have plummeted in the suburbs. I remember them being in the double digits a few years ago. Looks like things have changed pretty quickly.

[Nites]

Originally Posted by Blease

Vancouver’s downtown is very oddly placed and is convenient only for people living in municipalities immediately surrounding the downtown area. Surrey city Centre on the other hand is sort of the centre of gravity for the greater region, especially as people continue to pile into the regions south of Fraser. During a recent visit to Seattle to discuss the development of a high-speed train between Seattle and Vancouver, Premiere Horgan mentioned central Surrey as the proposed terminus at the Canadian end of the train line. Forward thinking for a man, who I don’t normally consider very forward thinking.

It's true. It would be an advantage to people who live in Abby, Mission, Aldergrove, Maple Ridge, Pitt Meadows, Poco, Coquitlam, Port Moody, New West, Delta, and a good chunk of Burnaby.

Downtown is only convenient for people who live within it along with West Side, East Side, North Van, West Van, Richmond, and a good chunk of Burnaby.

[Vin]

Originally Posted by Aroundtheworld

Turns out you are right. Vacancy rates have plummeted in the suburbs. I remember them being in the double digits a few years ago. Looks like things have changed pretty quickly.

Not surprised at all. The trend started more than a decade ago. You can blame that on Vancouver's resistance to grow. Viewcones, CoV development red tapes, the concentration of population densities, resistance to grow the CBD, NIMBYism, turning road lanes into bike lanes and establishing transportation choke points, keenness to tear down vital transportation infrastructure, extreme increase of commercial property land values etc: they are all related. if you follow all the threads of this forum long enough, you would be able to see all the discussions about this.

[Sheba]

Originally Posted by Shift

Surrey City Centre is well positioned to become a more attractive downtown within shorter commute to people living South of the Fraser

Originally Posted by Blease

Vancouver’s downtown is very oddly placed and is convenient only for people living in municipalities immediately surrounding the downtown area. Surrey city Centre on the other hand is sort of the centre of gravity for the greater region, especially as people continue to pile into the regions south of Fraser.

Haven't we had many discussions on here about how downtown Vancouver is becoming the major downtown for NoF, while downtown Surrey is becoming the major downtown for SoF. I don't get why this is such a revelation now.

I'm hoping we see more mixed use towers proposed soon - that would go a long way to making Surrey Central become less town centre and more downtown.

[Changing City]

Originally Posted by Vin

Not surprised at all. The trend started more than a decade ago. You can blame that on Vancouver's resistance to grow. Viewcones, CoV development red tapes, the concentration of population densities, resistance to grow the CBD, NIMBYism, turning road lanes into bike lanes and establishing transportation choke points, keenness to tear down vital transportation infrastructure, extreme increase of commercial property land values etc: they are all related. if you follow all the threads of this forum long enough, you would be able to see all the discussions about this.

And this is why there is 4 million square feet of office space under construction in Downtown Vancouver, and another 350,000 square feet in the rest of the Metro Core, while there's only currently 500,000 square feet in total under construction in five projects in Surrey - two of them in business parks outside the Municipal Town Centre?

[osirisboy]

Originally Posted by Changing City

And this is why there is 4 million square feet of office space under construction in Downtown Vancouver, and another 350,000 square feet in the rest of the Metro Core, while there's only currently 500,000 square feet in total under construction in five projects in Surrey - two of them in business parks outside the Municipal Town Centre?

True but one could argue there could or should be more than that. I personally really can't stand buildings being reduced in size because of view cones/height limits

[Shift]

There's a lot of office in the pipe line for Surrey City Centre. Give it 10 years.

[rpvan]

Really like the renderings of this project. Seems like King George between 96th and 100th is the prime area for construction in Surrey at the moment.

Any updates on when this project is slated to begin? Not too sure if they plan on constructing each tower simultaneously.

[Cypherus]

Originally Posted by rpvan

Really like the renderings of this project. Seems like King George between 96th and 100th is the prime area for construction in Surrey at the moment.

Any updates on when this project is slated to begin? Not too sure if they plan on constructing each tower simultaneously.

The renderings are quite old and the final product will likely take on a different albeit consistent form. Also, this project have been approved for years, but no shovels have ever been in the ground since. Would really like to see Century Group get moving, since they are finished with 3 Civic Plaza, but there website conspicuously does not show this project under their Planned portfolio.