Tempe Development Thread

[muertecaza]

Originally Posted by combusean

I don't see how they would avoid hotel bed taxes imposed by Tempe. Tempe has incorporated the whole of the campus.

The big issue seems to be property taxes on facilities outside the athletic district. Novus has an enabling act that sets land lease rates (property tax) as competitive with local governments. Brnovich isn't suing over that, just ASU's ventures on Mill and University. His reading of the law is moronic tho. Excess land should be used as a source of income to support the university, and it is. No individual at ASU is getting rich off these things.

The Omni deal specifically actually does include sales and bed tax rebates as well as the property tax relief provided by ASU. This was possible because it was a three-way deal including Tempe. Omni gets 100% rebate on sales/bed taxes for 10 years, and 90% rebate for 20 more years after that.

https://www.azcentral.com/story/news/loc...-conference-center-too-steep/1020421001/

The Omni deal was always the most egregious to me. I could imagine that one being the "straw that broke the camel's back" for the conservative fiscal hawk-types. Tempe tried to justify the deal by making the point that they would be getting nothing from that land otherwise, because it's ASU land and it's currently a parking lot. But I don't find it that convincing. However you slice it, it's still a $21m giveaway. To show a "proportionate" benefit for the tax incentive, Tempe had to use a 60 year timeline to show that they'll be getting sales and bed taxes on the back end. I doubt it's comforting to anyone bothered by that deal that whoever owns the hotel (if it's even around in thirty years) will start paying taxes then.

[Spitfiredude]

I’m not going to defend Michael Crow / ASU here, especially when Crow is a snake when it comes to development. I mean the guy killed the Univ/College Ave project & tried killing the Union when he was planning to develop a parcel 500 ft to the west. This was obviously because he couldn’t get his USA basketball / Omni built, but other hotels & developments were good to go right down the street. He’s also kicked off scooters because he wasn’t making money off it. While the lawsuit might be ridiculous, he’s kinda getting karma with his complaining about city development.

[phoenixwillrise]

I think it is fantastic that ASU can reap the benefits of their own land. The money is being used to build a world class university. I think in the end they will be vindicated. Crow is thinking outside the box on many of the endeavors the university is involved in and ASU is lucky to have him. He could name his ticket at any university in America and they would hire him in a heartbeat.
These companies are still paying the equivalent of a property tax and that money is going to build world class facilities. Anyone who has a problem with that thinks small myopic ball. You would think the legislator in particular would be more than happy ASU is tapping this resource as the state is strapped for cash and has been cutting funds to the universities for years.
As far as the last comment on scooters. They are big time liability on a campus like ASU. Should they take that liability just so you can scoot around on your little scooter?
The reason the USAA basketball deal didn't happen is that the numbers on it just didn't pan out as a positive for ASU.

[combusean]

If the developer gets the bed tax rebate, that sounds like a subsidy.

Maybe Brnovich isn't off his gourd for intervening in these sweetheart deals for developers. I'm mixed in this. On one hand, government shouldn't pick and choose who gets to play along with these deals. At the same time, if the greater private market is the one that is victimized by these deals maybe they should be the ones filing suit through their respective associations rather than leaving taxpayers at large liable for the cost of the lawsuit. Now who's picking and choosing?

Brnovich might be technically right but this feels just like busybody conservative flag-waving.

[Spitfiredude]

ASU is not a world class university. It is a middling PAC 12 school in both athletics & academics. Don’t read into the rhetoric. US News ranks ASU 9th in the PAC-12. Behind UCLA, USC, Stanford, Cal & Washington (okay)....Colorado, Oregon, UA (that’s embarrassing). The idea to do what Crow is doing with land was Steve Patterson’s idea back in the early 2010s. Ray Anderson has done a great job, but Crow has done as much damage as he has good. Don’t be blinded. Having a degree from ASU is not elite & in the end that’s all that matters. Not “innovation” rhetoric. It’s also BS that he’s the most paid president in the US. The only people that think ASU is doing better than USC, UCLA, Stanford, etc. are those who buy into Crow’s crap.

[PHXFlyer11]

Originally Posted by Spitfiredude

ASU is not a world class university. It is a middling PAC 12 school in both athletics & academics. Don’t read into the rhetoric. US News ranks ASU 9th in the PAC-12. Behind UCLA, USC, Stanford, Cal & Washington (okay)....Colorado, Oregon, UA (that’s embarrassing). The idea to do what Crow is doing with land was Steve Patterson’s idea back in the early 2010s. Ray Anderson has done a great job, but Crow has done as much damage as he has good. Don’t be blinded. Having a degree from ASU is not elite & in the end that’s all that matters. Not “innovation” rhetoric. It’s also BS that he’s the most paid president in the US. The only people that think ASU is doing better than USC, UCLA, Stanford, etc. are those who buy into Crow’s crap.

It certainly has world class programs, like business. But yea, if people don't major in the right things and get accepted into those programs well... their own issue.

[phoenixwillrise]

Originally Posted by Spitfiredude

ASU is not a world class university. It is a middling PAC 12 school in both athletics & academics. Don’t read into the rhetoric. US News ranks ASU 9th in the PAC-12. Behind UCLA, USC, Stanford, Cal & Washington (okay)....Colorado, Oregon, UA (that’s embarrassing). The idea to do what Crow is doing with land was Steve Patterson’s idea back in the early 2010s. Ray Anderson has done a great job, but Crow has done as much damage as he has good. Don’t be blinded. Having a degree from ASU is not elite & in the end that’s all that matters. Not “innovation” rhetoric. It’s also BS that he’s the most paid president in the US. The only people that think ASU is doing better than USC, UCLA, Stanford, etc. are those who buy into Crow’s crap.

I said he is developing it into a world class university. If you haven't seen the progress made there in the last ten years you aren't paying attention. The Barrett College at ASU has more National Merit Scholars then any school in the country that did not exist just a few years ago. As far as those worn out ratings by US News who died and annointed them the official rating service?
The fact that ASU will let lower rated students in and then it's up to them to make it or not doesn't sit well with some educators. Props to ASU for not being snobs and elitist. It is a state school one of it's purposes is to serve the students of the the state of Arizona. Sorry but an AD even if he did come out with this idea could not implement such a plan without the President of the University behind it. It happened on Crow's watch. Name one University President that has come even close to being as innovative as Crow? Give props where they are due and get over your scooter.

[Obadno]

Originally Posted by Spitfiredude

ASU is not a world class university. It is a middling PAC 12 school in both athletics & academics. Don’t read into the rhetoric. US News ranks ASU 9th in the PAC-12. Behind UCLA, USC, Stanford, Cal & Washington (okay)....Colorado, Oregon, UA (that’s embarrassing). The idea to do what Crow is doing with land was Steve Patterson’s idea back in the early 2010s. Ray Anderson has done a great job, but Crow has done as much damage as he has good. Don’t be blinded. Having a degree from ASU is not elite & in the end that’s all that matters. Not “innovation” rhetoric. It’s also BS that he’s the most paid president in the US. The only people that think ASU is doing better than USC, UCLA, Stanford, etc. are those who buy into Crow’s crap.

Whats with the Butthurt in this post? Dick measuring contests about "elite schools" is annoying.

Unless you are going to one of the big time top colleges I dont want to hear about how X state school is better than Y state school.

And even that I am dubious about considering Harvard admitted David Hogg for being a well known political activist and Ive met Harvard, Berkeley and MIT grads I frankly didn't find very impressive.

Actually the only "elite" school Ive seen any consistency of graduates and students that impresses me has been Notre Dame.

[Mr.RE]

Driving around Downtown Tempe yesterday on Mill made me realize how much construction is going on! With all the cranes, road closures, and construction equipment at virtually every street corner, it excites me to see the future of tempe in the coming years. Once 100 mill office and the hayden flour mill gets going and the streetcar construction, Mill ave will be an absolute mess to try and drive through until 2021.

But hey, that's the price we pay for new development in a hot submarket

[muertecaza]

Facade of The Local coming together:



And the view down University is looking cool:

[muertecaza]

Not great timing given the negative press and legal challenge, but there was a presentation on the Omni Hotel last week to the Joint Review Committee (Tempe citizen committee that does design review for ASU projects). It has renderings and some information:

https://www.tempe.gov/Home/ShowDocument?id=70880

• 16 story hotel with 2 story conference center
• 21,300 sq. ft. of meeting space (significantly less than the 30,000 sq. ft. advertised at the time of the deal)
• 7,500 sq. ft. of restaurant space along University, and 650 sq. ft. of general retail space along Mill

Renderings look like the building would fit in well with the Union and Mirabella. Still of two minds somewhat on the tax break issues, but the design of the building itself seems fine.

[Mr.RE]

Originally Posted by muertecaza

Not great timing given the negative press and legal challenge, but there was a presentation on the Omni Hotel last week to the Joint Review Committee (Tempe citizen committee that does design review for ASU projects). It has renderings and some information:

https://www.tempe.gov/Home/ShowDocument?id=70880

• 16 story hotel with 2 story conference center
• 21,300 sq. ft. of meeting space (significantly less than the 30,000 sq. ft. advertised at the time of the deal)
• 7,500 sq. ft. of restaurant space along University, and 650 sq. ft. of general retail space along Mill

Renderings look like the building would fit in well with the Union and Mirabella. Still of two minds somewhat on the tax break issues, but the design of the building itself seems fine.

I love the storefront glass along university. Will fit in nicely next to Mirabella, and I like how the south facing side is different and provides a more neutral color scheme rather than the orange/brown accent color panels. Just excited to finally see some plans! Should've done a rooftop pool though like Canopy.

[ASUSunDevil]

^ WOW. Way better than I expected.

No way Crow lets weirdo Brnovich shut that one down.

[soled]

Originally Posted by Mr.RE

I love the storefront glass along university.

I have no clue how many other people feel the same way, but when I'm choosing a hotel to stay in I always want to favor the one with as much glass and window as possible. I'd rather take in expansive views than feel like I'm just waiting out my next shower debacle while peering through tiny prison windows.

[soled]

Originally Posted by muertecaza

Facade of The Local coming together:



And the view down University is looking cool:

It probably seems like a small thing on the surface, but the one thing this west entry point into downtown Tempe is missing is the demolition of that scummy Circle K across the street.

[ASUSunDevil]

Originally Posted by soled

It probably seems like a small thing on the surface, but the one thing this west entry point into downtown Tempe is missing is the demolition of that scummy Circle K across the street.

That Circle K was recently renovated, unfortunately.

[phoenixwillrise]

When it the scheduled opening and is it on schedule? I hope they have one of their restaurant areas in it where you can grab a beer and a burger or slice of pizza etc.

[muertecaza]

Originally Posted by phoenixwillrise

When it the scheduled opening and is it on schedule? I hope they have one of their restaurant areas in it where you can grab a beer and a burger or slice of pizza etc.

The Local website lists April, 2019 as projected open date--not sure if that applies to the Whole Foods as well. And the website says they will have the full bar and a mezzanine-level dining area.

https://www.thelocaltempe.com/wholefoods#

[xymox]

Originally Posted by muertecaza

Not great timing given the negative press and legal challenge, but there was a presentation on the Omni Hotel last week to the Joint Review Committee (Tempe citizen committee that does design review for ASU projects). It has renderings and some information:

https://www.tempe.gov/Home/ShowDocument?id=70880

• 16 story hotel with 2 story conference center
• 21,300 sq. ft. of meeting space (significantly less than the 30,000 sq. ft. advertised at the time of the deal)
• 7,500 sq. ft. of restaurant space along University, and 650 sq. ft. of general retail space along Mill

Renderings look like the building would fit in well with the Union and Mirabella. Still of two minds somewhat on the tax break issues, but the design of the building itself seems fine.

Are there plans to build more on this corner? Seems like there's more room...

[muertecaza]

Originally Posted by xymox

Are there plans to build more on this corner? Seems like there's more room...

Not that I know of. Yeah, it's interesting that the plan doesn't extend the conference center to 9th St. I believe Mirabella extends all the way to 9th st. more or less, and I believe south of 9th st. there's a parking garage planned. In some of the technical drawings in the packet the area between the conference center and 9th st. is just a blank blob.

Update to Tempe development map (https://www.tempe.gov/Home/ShowDocument?id=61009): 100 Mill has applied for a building permit . It's listed as just a "foundation" permit, but still, can't be bad.