San Francisco Is Suffering From The Excesses Of Its Own Liberalism

[Segun]

Originally Posted by Pedestrian

This all strikes me as complete BS. San Francisco, with a black population of 5% and change, has recently had 2 black mayors (one currently), a black police chief currently, a black DA recently (now Sen. Kamala Harris) and whole raft of second level black officials.

I can't believe people are still making these types of statements. Did I not just say "economically barred", meaning if you're Black and have money, you're ok. It has worked that way ever since the first Black Man was allowed in the White Money club.

You don't find businesses in West Oakland and the South Side of Chicago appealing to you? Ok, cool with me!!!! I'm not going to lose sleep over it!! I'm pretty sure many White people agree with you. I rarely see White people patronizing Afrocentric businesses anyway, so what's changed?

[Segun]

Originally Posted by niwell

Have you listened to the podcast "Champagne Sharks" by chance? They have touched on a lot of these issues, and very specifically with the above in an episode about Portland gentrification (the jerk chicken example pertaining to Brooklyn, though). As a middle class white urban dweller who tends to frequent the types of businesses you first mention, I find it an interesting and challenging perspective. Sometimes uncomfortable but that's a good thing.

I haven't gotten a chance to listen to it. You mean Chance the Rapper?

My theory, bouncing off my last post, is that many White people are scared of Black-owned businesses and pro-Black rhetoric. My last ex was a White female rapper. Though never mentioned explicitly, I could tell she had some apprehension on performing or patronizing businesses and events that celebrated Blackness. I've been attending events and businesses like these since I was a child. Once in a blue moon, you might see one or two White people at these events max.

[Segun]

Originally Posted by Pedestrian

This all strikes me as complete BS. San Francisco, with a black population of 5% and change, has recently had 2 black mayors (one currently), a black police chief currently, a black DA recently (now Sen. Kamala Harris) and whole raft of second level black officials.

We're also seeing how progressive the United States of America is after electing a Black President......

Right?

RIGHT?!!!

[Steely Dan]

Originally Posted by Segun

My theory, bouncing off my last post, is that many White people are scared of Black-owned businesses

meh. as a super-white citizen of hyper-segregated chicago, my perspective would be more along the lines of "many (or most (or the VAST majority of)) white people are scared of black neighborhoods".

over here in lincoln square (65% white), Luella's Southern Kitchen, a black-owned business serving up delicious soul food, has done very well for itself (even earning a michelin bib gourmand) and every time i've eaten there i've seen plenty of white people in there.

[Pedestrian]

Originally Posted by Steely Dan

meh. my perspective would be more along the lines of "many (or most (or the VAST majority of)) white people are scared of black neighborhoods".

over here in lincoln square, luella's southern kitchen, a successful black-owned business serving up delicious soul food has done very well for itself (even earning a michelin bib gourmand) and every time i've eaten there i've seen plenty of white people in there.

I once worked at a Navy base on Oakland's waterfront. I love BBQ and the best in the Bay Area has long been found in Oakland because, well, black men tend to be the best BBQ cooks (yeah, a stereotype, but very often true). I had an African-American secretary--a large outspoken woman with whom I got along famously. She loved BBQ too. So often we decided to get take-out Q from one of Oakland's best places for the whole office. She would go get it. I like cooking and wanted to go with her to see the place. She wouldn't let me--said the neighborhood wasn't for me. This was her judgement, not mine. Alone, I would have gone. As a college student I was a "soul" music fan and finally saw one of the popular groups of the time--Smokey Robinson and the Miracles--at New York's Apollo Theater in 1964 or so. Me and a couple of friends were the only white faces there (125th St). Great show--obviously, an experience of a lifetime since I still remember it well.

[Segun]

Originally Posted by Steely Dan

meh. my perspective would be more along the lines of "many (or most (or the VAST majority of)) white people are scared of black neighborhoods".

over here in lincoln square (65% white), Luella's Southern Kitchen, a successful black-owned business serving up delicious soul food, has done very well for itself (even earning a michelin bib gourmand) and every time i've eaten there i've seen plenty of white people in there.

Neighborhoods moreso, yea, but sometimes if the business has more of a blatant Black influence, you won't see too many White people in it. Southern Soul Food has more of a mainstream appeal, while a bookstore featuring the literature of Marcus Garvey, Toni Morrison, Ta-Nehsis Coates, etc doesn't. Then again, I can't think of any business like so that thrives in a White neighborhood to make a comparison with. Maybe in Edgewater? It would be interesting if someone did a unscientific study of who patronizes....say....that Ethiopian store off Granville and Broadway. I could bet money that it's still mostly Black people, even though Ann Sather right across the street is mostly White. That's crazy when you think about it!

[Pedestrian]

Originally Posted by Segun

who patronizes....say....that Ethiopian store off Granville and Broadway. I could bet money that it's still mostly Black people, even though Ann Sather right across the street is mostly White. That's crazy when you think about it!

1. Tadu Ethiopian Kitchen
598 reviews

2. New Eritrea Restaurant & Bar
699 reviews

3. Massawa Restaurant
244 reviews

4. Oasis Cafe
214 reviews

5. Cafe Ethiopia
429 reviews

6. Sheba Piano Lounge
557 reviews

7. Tadu Ethiopian Kitchen
153 reviews

8. Radio Africa Kitchen
311 reviews

9. Axum Cafe
381 reviews

10. Club Waziema
404 reviews

11. Enssaro Ethiopian Restaurant
1267 reviews

https://www.yelp.com/search?cflt=ethiopian&find_loc=San+Francisco%2C+CA

SF's 11 most highly rated Ethiopian restaurants (most of which are NOT in the city's 2 predominantly African-American neighborhoods)

[Segun]

^ Thank you San Francisco board of tourism.

[Segun]

Jokes aside, that's remimiscent of the popularity of Ethiopian restaurants in Lakeview, which is more affluent, as opposed to the Book/Clothing store I'm referring to in my example. Its similar to how in Epcot Center, there's authentic regional cuisine from around the World, often staffed with people from the country represented.

Take a West African business such as Old World Market down the street in Uptown, with grit, grime and a blue collar Ghanian/Nigerian patronage, it won't be a popular destination on Yelp, nahmean? Its a conplex issue of race and class, it's just hard to detach the two in Murica.

[jtown,man]

Originally Posted by Segun

Neighborhoods moreso, yea, but sometimes if the business has more of a blatant Black influence, you won't see too many White people in it. Southern Soul Food has more of a mainstream appeal, while a bookstore featuring the literature of Marcus Garvey, Toni Morrison, Ta-Nehsis Coates, etc doesn't. Then again, I can't think of any business like so that thrives in a White neighborhood to make a comparison with. Maybe in Edgewater? It would be interesting if someone did a unscientific study of who patronizes....say....that Ethiopian store off Granville and Broadway. I could bet money that it's still mostly Black people, even though Ann Sather right across the street is mostly White. That's crazy when you think about it!

At one point you complain about white mainstream culture, whatever that may be, and how you do not care of it and prefer your own afrocentric stores etc then you complain about how white people don't like going to black-centered bookstores.

You wear me out. You really are a professional complainer.

[Leveled]

Originally Posted by Segun

I haven't gotten a chance to listen to it. You mean Chance the Rapper?

My theory, bouncing off my last post, is that many White people are scared of Black-owned businesses and pro-Black rhetoric. My last ex was a White female rapper. Though never mentioned explicitly, I could tell she had some apprehension on performing or patronizing businesses and events that celebrated Blackness. I've been attending events and businesses like these since I was a child. Once in a blue moon, you might see one or two White people at these events max.

Celebrate blackness? Most people just want to get a bite.

I mean should a black owned subway celebrate blackness? A 7 eleven? A Walmart?

[dc_denizen]

I would personally love to see more black businesses, black entrepreneurs, investments by high net wealth black individuals in places like south side Chicago

We need more small scale entrepreneurship in this country generally.


I can’t fault Segun, if I were black I’d probably take his point of view. We should all be proud of (the good aspects of) our culture and seek to improve and develop it in our own small or big ways

[JManc]

This 'white culture' we speak of really isn't culture at all but the lack of culture. Iatlians, Poles, Irish, etc have long assimilated; go to sports bars, drive SUV's and drink — IPA's. I think black culture is probably one of the last vestiges of american culture that hasn't had the soul sucked out of it. Yet.

[sopas ej]

Originally Posted by jtown,man

I wonder, why do you think Asians do so well in America? Its not as if they haven't been discriminated in the past...

Just out of curiosity, what's your measure of "doing so well"? Maybe because I live and work in such a diverse area, particularly with a lot of Asians, I see the gamut of homeless Asians, old Asians rummaging for bottles in dumpsters, Asian UPS drivers (with some really nice calves!), (not to further any stereotypes) Vietnamese nail salon workers/owners, some Cambodian donut shop owners still left around...

I thought we were already past the point of the stereotypical "Asians are the model minority" —.

[Pedestrian]

Originally Posted by JManc

This 'white culture' we speak of really isn't culture at all but the lack of culture. Iatlians, Poles, Irish, etc have long assimilated; go to sports bars, drive SUV's and drink — IPA's. I think black culture is probably one of the last vestiges of american culture that hasn't had the soul sucked out of it. Yet.

Because you don't live in a part of the country where black isn't the dominant minority. In the Southwest and far West, depending on where, Hispanic and Asian cultures are far more influential and that seems to be a lot of what's bothers easterner Segun. He wants HIS people to be the "minority in charge" but in both San Francisco and, arguably even more in Tucson, they aren't. I don't know if Tucson even has a black neighborhood--it surprises me to see the occasional black face. It has a whole Latino city (South Tucson). Both cities have all sorts of residua of when they were part of New Spain.

[dc_denizen]

Originally Posted by JManc

This 'white culture' we speak of really isn't culture at all but the lack of culture. Iatlians, Poles, Irish, etc have long assimilated; go to sports bars, drive SUV's and drink — IPA's. I think black culture is probably one of the last vestiges of american culture that hasn't had the soul sucked out of it. Yet.

‘White’ American , non ethnic culture has a long and proud history too

[jtown,man]

Originally Posted by sopas ej

Just out of curiosity, what's your measure of "doing so well"? Maybe because I live and work in such a diverse area, particularly with a lot of Asians, I see the gamut of homeless Asians, old Asians rummaging for bottles in dumpsters, Asian UPS drivers (with some really nice calves!), (not to further any stereotypes) Vietnamese nail salon workers/owners, some Cambodian donut shop owners still left around...

I thought we were already past the point of the stereotypical "Asians are the model minority" —.

I don't know, I think that question is best asked to the person I was responding to. I assume he meant it by income only?

[Pedestrian]

Originally Posted by dc_denizen

‘White’ American , non ethnic culture has a long and proud history too

Yeah, I was thinking that too. The majority American culture is like an accent. The rest of the English speaking countries think there is an American accent but Americans don’t—they think the others have the accent. We have a culture of our own which to us seems the absence of a culture but the rest of the world recognizes as very definitely a distinct one.

And it is a successful one. It has accomplished arguably more than any other for over 200 years. And in America, people tend to be more comfortable and successful the better they adapt and the more they can participate in that culture. I believe that alternative cultures that insist on and assert their differentness limit the success and contentment in America of the people who adhere to them.

[JoeMusashi]

You really can't it both ways. "White culture" is what it is because of the melting pot and assimilation. That is the ideal and demand for minorities paid lip service by their leaders/activists yet in reality what people seem to want is "separate but equal". Multiculturalism is the new ideal of the left and promoted in the media. The last few years has seen a strong push towards identity politics. It is also why things have become so nasty.

The minute white people start drifting into multiculturalism, it is immediately labeled "white supremacy". Everyone else is egged on to celebrate their skin color, vaginas, — orientation, ancestry, etc. That is why you get things like the 2016, a rebuke of the identity politics, hypocrisy, and SJW culture.

The future battle will be multiculturalism vs the melting pot. Multiculturalism is dangerous and is making us more tribal. Textbook divide and conquer tactics.

[the urban politician]

Originally Posted by JoeMusashi

You really can't it both ways. "White culture" is what it is because of the melting pot and assimilation. That is the ideal and demand for minorities paid lip service by their leaders/activists yet in reality what people seem to want is "separate but equal". Multiculturalism is the new ideal of the left and promoted in the media. The last few years has seen a strong push towards identity politics. It is also why things have become so nasty.

The minute white people start drifting into multiculturalism, it is immediately labeled "white supremacy". Everyone else is egged on to celebrate their skin color, vaginas, — orientation, ancestry, etc. That is why you get things like the 2016, a rebuke of the identity politics, hypocrisy, and SJW culture.

The future battle will be multiculturalism vs the melting pot. Multiculturalism is dangerous and is making us more tribal. Textbook divide and conquer tactics.

Before you say this, bare in mind that the "black identity" people, like Segun (no offense), often present themselves as speaking for all minorities, but nothing could be further from the truth. In fact, they pretty much only speak for African Americans, which are a distinct group that have a different "approach", shall we speak, to white-minority relations, compared to everyone else.