Surrey City Centre Redevelopment Plans

[Westbased]

We are late in the cycle and there likely will be a recession in 2019/2020 for Canada.

I'd be worried to see a lot of projects either slow their pace or hit pause in the City Centre area while we go through the recession. That could push some of these projects back another 3 years.

Hopefully they can still proceed although more slowly.

[misher]

Originally Posted by Westbased

We are late in the cycle and there likely will be a recession in 2019/2020 for Canada.

I'd be worried to see a lot of projects either slow their pace or hit pause in the City Centre area while we go through the recession. That could push some of these projects back another 3 years.

Hopefully they can still proceed although more slowly.

Unfortunately yes.

Decent chance we might get a Conservative Federal government. However, NDP is going to be bleeding votes to the Liberals so maybe not.

[osirisboy]

Just think in 2050 it'll be maybe half decent to walk around this area

[Shift]

Originally Posted by Westbased

We are late in the cycle and there likely will be a recession in 2019/2020 for Canada.

I'd be worried to see a lot of projects either slow their pace or hit pause in the City Centre area while we go through the recession. That could push some of these projects back another 3 years.

Hopefully they can still proceed although more slowly.

At least there are quite a few at the marketing stage right now:

Park George
University Distict
Georgetown
One Central
Avani
Holland Park
Centra

Also recently wrapped up was Linea, and King George Phase D is about to launch soon.

There have never been this many projects selling at the same time in Surrey Centre ever.

[Vin]

Originally Posted by Westbased

We are late in the cycle and there likely will be a recession in 2019/2020 for Canada.

I'd be worried to see a lot of projects either slow their pace or hit pause in the City Centre area while we go through the recession. That could push some of these projects back another 3 years.

Hopefully they can still proceed although more slowly.

Better late than never. Surrey Central really needs to build out quickly to reach that tipping point.

[GMasterAres]

I think Surrey Central is fine. It is far less affected by a "Canadian recession" than anyone thinks. Micro markets across the world are typically affected by local events, not national events.

It was basically 80 years between major depressions in the market so fear of a recession is just that, fear but likely not any meaningful reality. I'd be more worried about all levels of government continuing to enact what I now call "ownership penalties" from empty home taxes to speculation taxes and higher mortgage qualification rules.

That has FAR more affect on the housing market than a potential Canadian recession which won't necessarily affect every province the same way. The last 3 recessions outside of 2009 had some provinces booming like Alberta.

[rpvan]

Originally Posted by Vin

Better late than never. Surrey Central really needs to build out quickly to reach that tipping point.

Will reach the tipping point only once the Central Downtown and King George areas are connected via developments like Georgetown or City Centre 2 IMO.

[fredinno]

Originally Posted by jhausner

I think Surrey Central is fine. It is far less affected by a "Canadian recession" than anyone thinks. Micro markets across the world are typically affected by local events, not national events.

It was basically 80 years between major depressions in the market so fear of a recession is just that, fear but likely not any meaningful reality. I'd be more worried about all levels of government continuing to enact what I now call "ownership penalties" from empty home taxes to speculation taxes and higher mortgage qualification rules.

That has FAR more affect on the housing market than a potential Canadian recession which won't necessarily affect every province the same way. The last 3 recessions outside of 2009 had some provinces booming like Alberta.

It depends. TBH, considering the extremely unbalanced price ratios and economy, it's probably a good thing on the long run, even if it's being popped prematurely. Pretty much every other industry is suffering under the weight of RE prices.

Not many people thought the Great Recession would be as severe as it became either, TBF, and that the deleveraging and recovery would take as long as it did.

There is a level of caution justified when dealing with bubbles.


I'm also somewhat concerned about the balance of residential to commercial here. I thought it was supposed to be a town centre, but aside from City Centre, most of the developments are primarily residential or partial office and residential (like King George).
Speaking of King George, where is the parking for it going? Is it just assumed it's going to become irrelevant parking-wise due to the Skytrain extension?

[rickvug]

Originally Posted by rpvan

Will reach the tipping point only once the Central Downtown and King George areas are connected via developments like Georgetown or City Centre 2 IMO.

You're right on the money. Surrey Central will get really interesting once the developments on either side meet at King George and transforms the street. Until then it feels much more like a few isolated clusters of towers. The other big shift will be the redevelopment of the rec centre site to complete the central plaza. I'm bullish about Surrey Central but more along a 15-20+ year time frame.

[GilmoreStation]

the only thing that can bring down these growth to its knees would be more social housing to accommodate the homeless and drug addicts, ruining the home prices in the surrounding area

[Hooknose]

Originally Posted by rickvug

You're right on the money. Surrey Central will get really interesting once the developments on either side meet at King George and transforms the street. Until then it feels much more like a few isolated clusters of towers. The other big shift will be the redevelopment of the rec centre site to complete the central plaza. I'm bullish about Surrey Central but more along a 15-20+ year time frame.

I am not so sure that we will have to wait 15 to 20 years.
Besides the Stardust site, I know that several lots are now in accumulation in the bulls eye of Surrey central. Of the 7 natural assemblies, three are already in the hands of developers and more are in negotiation.
Besides GEC EDU (stardust), figure two more to start by 2020. That leaves only 4 left. With the skytrain so central to that block, they are a natural.

[Shift]

Originally Posted by Hooknose

I am not so sure that we will have to wait 15 to 20 years.
Besides the Stardust site, I know that several lots are now in accumulation in the bulls eye of Surrey central. Of the 7 natural assemblies, three are already in the hands of developers and more are in negotiation.
Besides GEC EDU (stardust), figure two more to start by 2020. That leaves only 4 left. With the skytrain so central to that block, they are a natural.

Yeah, Surrey Central is going to see remarkable change in the next 5-10 years. As mentioned, about 12 new towers should get underway in 2019 alone, on top of those already underway.

I've seen the new plans underway for the Central Block / Plaza that will replace the rec centre and incorporate Surrey Central Station. It's going to be very grand and unlike anything else in the region, just wait.

[Blease]

Originally Posted by Shift

I've seen the new plans underway for the Central Block / Plaza that will replace the rec centre and incorporate Surrey Central Station. It's going to be very grand and unlike anything else in the region, just wait.

Good to hear, and I hope the designs become public soon so we're all able to see them. On a note of concern as I mentioned a few weeks ago as well, what's the risk of our mayor kyboshing this development especially as its planned on city land. Doug is a dinosaur and a grinch, I fear he'd be all too happy to quash anything too forward looking.

[Sheba]

Originally Posted by Blease

On a note of concern as I mentioned a few weeks ago as well, what's the risk of our mayor kyboshing this development especially as its planned on city land. Doug is a dinosaur and a grinch, I fear he'd be all too happy to quash anything too forward looking.

The mayor is not an emperor - he's one of many on council. I suspect they won't let him take things too far or they risk getting thrown out next election.

[osirisboy]

From what I read about him he is very supportive of high density development. He just wants it done in areas that are built to handle it, ie have skytrain etc.

[Blease]

Originally Posted by osirisboy

From what I read about him he is very supportive of high density development. He just wants it done in areas that are built to handle it, ie have skytrain etc.

I’m new to Surrey (in relative terms at least), but according to my understanding much of the truly dreadful development that happened in this city, happened during McCallum’s previous Mayorality. The strip malls, the monster homes and the colappse of zoning rules which has allowed the proliferation of ugly signage all over Surrey, all happened under McCallum’s previous term. It’s supremely ironic that McCallum of all people wants to talk about smart development.

[fredinno]

Originally Posted by Blease

I’m new to Surrey (in relative terms at least), but according to my understanding much of the truly dreadful development that happened in this city, happened during McCallum’s previous Mayorality. The strip malls, the monster homes and the colappse of zoning rules which has allowed the proliferation of ugly signage all over Surrey, all happened under McCallum’s previous term. It’s supremely ironic that McCallum of all people wants to talk about smart development.

TBF, city planning tends to be long-term, so there's a huge amount of lag-time in-between when things are planned, and when they actually happen. Note that the current town Centres are not going to be filled out until 2040+.

[logan5]

Are people now willing to pay a premium to live in Surrey, because developers and the City of Surrey have been trying to ram towers in there for decades now and it hasn't worked all that well. In the 30 years that Skytrain has been in Surrey, there has been very little TOD relative to other municipalities, where development has exploded. Sorry but imo Surrey is going to keep on stagnating for even longer if they keep trying to sell people expensive condo units in an area that offers not a whole lot in return. Forget about towers and build more affordable ground oriented and low rise housing, and purpose built rental apartments. That's how Vancouver built it's great neighbourhoods, and that's how Surrey should do it too.

[Sheba]

Originally Posted by logan5

Forget about towers and build more affordable ground oriented and low rise housing, and purpose built rental apartments.

Surrey has been building low rises - we just don't hear about them much on here due to it being a skyscraper forum...

[logan5]

There are low rises, but right now the only thing I see for sale are tower units, with a few townhouse units that are at the base of these towers. I'm far from convinced that KGB is going to get all these towers that Surrey wants. It's too late now though. Developers are buying up all the land with the expectation of high-rises.