The Great Canadian Transit Thread

[Innsertnamehere]

They meet American standards. The US just legalized euro trains last week, Canada has yet to even begin the process.

[milomilo]

Originally Posted by Innsertnamehere

They meet American standards. The US just legalized euro trains last week, Canada has yet to even begin the process.

Right, this has been in discussion over a few threads. But it was brought up that VIA almost certainly would know about the changes (you would hope), so to make a billion dollar order of crappy, inferior trains immediately before the rules change allowing you to order cheaper, better vehicles would be the height of incompetence.

[Jalapeño Chips]

Originally Posted by milomilo

Right, this has been in discussion over a few threads. But it was brought up that VIA almost certainly would know about the changes (you would hope), so to make a billion dollar order of crappy, inferior trains immediately before the rules change allowing you to order cheaper, better vehicles would be the height of incompetence.

Siemens Charger trains are not crappy nor inferior, where do you get that from? They're some the best in the world. I don't get what the the point would be with saying that. Do you design or operate trains? Are you an engineer? Do you work for Bombardier or a competitor?

And there is no "immediately before the rules change" if the rules aren't changing anytime soon. It was just said, there isn't even a process in place to change the rules to begin with.

[milomilo]

The rules in place make the trains heavier than they need to be, there are no positives, hence they are inferior. If they can make OK trains withing those rules, they will be able to make better and cheaper trains within the new ones, that's the point of changing the rules.

These trains could be in service for decades. If it takes a few years of waiting to ensure we get better vehicles, it would be worth it. However, I am asking because VIA may in fact know what they are doing.

[lrt's friend]

Originally Posted by milomilo

The rules in place make the trains heavier than they need to be, there are no positives, hence they are inferior. If they can make OK trains withing those rules, they will be able to make better and cheaper trains within the new ones, that's the point of changing the rules.

These trains could be in service for decades. If it takes a few years of waiting to ensure we get better vehicles, it would be worth it. However, I am asking because VIA may in fact know what they are doing.

Like all technology, there will always be better versions in the near future. But decisions have to be made at some point and aging equipment replaced. Those decisionss cannot be deferred forever waiting for the 'perfect' model to become available.

[Jalapeño Chips]

Originally Posted by milomilo

The rules in place make the trains heavier than they need to be, there are no positives, hence they are inferior. If they can make OK trains withing those rules, they will be able to make better and cheaper trains within the new ones, that's the point of changing the rules.

These trains could be in service for decades. If it takes a few years of waiting to ensure we get better vehicles, it would be worth it. However, I am asking because VIA may in fact know what they are doing.

These trains are beyond adequate for the infrastructure we have. They are modern, plenty fast and fuel efficient. Superior to what is in place, and the best we've ever had. They will last the decades necessary to upgrade the infrastructure to European standards, if we ever do. We don't need lighter trains.

And lighter is only better when it comes to fuel or power efficiency. Heavier is no different otherwise, and definitively not inferior. In fact, heavier has been traditionally a more comfortable ride.

Maybe do some research, lot's of info available.

[Nouvellecosse]

How do they compare to popular new models being sold in western Europe in terms of fuel efficiency, cost, and acceleration? I'm not very excited that they're "Superior to what is in place, and the best we've ever had" considering that they're new trains replacing models generally designed decades ago and in service for decades. So anything should check those most basic of boxes.

[J.OT13]

Good to see bi-directional trains for VIA. It will make it much easier to get out of Montreal Central Station.

[J.OT13]

Rideau Station.


https://www.ligneconfederationline.ca/news/construction-update-204/

[milomilo]

Originally Posted by Jalapeño Chips

These trains are beyond adequate for the infrastructure we have. They are modern, plenty fast and fuel efficient. Superior to what is in place, and the best we've ever had. They will last the decades necessary to upgrade the infrastructure to European standards, if we ever do. We don't need lighter trains.

And lighter is only better when it comes to fuel or power efficiency. Heavier is no different otherwise, and definitively not inferior. In fact, heavier has been traditionally a more comfortable ride.

Maybe do some research, lot's of info available.

I suggest you do the research, I have little extra to add as it is quite simple. The new rules will allow NA operators to use standard Euro designs rather than the less common and thus more expensive NA specific monstrosities. Not only will these designs be cheaper to buy, they will be lighter making them more fuel efficient and have better performance. There really are no downsides, it's just a shame it took America half a century to fix this issue (and longer for Canada).

[whatnext]

Originally Posted by milomilo

I suggest you do the research, I have little extra to add as it is quite simple. The new rules will allow NA operators to use standard Euro designs rather than the less common and thus more expensive NA specific monstrosities. Not only will these designs be cheaper to buy, they will be lighter making them more fuel efficient and have better performance. There really are no downsides, it's just a shame it took America half a century to fix this issue (and longer for Canada).

Traditionally North American railroads have had far more unprotected at-grade crossings than Europe, which is why the trainsets are over-engineered. I'm supportive of using European standards, but be warned when the first crash happens, the press will have a field day with it.

[milomilo]

The additional weight of the US trains does not make them any safer though, the opposite in fact, and there are lots of level crossings in Europe even on some quite fast lines. It's just that the US kept the same outdated standards from decades ago and was stuck in the mindset of heavy = safe. It's similar to how a modern car is much lighter than a car from the 50s, but is still safer than a tank of a Cadillac.

[esquire]

Rideau looks like a modern take on a Washington metro station... very nice.

[TorontoDrew]

source: https://news.ontario.ca/mto/en/2018/12/o...y-go-train-service-to-niagara-falls.html
Beginning on January 7, 2019, people travelling by GO Transit between Niagara Falls and Toronto's Union Station will benefit from a new morning trip with an evening return every weekday. The morning train that currently starts from West Harbour station in Hamilton at 6:39 a.m. will now start in Niagara Falls at 5:19 a.m., stopping at St. Catharines before continuing on to Toronto. In the evening, the existing train from Union Station at 5:15 p.m. to West Harbour will continue on to serve St. Catharines and Niagara Falls.



Who the hell is going to use a $19.50 5:19am train Mon-Fri from Niagara Falls to Toronto? There is a reason why it never existed. Here we have another example of how Doug Ford is willing to waste money on transit routes that will be heavily subsidized while the inner cities suffer. At the very least they should also put the weekend route back on as tourists would actually use it.

[MalcolmTucker]

Start running it now, peg demand, enable Metrolinx to reject building a new billion dollar tunnel when their political masters really really want it.

[CityTech]

Originally Posted by TorontoDrew

source: https://news.ontario.ca/mto/en/2018/12/o...y-go-train-service-to-niagara-falls.html
Beginning on January 7, 2019, people travelling by GO Transit between Niagara Falls and Toronto's Union Station will benefit from a new morning trip with an evening return every weekday. The morning train that currently starts from West Harbour station in Hamilton at 6:39 a.m. will now start in Niagara Falls at 5:19 a.m., stopping at St. Catharines before continuing on to Toronto. In the evening, the existing train from Union Station at 5:15 p.m. to West Harbour will continue on to serve St. Catharines and Niagara Falls.



Who the hell is going to use a $19.50 5:19am train Mon-Fri from Niagara Falls to Toronto? There is a reason why it never existed. Here we have another example of how Doug Ford is willing to waste money on transit routes that will be heavily subsidized while the inner cities suffer. At the very least they should also put the weekend route back on as tourists would actually use it.

It's interesting to note that Niagara region (including St. Catherines) voted NDP in the election.

That's a brutally long trip. The schedule takes two and a half hours each way. Hell.. that's about the same amount of time it takes for a VIA train to go from Union to Kingston!

[Wpg_Guy]

Edit

[J.OT13]

Originally Posted by J.OT13

Rideau Station.


https://www.ligneconfederationline.ca/news/construction-update-204/

City Councillor for Rideau-Vanier, Mathieu Fleury posted a higher quality picture of Rideau. Worth re-posting. You'll see the rendering followed by the photograph.




https://twitter.com/MathieuFleury/status/1073965926570229760

Ceiling seems to have been value-engineered and the barriers are taller than originally depicted, white finishing on the wall seems a little different, otherwise pretty similar.

Underground stations were designed by IBI Group.

[J.OT13]

Parliament Station Ottawa. Finishing touches to surface entrances (2 out of three shown).







uOttawa Station.






https://twitter.com/mrjasonli/status/1073681844955054083

[J.OT13]

Artwork at Parliament Station. We'll have 11 of these panels, each depicting small, low growing plants from across Canada.


https://twitter.com/AndreaMurphy12/status/1074361205551230976

More on the art at Parliament Station.

https://ottawa.ca/en/residents/transport...heart-ottawas-downtown-business-district