Confederation Line (Stage 1) | In Service 1.0 - Page 412

lrt's friend · #**8221** Posted **Sep 17, 2018, 5:42 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by kmcamp

I meant Hallmark is a store you can find anywhere, it's not a destination that somebody would be compelled to go to Sparks for. For Sparks Street to work, it needs destination stores, restauraants and traffic, and it's in Spark's good fortune that the tunnel shifted to next door on Queen St, giving it direct access to the LRT.

Agreed

Acajack · #**8222** Posted **Sep 17, 2018, 9:06 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

You comment about Hallmark, but this is a symptom of the problem. Maybe this is a generational change too. People don't send or give out cards like in the past. But also, the retail mix on Sparks has been deteriorating for decades. Restaurants and bars are not the only answer. We need a broad retail mix. Also, too many former retail stores have been converted into offices with no street front presence.

Sparks needs some retailers that are unique to downtown if not to the whole city. I am not sure how this gets jump started. We have let things deteriorate for too long.

Once upon a time Sparks had Holt Renfrew which was quite unique.

kwoldtimer · #**8223** Posted **Sep 17, 2018, 9:32 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Acajack

Once upon a time Sparks had Holt Renfrew which was quite unique.

Once upon a once upon a time, it also had Simpsons and Birks.

Truenorth00 · #**8224** Posted **Sep 17, 2018, 10:03 PM**

Sparks needs restaurants and bars. That's what it needs. It should be an entertainment corridor with so many offices, (increasingly) condos, a subway line and a massive tourist attraction near by.

The city really hasn't done a good job working with property owners, zoning and pushing development in the direction it wants.

kmcamp · #**8225** Posted **Sep 17, 2018, 10:21 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Truenorth00

Sparks needs restaurants and bars. That's what it needs. It should be an entertainment corridor with so many offices, (increasingly) condos, a subway line and a massive tourist attraction near by.

The city really hasn't done a good job working with property owners, zoning and pushing development in the direction it wants.

I think 2019 will be a pivotal year for sparks. I really think having the confed line will make a big difference

lrt's friend · #**8226** Posted **Sep 17, 2018, 10:38 PM**

We already restaurant districts downtown, Elgin and Byward Market and I expect Lebreton will become one. Sparks needs a more diverse mix so that it will be lively both in the datetime and at night.

Part of the problem is that our transit system has failed to attract enough people downtown. I am not convinced that the Confederation Line will not make enough of a difference because not enough people will have a one seat ride downtown. I am not moaning about the loss of express buses. That is not what I am talking about. Our downtown area still needs broader access and more frequent service than we are proposing and bus cutbacks on central routes is the exact opposite thing to do if we hope to bring people back downtown.

Truenorth00 · #**8227** Posted **Sep 18, 2018, 12:21 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

We already restaurant districts downtown, Elgin and Byward Market and I expect Lebreton will become one. Sparks needs a more diverse mix so that it will be lively both in the datetime and at night.

Sure. But there's no reason not to have one more.

Quote:

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

Part of the problem is that our transit system has failed to attract enough people downtown. I am not convinced that the Confederation Line will not make enough of a difference because not enough people will have a one seat ride downtown.

Not just the Confederation Line. There's no transit solution to shitty development policies that don't create pedestrian friendly areas with residences within walking distances.

Very difficult to build vibrant district anywhere which relies entirely on people coming into it by transit. If you can think of a vibrant area anywhere, you'll almost always find residences built in or a residential district nearby. The Byward Market and Rideau have improved a ton in the last decade. And have done so without any real transit investment to bolster them. All pedestrian traffic from condos. Bank St. in the core is getting a lot better. Again, due to condos popping up.

The real reason Sparks St. sucks so much is that there's few people who live nearby. That's changing a bit. But still much too slow to really make a difference any time soon. There has to be a real focus on getting more people living in that part of the downtown core so they can help establish a baseline level of activity for Sparks St.

J.OT13 · #**8228** Posted **Sep 18, 2018, 12:59 AM**

True, even with Stage 2, there will be no park-and-rides west of downtown, but if OC (and that's a big IF) maintains a high frequency of buses on Transitways connecting the terminus stations and western suburbs, it shouldn't be too much of an issue.

Worth remembering though that Stage 2 West isn't just about serving the suburbs. We're serving a significant urban population with residential towers popping up on Parkdale near Tunney's and Scott in Westboro. We're also adding two subways along Richmond Road serving an urban population that's never been served by rapid transit before.

That's an upper-middle class population that could help support LeBreton Flats and the Sens beyond the obvious downtown workforce.

As for Sparks, I think the Confederation Line could very well help give it a little bit of a boost. Some significant residential is currently under construction or planned, with the Re being the most obvious. Claridge is also (ssssllllloooooowwwwwwlllllly) building a presentation centre on Lyon at Albert for their new project that will be integrated into Lyon's west subway entrance.

I'd like to see some of the buildings along Sparks between Kent and Elgin redeveloped or re-purposed into hotel or residential space.

OtrainUser · #**8229** Posted **Sep 18, 2018, 1:35 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by J.OT13

True, even with Stage 2, there will be no park-and-rides west of downtown, but if OC (and that's a big IF) maintains a high frequency of buses on Transitways connecting the terminus stations and western suburbs, it shouldn't be too much of an issue.

Worth remembering though that Stage 2 West isn't just about serving the suburbs. We're serving a significant urban population with residential towers popping up on Parkdale near Tunney's and Scott in Westboro. We're also adding two subways along Richmond Road serving an urban population that's never been served by rapid transit before.

That's an upper-middle class population that could help support LeBreton Flats and the Sens beyond the obvious downtown workforce.

As for Sparks, I think the Confederation Line could very well help give it a little bit of a boost. Some significant residential is currently under construction or planned, with the Re being the most obvious. Claridge is also (ssssllllloooooowwwwwwlllllly) building a presentation centre on Lyon at Albert for their new project that will be integrated into Lyon's west subway entrance.

I'd like to see some of the buildings along Sparks between Kent and Elgin redeveloped or re-purposed into hotel or residential space.

I wish you people stop calling it a subway when it isnt. Subways are far more expensive to build as Truenorth pointed out. Line 1 is light Metro.

Reecemartin · #**8230** Posted **Sep 18, 2018, 2:08 AM**

[Deleted]

OtrainUser · #**8231** Posted **Sep 18, 2018, 2:22 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reecemartin

The term subway is very loosely defined. It literally just means electrified underground railway, any other meaning is learned.

However Line 1 is definitely a light metro system so it should called as such. My preference is Ottawa Metro.

Even line 2 is classified as light Metro

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confederation_Line

OCCheetos · #**8232** Posted **Sep 18, 2018, 2:51 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by OtrainUser

Even line 2 is classified as light Metro

What? 🤔

roger1818 · #**8233** Posted **Sep 18, 2018, 4:13 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reecemartin

The term subway is very loosely defined. It literally just means electrified underground railway, any other meaning is learned.

Or an underground pedestrian walkway, depending where you live.

Ontario1 · #**8234** Posted **Sep 18, 2018, 9:38 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by roger1818

Or an underground pedestrian walkway, depending where you live.

Waterloo Region has a subway. https://www.reddit.com/r/waterloo/commen...ap_of_waterloo_regions_subway_map_if_we/

OtrainUser · #**8235** Posted **Sep 18, 2018, 9:50 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by OCCheetos

What? 🤔

I was surprised by that as well but it does make sense when you think about it.

OCCheetos · #**8236** Posted **Sep 18, 2018, 11:45 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by OtrainUser

I was surprised by that as well but it does make sense when you think about it.

Well first of all I'm not sure where you've seen it been called a metro. I've seen it called LRT, but never a metro.

Wikipedia calls it an "urban railway", and post-Stage-2 I think it would work to call it a "regional rail" line (as mentioned in the Stage 2 thread just now).

OtrainUser · #**8237** Posted **Sep 18, 2018, 11:51 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by OCCheetos

Well first of all I'm not sure where you've seen it been called a metro. I've seen it called LRT, but never a metro.

Wikipedia calls it an "urban railway", and post-Stage-2 I think it would work to call it a "regional rail" line (as mentioned in the Stage 2 thread just now).

i posted the link already as to why its called light metro

OCCheetos · #**8238** Posted **Sep 18, 2018, 11:55 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by OtrainUser

i posted the link already as to why its called light metro

That's not line 2 though.

J.OT13 · #**8239** Posted **Sep 18, 2018, 12:05 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by OtrainUser

I wish you people stop calling it a subway when it isnt. Subways are far more expensive to build as Truenorth pointed out. Line 1 is light Metro.

I rarely use the term "subway" to define the entire line, as it is mostly above ground. But I will probably continue to use that term for the underground stations.

kmcamp · #**8240** Posted **Sep 18, 2018, 12:58 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by OtrainUser

I wish you people stop calling it a subway when it isnt. Subways are far more expensive to build as Truenorth pointed out. Line 1 is light Metro.

Let's not go down that road again. You're talking about the Metro, Light Metro, LRT, Streetcar terminology spectrum which no one wants to go into. What we all mean here by "subway" is a train in a tunnel, not minutiae of which terminology applies. And Subway isn't on that list, the top end is the word "Metro"

I do think eventually "o-train" will stick as the name for the whole system, but right now calling it "o-train" in this forum is a bit confusing as i think most people associate that with Line 2