Amazon HQ2 bid

[jpk1292000]

Originally Posted by Atlanta3000

The story is going to be covered by several sources this afternoon. Stay tuned....

Which story?

[Atlanta3000]

Originally Posted by Triptychtwo

Nothing is definitive, but when you have a public process voting on an incentive package which aligns very specifically with the RFP for HQ2, you have a city that has reached the final hurdle. No other city or municipality (that I am aware of) is getting the legislative authority to provide these types of incentives. Deal has said he would call a special session to provide these, but when the entire deal is happening within the COA, there is no need to have the state legislator vote to incentivize.

It was quoted somewhere and I lost the link, but Deal already has been authorized by the Legislature for the final incentive package and he is ready to pull the trigger when Amazon is ready. Someone at City-Data reported this as well.

[Atlanta3000]

Originally Posted by jpk1292000

Which story?

What I have been discussing all morning. JPK1292K have you started your Hurricane Florence Party already?

[skyscraperpage17]

Originally Posted by Triptychtwo

Nothing is definitive, but when you have a public process voting on an incentive package which aligns very specifically with the RFP for HQ2, you have a city that has reached the final hurdle. No other city or municipality (that I am aware of) is getting the legislative authority to provide these types of incentives. Deal has said he would call a special session to provide these, but when the entire deal is happening within the COA, there is no need to have the state legislator vote to incentivize.

Originally Posted by Atlanta3000

Every contract has this type of language. It is encase of an unforeseen event that has material impact. It gives either party the ability to dissolve the agreement. The Agreement lays out possible conditions - somewhere in the 600 pages because I read it.

Fair enough. Everything you guys raised could very much be the case. I'm in purchasing and have a HR degree, so I have a decent understanding of how legalese and contracts work.

But again, as stated, there's been nothing definitive to prove what you both say (that Amazon has without a doubt already selected Atlanta). And as stated, we don't know what's happening in other cities. They could be going through similar steps as well but it just hasn't been leaked. Thus, I still think my skepticism is also reasonable.

Again, I just don't want to get hopes up and assume we have it in the bag then there's a completely different outcome from what was expected.

[Mentallect]

Originally Posted by skyscraperpage17

Agreed with the both of you.

As far as the signing of the lease, even that's stilll not necessarily a smoking gun. How do we know it's not for another project besides HQ2?

Atlanta should get Hq2, and NOVA's blessings go with you because I don't want to pay a single dime to any company to come to the DC region. Cost of living is lower too, weather better, further away from hurricanes, more centrally located delivery and travel, etc.

[skyscraperpage17]

Remember when Sperling said "Trust us, it's going to be Atlanta?"

Well, they've folded like a cheap suit and are now going with NoVA, specifically Loudoun County.

https://www.wraltechwire.com/2018/09/12/...-virginia-likely-choice-says-bestplaces/

[Mentallect]

Originally Posted by skyscraperpage17

Remember when Sperling said "Trust us, it's going to be Atlanta?"

Well, they've folded like a cheap suit and are now going with NoVA, specifically Loudoun County.

https://www.wraltechwire.com/2018/09/12/...-virginia-likely-choice-says-bestplaces/

Amazon Web Service was expanding by thousands of employees, but I do not believe HQ2, even if it chose NOVA, would go to Loudoun County. The low population density, and distance from the urban core makes attracting and retaining top millennial talent less likely. Still, Northern Virginia added 22,600 jobs in 2017 without Amazon, 1,000 more than estimated by the BLS, so we do not need Amazon here to prosper. I personally am having second thoughts about HQ2 being a net positive for any area.

[Atlanta3000]

Originally Posted by Mentallect

Amazon Web Service was expanding by thousands of employees, but I do not believe HQ2, even if it chose NOVA, would go to Loudoun County. The low population density, and distance from the urban core makes attracting and retaining top millennial talent less likely. Still, Northern Virginia added 22,600 jobs in 2017 without Amazon, 1,000 more than estimated by the BLS, so we do not need Amazon here to prosper. I personally am having second thoughts about HQ2 being a net positive for any area.

Confirmed - NOVA is getting a second place prize.

https://webcache.googleusercontent.com/s...1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us&client=firefox-b-1
COPT to acquire part of Waterside, build data centers for Amazon Web Services

An affiliate of Columbia, Maryland-based Corporate Office Properties Trust is expected to acquire land and develop multiple data centers in Sterling on behalf of Amazon Web Services.

Waterside I LLC, a COPT (NYSE: OFC) entity, is under contract to buy 78 acres of what is currently known as Waterside in Sterling. On that property, north of Old Ox Road (Route 606), COPT plans to build multiple data centers for AWS (NASDAQ: AMZN), in addition to, perhaps, a shopping center fronting Route 606, according to multiple sources.

The Washington Business Journal first reported in June that AWS was buying into Waterside.

A decision as to whether the Route 606 frontage will be data center or retail will be decided in the next two or three months, as COPT negotiates with potential users, according to documents filed with Loudoun County in August, prior to a planning meeting on the future development.

Neither the typically tight-lipped COPT nor its land use attorney responded to requests for comment.

The Loudoun-Fairfax line, within walking distance of Waterside, is among the sites under consideration for Amazon.com Inc.'s second headquarters. Amazon CEO Jeff Bezos is scheduled to address The Economic Club in D.C. on Thursday, and the Amazon board reportedly met in the District Tuesday, but no HQ2 announcement is expected this week, The Washington Post reported.

Using a third party to acquire land and develop data centers on its behalf is standard operating procedure for AWS. The rezoning applicant, for example, for "Quarry Commerce Center," a 44-acre site on the north side of Route 50 immediately south of Dulles International Airport, is not Amazon or AWS, but rather Excelsior, Minnesota-based Oppidan Investment Co.

Waterside is the massive mixed-use remake of the 235-acre Loudoun Quarries south of Route 606, in addition to 100 acres north of that main drag. All 335 acres of the development are owned by Chantilly Crushed Stone, an entity of the Gudelsky Group. Chantilly Crushed Stone was also the previous owner of Quarry Commerce Center.

The Waterside project is entitled overall for 2,200 multifamily units, 395 age-restricted units, 1.9 million square feet of office, 645,000 square feet of flex/office, 350,000 square feet of hotel, 782,000 square feet of retail and 272,000 square feet of civic space. The development will be anchored by a 54-acre lake, as what is now the active quarry pit is allowed to fill over time.

[skyscraperpage17]

Originally Posted by Mentallect

Amazon Web Service was expanding by thousands of employees, but I do not believe HQ2, even if it chose NOVA, would go to Loudoun County. The low population density, and distance from the urban core makes attracting and retaining top millennial talent less likely. Still, Northern Virginia added 22,600 jobs in 2017 without Amazon, 1,000 more than estimated by the BLS, so we do not need Amazon here to prosper. I personally am having second thoughts about HQ2 being a net positive for any area.

I have relatives who live in Loudoun County, and while it's growing and "urbanizing" rapidly, I can't for the life of me see how millennials could afford to live out there. All they're building is $1+ million McMansions.

[Atlanta3000]

Originally Posted by skyscraperpage17

I have relatives who live in Loudoun County, and while it's growing and "urbanizing" rapidly, I can't for the life of me see how millennials could afford to live out there. All they're building is $1+ million McMansions.

That whole area looks like a big office park and it is farkin' expensive with a bunch over priced track homes

[Mentallect]

Originally Posted by skyscraperpage17

I have relatives who live in Loudoun County, and while it's growing and "urbanizing" rapidly, I can't for the life of me see how millennials could afford to live out there. All they're building is $1+ million McMansions.

Even at 100K, and the median household income in Loudoun is above 100K, it would be impossible, millennials can't afford to live there comfortably.

[Mentallect]

Originally Posted by Atlanta3000

That whole area looks like a big office park and it is farkin' expensive with a bunch over priced track homes

$115,000 median household income helps, and also most of the older people in those home purchased them years ago when they were much cheaper so either have no mortgage or have low mortgages relatively speaking. There's not much out that way in terms of culture. In Arlington and Alexandria, VA, you can still buy some older, and smaller house for about $700K which is reasonable for this area, near a metro or bus station, restaurants, coffee shops, etc.

[Atlanta3000]

Originally Posted by Mentallect

$115,000 median household income helps, and also most of the older people in those home purchased them years ago when they were much cheaper so either have no mortgage or have low mortgages relatively speaking. There's not much out that way in terms of culture. In Arlington and Alexandria, VA, you can still buy some older, and smaller house for about $700K which is reasonable for this area, near a metro or bus station, restaurants, coffee shops, etc.

I lived in those townhouses behind the Exxon station off Glebe Rd near the Mall in Arlington and they are going for $1.2 Million today and it was a shithole (but in a great area). I go up all the time to visit my friends in Arlington and nothing in that area is $700K - especially SFH's.

[AlwaysMoving]

I think y'all are reading this section incorrectly:

Section 7.28.

Public Funding
. Other than the funding set forth in this Agreement, the Bond Transaction Documents, the TAD Development Agreement and the other TAD Bond Documents, Owner shall not seek or solicit or accept any proposal of, or enter into any plan or agreement, with any other county, local government, development authority or quasi-governmental authority of the State of Georgia, other than Invest Atlanta regarding any economic development incentives relating to the financing of the Project or the redevelopment thereof unless the recipient of the incentive(s) benefit is a Major Economic Development Opportunity. If Owner desires an economic development incentive that is offered by Invest Atlanta other than those set forth in this Agreement, Owner shall submit an application therefor to Invest Atlanta if such incentive is available. If the desired economic development incentive is not offered by Invest Atlanta, or if the desired economic development incentive is offered by Invest Atlanta but Invest Atlanta denies the request, Owner shall be free to seek such economic development incentive from another entity as long as such incentive does not result in the reduction of ad valorem real property taxes on the Project

The first sentence clearly states that they get certain funding but can not negotiate with other government groups (it clearly does not include private companies) for more funding unless it's a major economic development opportunity.

So, this is the deal unless it's Amazon. If it's Amazon it's this plus the what the State adds.

[Mentallect]

Originally Posted by Atlanta3000

I lived in those townhouses behind the Exxon station off Glebe Rd near the Mall in Arlington and they are going for $1.2 Million today and it was a shithole (but in a great area). I go up all the time to visit my friends in Arlington and nothing in that area is $700K - especially SFH's.

A quick search on Redfin, which I just completed, verifies my statement. I look at homes almost each day since I am in the market for a second home.

https://www.redfin.com/city/21282/VA/Arl...rt=38.93201:38.83272:-76.99232:-77.16844

[908kiddo]

Originally Posted by skyscraperpage17

I have relatives who live in Loudoun County, and while it's growing and "urbanizing" rapidly, I can't for the life of me see how millennials could afford to live out there. All they're building is $1+ million McMansions.

Something I and A3000 have been trying to stress for a while. There's barely any space to build in the immediate Metro DC area. The entire area is pretty much already at capacity (as least in terms of where the metro transit goes). Building/Lot costs are exuberant. Millennials can't (or may not want to) afford to live there. And there's nowhere to grow unless you enter nomansland.

As cracked up as the DC Metro is, once you leave the areas from Bethesda down to about Alexandria and out to Tyson's Corner (all in which it's virtually impossible to find anything under 450k+, and something decent for even more), you may as well be in one of the Carolinas. And these areas likely where Amazon will attract most of its newcomers/growth, or will be able to build.

You can't make an "Amazonland" in the DC Metro. Why face the same issues you face in Seattle? If not even more.

In Atlanta, you have free range to do *gulp* whatever you please.

[Atlanta3000]

Originally Posted by 908kiddo

Something I and A3000 have been trying to stress for a while. There's barely any space to build in the immediate Metro DC area. The entire area is pretty much already at capacity (as least in terms of where the metro transit goes). Building/Lot costs are exuberant. Millennials can't (or may not want to) afford to live there. And there's nowhere to grow unless you enter nomansland.

As cracked up as the DC Metro is, once you leave the areas from Bethesda down to about Alexandria and out to Tyson's Corner (all in which it's virtually impossible to find anything under 450k+), you may as well be in one of the Carolinas. And these areas likely where Amazon will attract most of its newcomers/growth, or will be able to build.

You can't make an "Amazonland" in the DC Metro. Why face the same issues you face in Seattle? If not even more.

In Atlanta, you have free range to do *gulp* whatever you please.

Or more appropriately - "Gulch" whatever you please.

[jpk1292000]

Originally Posted by Atlanta3000

Confirmed - NOVA is getting a second place prize.

https://webcache.googleusercontent.com/s...1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us&client=firefox-b-1
COPT to acquire part of Waterside, build data centers for Amazon Web Services

An affiliate of Columbia, Maryland-based Corporate Office Properties Trust is expected to acquire land and develop multiple data centers in Sterling on behalf of Amazon Web Services.

Waterside I LLC, a COPT (NYSE: OFC) entity, is under contract to buy 78 acres of what is currently known as Waterside in Sterling. On that property, north of Old Ox Road (Route 606), COPT plans to build multiple data centers for AWS (NASDAQ: AMZN), in addition to, perhaps, a shopping center fronting Route 606, according to multiple sources.

The Washington Business Journal first reported in June that AWS was buying into Waterside.

A decision as to whether the Route 606 frontage will be data center or retail will be decided in the next two or three months, as COPT negotiates with potential users, according to documents filed with Loudoun County in August, prior to a planning meeting on the future development.

Neither the typically tight-lipped COPT nor its land use attorney responded to requests for comment.

The Loudoun-Fairfax line, within walking distance of Waterside, is among the sites under consideration for Amazon.com Inc.'s second headquarters. Amazon CEO Jeff Bezos is scheduled to address The Economic Club in D.C. on Thursday, and the Amazon board reportedly met in the District Tuesday, but no HQ2 announcement is expected this week, The Washington Post reported.

Using a third party to acquire land and develop data centers on its behalf is standard operating procedure for AWS. The rezoning applicant, for example, for "Quarry Commerce Center," a 44-acre site on the north side of Route 50 immediately south of Dulles International Airport, is not Amazon or AWS, but rather Excelsior, Minnesota-based Oppidan Investment Co.

Waterside is the massive mixed-use remake of the 235-acre Loudoun Quarries south of Route 606, in addition to 100 acres north of that main drag. All 335 acres of the development are owned by Chantilly Crushed Stone, an entity of the Gudelsky Group. Chantilly Crushed Stone was also the previous owner of Quarry Commerce Center.

The Waterside project is entitled overall for 2,200 multifamily units, 395 age-restricted units, 1.9 million square feet of office, 645,000 square feet of flex/office, 350,000 square feet of hotel, 782,000 square feet of retail and 272,000 square feet of civic space. The development will be anchored by a 54-acre lake, as what is now the active quarry pit is allowed to fill over time.

Is this the story you were mentioning this morning?

[Atlanta3000]

Originally Posted by jpk1292000

Is this the story you were mentioning this morning?

http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showpost.php?p=8311600&postcount=1485

[paytonc]

OK, I haven't read the full document, but the only text mention of the MEDO is:

"Owner shall not seek or solicit or accept any proposal of...[agencies] other than Invest Atlanta regarding any economic development incentives... unless the recipient of the incentive(s) benefit is a Major Economic Development Opportunity"

I read this as saying that CIM gets Invest Atlanta's money regardless. However, this is it -- they can't come back and demand more incentives from Atlanta/Fulton/Georgia/etc. If a MEDO happens (and yes, that's legalese for HQ2), then the owner can get additional city/county/state incentives. (Update: I'm not the only one reading it this way.)

As for my pick (and that of other real estate industry analysts): the nondescript Crystal City in Arlington. It was mostly built out in the 1980s for federal back offices, which have mostly left -- and has been undergoing very slow redevelopment ever since. There's about 2 million square feet available today, and has entitlements for 9.5 million square feet of new offices. Two adjacent neighborhoods have existing entitlements for another 8-10 million square feet of office. It's also walking distance to DCA, has two existing rail transit stations (Metro + commuter), has a single well-capitalized owner who has confirmed that the entire project can fit within their site, and is a 15-minute drive from Bezos' Kalorama mansion.

No, it's not new and flashy and obvious, but what really counts is access to technical talent (almost 2X Atlanta's pool) and office rents (only 25% higher than downtown Atlanta, and besides the typical businesses only spends about 6% of revenue on rent).

And uh, Amazon already had 28 data centers in Northern Virginia as of last fall, so another few more is not that newsworthy.