PHILADELPHIA | The Arthaus @ 311 S. Broad | 542 FT | 47 FLOORS

[mcgrath618]

Originally Posted by El Duderino

New zoning/use permit as of 6/21: https://li.phila.gov/#details?entity=permits&eid=862597&key=51368&address=311-19%20S%20BROAD%20ST

An additional couple floors are being added from the previous iteration (seems to be smaller than the original proposal), which I doubt anyone is too upset about B-) Also, it still looks like there is a hotel component? This conflicts with the other intel we've heard, but definitely encouraging seeing this still making moves.

Why does it seem to be smaller? The permit seems to imply that they just want to add two floors to the existing plans, which would make this thing something around 575'.

[Urbanthusiat]

Originally Posted by mcgrath618

Why does it seem to be smaller? The permit seems to imply that they just want to add two floors to the existing plans, which would make this thing something around 575'.

Because the 566 ft height figure still refers to the original proposal which called for 125 apartments and 151 hotel rooms (permit here: https://li.phila.gov/#details?entity=permits&eid=531472&key=51368&address=311-19%20S%20BROAD%20ST)

The new permit is calling for 107 apartments and 101 hotel rooms, which makes it shorter.

[jsbrook]

Originally Posted by Urbanthusiat

Because the 566 ft height figure still refers to the original proposal which called for 125 apartments and 151 hotel rooms (permit here: https://li.phila.gov/#details?entity=permits&eid=531472&key=51368&address=311-19%20S%20BROAD%20ST)

The new permit is calling for 107 apartments and 101 hotel rooms, which makes it shorter.

Contrary to what someone said, this permit indicates the hotel is not out of the picture.

[McBane]

Maybe it's late. But I don't understand how adding two floors would result in a shorter building designed without a spire or an embellished roof. Assuming no radical redesign, this is only possible by reducing the ceiling heights. And what would that achieve?

And how would less units necessitate two more floors? I suppose, Dranoff could have reconfigured the building plans to feature fewer but larger units. But fewer units and two additional floors seems like a stretch; unless Dranoff is going the Scannapieco route on this tower but I don't think that's plausible.

Something doesn't seem to add up....

[Urbanthusiat]

Originally Posted by McBane

Maybe it's late. But I don't understand how adding two floors would result in a shorter building designed without a spire or an embellished roof. Assuming no radical redesign, this is only possible by reducing the ceiling heights. And what would that achieve?

And how would less units necessitate two more floors? I suppose, Dranoff could have reconfigured the building plans to feature fewer but larger units. But fewer units and two additional floors seems like a stretch; unless Dranoff is going the Scannapieco route on this tower but I don't think that's plausible.

Something doesn't seem to add up....

The most recent permit doesn't amend the original permit from 2014 - it amends permit #809773 that was issued in January 2018 that called for 114 apartments and 101 hotel rooms. So, to recap, the original proposal from 2014 was 276 combined units. It was reduced to 215 in January 2018, and now it's being reduced further to 208. So it will have 2 additional floors compared to the January 2018 version of the tower, but several fewer than the original proposal. So it will definitely be shorter than 566 feet.

[El Duderino]

Originally Posted by Urbanthusiat

The most recent permit doesn't amend the original permit from 2014 - it amends permit #809773 that was issued in January 2018 that called for 114 apartments and 101 hotel rooms. So, to recap, the original proposal from 2014 was 276 combined units. It was reduced to 215 in January 2018, and now it's being reduced further to 208. So it will have 2 additional floors compared to the January 2018 version of the tower, but several fewer than the original proposal. So it will definitely be shorter than 566 feet.

That’s what I was implying with my initial statement, thanks Urbanthusiat. skyscraper mentioned a few pages back that the updated version will be similar in massing and height, so hopefully we will see something pretty close to the original version we have renderings for, and if the permit is correct, with the hotel component.

[City Wide]

Originally Posted by Urbanthusiat

The most recent permit doesn't amend the original permit from 2014 - it amends permit #809773 that was issued in January 2018 that called for 114 apartments and 101 hotel rooms. So, to recap, the original proposal from 2014 was 276 combined units. It was reduced to 215 in January 2018, and now it's being reduced further to 208. So it will have 2 additional floors compared to the January 2018 version of the tower, but several fewer than the original proposal. So it will definitely be shorter than 566 feet.

Not concerning the actual room count, so the first permit (2014) was for a building of 566' tall, and since then there has been no specific public announcement regarding the size or nature or use of the actual building, except the January 2018 permit has been recently amended to add 2 additional floors? But it sounds like we don't know what the baseline is that these 2 additional floors are being added to. Is that correct?
I get it that the City is rightfully concerned about the number of units and useage, but my interest are has the design of the building changed and have the changes, if any, changed the look, the details and height of the building.

And even more important then any of that, when and will this get built! Carl has publicly said that he'd like to build the tallest residential building in the State and I hope he does, soon.

[Thoroughbred]

Originally Posted by City Wide

Not concerning the actual room count, so the first permit (2014) was for a building of 566' tall, and since then there has been no specific public announcement regarding the size or nature or use of the actual building, except the January 2018 permit has been recently amended to add 2 additional floors? But it sounds like we don't know what the baseline is that these 2 additional floors are being added to. Is that correct?
I get it that the City is rightfully concerned about the number of units and useage, but my interest are has the design of the building changed and have the changes, if any, changed the look, the details and height of the building.

And even more important then any of that, when and will this get built! Carl has publicly said that he'd like to build the tallest residential building in the State and I hope he does, soon.

My guess is that there is benefit to pulling a building permit ahead of October when the City will adopt the 2018 Building Code. The new code has several components that would drive construction costs up substantially.
Once a permit is obtained for the present room mix, a change to all residential would probably be handled through an administrative review and not require re-submission kicking in the new, more onerous, code requirements.

We are going to see a mad rush to submit pending projects in the next few months. Hope that L&I is prepared for the tsunami.

[Boku]

Carl Dranoff now plans shorter tower at Broad and Spruce Streets with no hotel rooms

http://www.philly.com/philly/business/re...oad-spruce-condo-hotel-sbe-20180725.html

Developer Carl Dranoff’s plan for a condo-and-hotel hybrid tower at Broad and Spruce Streets under the luxury SLS brand is being downsized to include only residential units.

A Dranoff Properties Inc. affiliate was issued a permit Friday for a project with 107 residential units at what’s now an empty pit, a shift from previous plans for 114 condos and 101 hotel rooms at the site, according to Philadelphia’s Department of Licenses and Inspections.

The permit also shrinks the building’s height from about 608 feet to 542 feet.

[iheartphilly]

^
542 ft is still very respectable for Broad St. I'm just having a hard time figuring own how only 107 units will fill a 542 ft highrise. Like if that equates to 50 floors, then 2 units per floor or something like that. Doesn't seem right.

[McBane]

This is basically what we already discussed earlier this month, right? Frankly, I don't recall the height ever being 608 feet. I thought it was always to be in the 550 foot range. IF axing the hotel component makes this a more viable project, I'm okay - though this news doesn't seem to imply anything is imminent.

542 feet is nothing to sneeze at - it should still rise above the mass of 400-500 footers that dominate our skyline. Especially at Broad and Spruce.

[Nova08]

Originally Posted by Boku

Carl Dranoff now plans shorter tower at Broad and Spruce Streets with no hotel rooms

http://www.philly.com/philly/business/re...oad-spruce-condo-hotel-sbe-20180725.html

Not that big of a hit.

I know there are a ton of unknowns around the financing for this project, but it still surprises me that they cannot manage a hotel component, even after these recent articles.

CBRE ups Greater Phila. hotel forecast after strong Q1 performance
https://www.bizjournals.com/philadelphia...orecast-greater-philadelphia-revpar.html

Data shows Philadelphia can support a boom in hotel rooms
https://www.bizjournals.com/philadelphia...-philadelphia-can-support-a-boom-in.html

[TechTalkGuy]

Let’s see here:

The permit also shrinks the building’s height from about 608 feet to 542 feet.

A Dranoff spokeswoman said the developer has no comment about the change at this time.

That’s unfortunate.
This alarming news will affect the skyline.

[mcgrath618]

542 is better for this location IMO. 600’ would honestly tower everything else way too much. The only thing I’m concerned about is the design. Does it still look this good?

[that isn't terrible]

https://atlas.phila.gov/#/311-19%20S%20BROAD%20ST/li

Looks like they received the zoning permit, not the building permit. So now they have 3 years plus a 1 year possible extension before the zoning permit expires...

I don't recall what timeline you have to start building once you've picked up your building permit, but I think that's months not years.

[Philly-Drew]

Originally Posted by mcgrath618

600’ would honestly tower everything else way too much.....

Personally I think that’s a great thing.

Originally Posted by that isn't terrible

https://atlas.phila.gov/#/311-19%20S%20BROAD%20ST/li
So now they have 3 years plus a 1 year possible extension before the zoning permit expires....

I’m not holding my breath.

[City Wide]

Originally Posted by that isn't terrible

https://atlas.phila.gov/#/311-19%20S%20BROAD%20ST/li

Looks like they received the zoning permit, not the building permit. So now they have 3 years plus a 1 year possible extension before the zoning permit expires...

I don't recall what timeline you have to start building once you've picked up your building permit, but I think that's months not years.

The lag time between getting a building permit and starting work described in that permit is suppose to be 6 months, but 'work' can mean digging alittle hole in the ground. There's always something for the lawyers to fuss over---. I've got no idea if the City gives extensions; probably not with the hope of getting more fees for re-issuing a permit.

[summersm343]

Originally Posted by iheartphilly

^
542 ft is still very respectable for Broad St. I'm just having a hard time figuring own how only 107 units will fill a 542 ft highrise. Like if that equates to 50 floors, then 2 units per floor or something like that. Doesn't seem right.

500 Walnut has 35 units and is 380 feet tall... so yeah, possible.

[jjv007]

Methinks they might wanna keep City Hall the tallest on Broad for at least a little longer.

[skyscraper]

Originally Posted by jjv007

Methinks they might wanna keep City Hall the tallest on Broad for at least a little longer.

That’s ridiculous. The height reduction has nothing to do with city freaking hall.