Confederation Line (Stage 1) | In Service 1.0 - Page 375

zzptichka · #**7481** Posted **Jul 15, 2018, 4:07 AM**

These yellow guards are ugggly and look like an afterthought.
Could've installed some kind of information panel or something with purpose. Why does it have to be such an eyesore?

roger1818 · #**7482** Posted **Jul 15, 2018, 6:46 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by zzptichka

These yellow guards are ugggly and look like an afterthought.
Could've installed some kind of information panel or something with purpose. Why does it have to be such an eyesore?

Just think of it as a piece of modern art. 😜

Catenary · #**7483** Posted **Jul 15, 2018, 6:49 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by zzptichka

These yellow guards are ugggly and look like an afterthought.
Could've installed some kind of information panel or something with purpose. Why does it have to be such an eyesore?

Between-car barriers are an ADA requirement, so if they aren't a requirement here, they are at least best practice. Most heavy rail systems use a systems of chains between cars, but flexible barriers are common in light rail systems. The barrier reduces the risk of a person with visual impairment waling between cars and then being run over. At the same time, the flexible nature of the barrier allows people to pass through it should the train stop with a door aligned with the barrier, such as may happen during a power loss.

Information:
http://www.impactrecovery.com/images/uploads/BCB_White_Paper,_M501-A.pdf
https://www.transit.dot.gov/regulations-...ers/lrt-vehicle-car-barrier-requirements
https://www.customsmobile.com/regulations/expand/title49_chapterA_part38_subpartC_section38.63

The biggest issue with between-car barriers is when both an even and odd number of cars operate on the line. In Ottawa's case, this means that 1 car trains will be forced to stop at one end of the platform or the other, they cannot stop in the middle.

roger1818 · #**7484** Posted **Jul 15, 2018, 7:21 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Catenary

The biggest issue with between-car barriers is when both an even and odd number of cars operate on the line. In Ottawa's case, this means that 1 car trains will be forced to stop at one end of the platform or the other, they cannot stop in the middle.

Does it? Couldn’t the barriers be aligned between the “Centre module” (1 door) and the “Intermediate module” (2 doors). There appears to be a large gap between doors there.

Catenary · #**7485** Posted **Jul 15, 2018, 10:43 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by roger1818

Does it? Couldn’t the barriers be aligned between the “Centre module” (1 door) and the “Intermediate module” (2 doors). There appears to be a large gap between doors there.

That may work here. It's an issue elsewhere, but we have an unusual train design.

roger1818 · #**7486** Posted **Jul 16, 2018, 6:18 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Catenary

That may work here. It's an issue elsewhere, but we have an unusual train design.

It might be intentional, for exactly that reason.

Kitchissippi · #**7487** Posted **Jul 17, 2018, 12:39 PM**

I doubt they would do that. Because the trains are semi-automatic, there are designated spots for the trains to stop in the stations. I think they'll just use the front section of the track rather than having to change up the programming.

Reecemartin · #**7488** Posted **Jul 17, 2018, 3:06 PM**

[Deleted]

PHrenetic · #**7489** Posted **Jul 17, 2018, 3:39 PM**

Good Day.

Well, yes, it is the design of the Citadis..... what we are discussing is the power, or P-unit.

The short 4 meter unit (which we did not select) is just seats and pantograph - no doors.
We got the longer 11 metre std size power unit - seats, one door set, and pantograph.
The space for the other door set gets used for and by the power distribution systems in that P-unit for the entire LRT vehicle.

The other 11 meter unit is the standard passenger cabin with 2 door sets, with the control cab stuck onto the nose and the accordion at the other end (the A-unit), or, the B-unit with accordion at both ends. This double accordion B-unit would be the additional segment we would get to add into the vehicle for a 5 unit LRV.

As for programming for position at the platform, that can be and is handled by sensors at the track, wheel rotation counters on the bogies, GPS readers, and the CBTC central control system. It would be a standard flexibility already accounted for in the system programming, needing only the location choice for each station platform to be specified.
This is already a 'problem' which would have had to be handled in terms of the various platform lengths we have in the 13 stations already.
Problem solved (or, at least, it had better be ! ).

EnJoy!

Reecemartin · #**7490** Posted **Jul 17, 2018, 10:38 PM**

[Deleted]

OCCheetos · #**7491** Posted **Jul 17, 2018, 11:18 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reecemartin

Are there actually plans to add another segment or can we only do up to 2 4 segment trains?

No, but all stations are built to allow for platform extensions if it's ever needed.

Reecemartin · #**7492** Posted **Jul 18, 2018, 2:43 PM**

[Deleted]

J.OT13 · #**7493** Posted **Jul 18, 2018, 2:56 PM**

Surface station platforms are 90 meters long. Underground stations (at least the three downtown) were built to the full length of 120 meters.

That said, they seem to have built the station caverns large enough to expand to 150 meters. This is based on my own speculation looking at GeoOttawa and my observations at Kontimum, along with a Citizen article a few years ago mentioning the size of the caverns (no source). Neither the Citizen, nor City official has ever confirmed the reason the caverns are bigger than needed.

PHrenetic · #**7494** Posted **Jul 18, 2018, 5:23 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by J.OT13

Surface station platforms are 90 meters long. Underground stations (at least the three downtown) were built to the full length of 120 meters.

That said, they seem to have built the station caverns large enough to expand to 150 meters. This is based on my own speculation looking at GeoOttawa and my observations at Kontimum, along with a Citizen article a few years ago mentioning the size of the caverns (no source). Neither the Citizen, nor City official has ever confirmed the reason the caverns are bigger than needed.

Good Day.

As was pointed out to me by others here, the choice of vehicle was unknown in 2011, and so the caverns were designed long before the choice of vehicle was made, and thus had to be flexible enough to allow any choice made.
That said, I did believe the caverns were utterly reduced from 150 m. to 120 m. so as to save costs inside the $1.2 B. cap, at the 2011 point of contract award. So if there is any play into a 150 m. envelope, it would be by playing the transitions, and I have to think that would not be possible nor allowed.
Besides, they have already squeezed the east end of Rideau station to accommodate the 'drastic' curve southwards, so....
And I really doubt they want to expand it at the sinkhole west end !!!

So if the caverns actually are larger than that, then nobody but the techs within RTG and City Eng. Dept. have a clue. Fure sure Jimmy ain't talkin' !!

Plus, with our current vehicle choice, expanding each LRV by 11 m. gives a max size of 118 m., well within the 120 m. tunnel station envelope. Surface stations are (as noted) currently at 90 m. (accepting the 96 m. max train with 3 m. nose and 3 m. tail overhang). And these stations have expansion reservations to 120 m. (most Phase 1 stations) and 110 m. (most Phase 2 stations, both surface and open-cut). Calculation and pixel-counting by others have figured that 110 m. will -just- accommodate the doors, with 4 m. overhangs at each end. (Yup - cutting it real close !!!)

Summary, I believe the caverns were built to 120 m. max., and will not be expanded in any way.

EnJoy!

bikegypsy · #**7495** Posted **Jul 18, 2018, 5:24 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by J.OT13

Surface station platforms are 90 meters long. Underground stations (at least the three downtown) were built to the full length of 120 meters.

That said, they seem to have built the station caverns large enough to expand to 150 meters. This is based on my own speculation looking at GeoOttawa and my observations at Kontimum, along with a Citizen article a few years ago mentioning the size of the caverns (no source). Neither the Citizen, nor City official has ever confirmed the reason the caverns are bigger than needed.

It's safe to assume that the cars will each have - at one point - that extra section (for a length of 59m per car or 118m per full train) which would explain the larger length of the underground stations.

J.OT13 · #**7496** Posted **Jul 18, 2018, 7:51 PM**

Under O'Brien, they were initially looking at 180 meters, which would have been overkill. It then went down to 150 and finally 120. Cheaping out on underground stations in the downtown core is not the way to build a world-class city.

kevinbottawa · #**7497** Posted **Jul 18, 2018, 8:09 PM**

Took a few pictures on my walk today.

uOttawa station concourse

uOttawa station. I don't like the windy ramp; at least not on foot

The hole is finally closed on Rideau Street. That's a huge grate, especially on a shopping street.

Rideau Station

J.OT13 · #**7498** Posted **Jul 18, 2018, 11:03 PM**

Looking good. Thanks for the pics.

Anyone know what that extra little roof is at uOttawa Station, at the south end?

J.OT13 · #**7499** Posted **Jul 19, 2018, 12:04 AM**

Blair Station in the evening.

https://twitter.com/_stevenli/status/1019030325161181186

GlassCity · #**7500** Posted **Jul 19, 2018, 12:55 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by J.OT13

Under O'Brien, they were initially looking at 180 meters, which would have been overkill. It then went down to 150 and finally 120. Cheaping out on underground stations in the downtown core is not the way to build a world-class city.

Canada Line platforms downtown are 50 metres long, while the Expo Line's I believe are extendable to 100. Definitely not something to brag about, but I'm just saying I think Ottawa will be just fine with 120.