Confederation Line (Stage 1) | In Service 1.0

[OCCheetos]

Originally Posted by Truenorth00

All that said, interlining, would be great....if we had the money for it. So many compatibility issues. Confederation Line uses light rail. Trillium Line uses heavy rail rolling stock. Confederation Line is electrified. Trillium Line isn't. And with no double track on the Trillium Line, the junction at Bayview becomes a network and capacity planning nightmare.

Maybe some day when we can resolve a whole lot of issues with the Trillium Line, they can work towards interlining.

Again, as I mentioned earlier, you'd mostly end up with a situation identical to that of Lower Bay station in Toronto. The Trillium and Confederation lines should remain separate forever. We don't ever need to go back to milk-running everything.

[Truenorth00]

Originally Posted by OCCheetos

Again, as I mentioned earlier, you'd mostly end up with a situation identical to that of Lower Bay station in Toronto. The Trillium and Confederation lines should remain separate forever. We don't ever need to go back to milk-running everything.

I mean if the issues involved were solved....

But I don't think we'll ever be in a situation where the network considerations allow for that interlining. And in the interim, the question will always be, "Do I put these dollars the province gave us towards extension or interlining?" And the answer will always be extension.

[J.OT13]

Putting aside the obvious issues with the Trillium Line's incompatible technology, reliability and capacity issues, I generally don't have a big issue with killing the idea of interlining the system because LeBreton Flats and Bayview Yards will be a major destination within the next 5-10 years with the new arena, office towers, condos, apartments and hotels.

However, again putting aside the 2021 asinine airport spur situation (where people will have to take 3 trains to downtown), I think it is important that the airport line eventually go downtown. If it opened today, it would be a huge boon for the business and tourism industry by having the potential of taking one train from the airport and have access to 1,500 hotel rooms and the Ottawa Convention Centre without ever stepping outside. That's something that currently, only Vancouver has.

I understand that the Lyon and Parliament platforms are grossly underbuit and that having a few hundred people wait for the second or third train could cause an issue. I don't even think they will be able to handle the eventual 24,000 pphpd capacity of the line. I would recommend just having the airport trains (maybe every 20 minutes) go all the way downtown. Tourists could wait for their train while locals going anywhere else along the Trillium Line would take any train and transfer at Bayview if need be.

If I were master of the universe, I would cancel Stage 2 Trillium and instead double track and electrify to South Keys with a single track loop around the airport and have the airport trains, and only the airport trains, go all the way downtown.

The South End would be served in stage 3 with the an extension from Baseline to Barrhaven Town Centre, along with the Kanata Line to Palladium (not Sttitsville). All suburbs are now served, let's start building subways in the urban core.

As for the Gatineau issue, I would not extend the Trillium across the River. Instead, i would have STO trains terminate at Bayview and Rideau. The City of Ottawa could give the PoW bridge to the Feds or Gatineau in exchange for not having to pay for the short lines into Ottawa (but still contribute to station integration).

[J.OT13]

Why did the City go all-out (or as "all-out" as Ottawa is capable) with Rideau Station, but not Lyon and Parliament? Rideau will probably have the lowest volume of people going through of the three downtown station. And to boot, that volume will be more spread-out throughout the day compared to the CBD stations that will mostly see crush-load volumes at rush-hour.

[acottawa]

Originally Posted by J.OT13

Why did the City go all-out (or as "all-out" as Ottawa is capable) with Rideau Station, but not Lyon and Parliament? Rideau will probably have the lowest volume of people going through of the three downtown station. And to boot, that volume will be more spread-out throughout the day compared to the CBD stations that will mostly see crush-load volumes at rush-hour.

Maybe just because they had more space to work with?

[passwordisnt123]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

There have been extensive opposition to interlining on this board. Obviously, that is not possible given the differences in technology for the foreseeable future, however, the opposition has been more general than that. Surely, you have heard the 'every train will be your train' comment and that we have not built the downtown platforms big enough. Of course, now there are comments about short turning trains so the 'every train is your train' comment goes out the window and if that were to ever happen, a lot of people will be waiting more than one train in the downtown tunnel.

I think you might be conflating opposition to interlining the Confederation Line with the Trillium Line and opposition to interlining in general. The Confederation Line is already going to be interlined after Lincoln Fields and I don't see anybody complaining about that here. I think most people probably think that's pretty reasonable.

[AuxTown]

Originally Posted by J.OT13

Why did the City go all-out (or as "all-out" as Ottawa is capable) with Rideau Station, but not Lyon and Parliament? Rideau will probably have the lowest volume of people going through of the three downtown station. And to boot, that volume will be more spread-out throughout the day compared to the CBD stations that will mostly see crush-load volumes at rush-hour.

- It WILL be a very busy station
- There is a ton of growth potential in the area so likely more and more 'locals' using it to access transit in the coming years
- It is a huge tourist destination with it servicing the market, hotels, Rideau Centre, and the canal
- There will be, for the foreseeable future, a lot of people transferring from there to Mackenzie King for non-Confederation OC buses and STO

These are the reasons I would suggest Rideau IS essentially the centre of our system and deserves the larger station.

Are they getting all STO buses off of Rideau/Wellington once this is done? I can't stand seeing all that garbage lined up in front of what is supposed to be one of the most spectacular tourist spots/views in the country!

[Aylmer]

As a card-carrying member of "all that garbage", I'd invite you to find some more polite language to refer to the tens of thousands of daily users who use Wellington.

[White Pine]

Originally Posted by passwordisnt123

I think you might be conflating opposition to interlining the Confederation Line with the Trillium Line and opposition to interlining in general. The Confederation Line is already going to be interlined after Lincoln Fields and I don't see anybody complaining about that here. I think most people probably think that's pretty reasonable.

Right, but that would mean someone at the end of the line would be served by every three trains instead of two. Better to make more tunnels as demand dictates and funding allows.

[White Pine]

Originally Posted by Aylmer

As a card-carrying member of "all that garbage", I'd invite you to find some more polite language to refer to the tens of thousands of daily users who use Wellington.

Not arguing your point, but I think that was a reference to the vehicles, not the riders.

[lrt's friend]

I see us 'rats' scurrying into our transit holes so that the political class does not have to rub shoulders with us. Give their limos free use of downtown streets and clean up their views. Isn't that consistent with moving the homeless to Vanier?

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by White Pine

Not arguing your point, but I think that was a reference to the vehicles, not the riders.

FYI, 21% of Ottawa (Ont. part of the CMA) households are car-free.

I don't see any stats for families with kids though. It's obviously quite a bit lower than that.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by White Pine

Not arguing your point, but I think that was a reference to the vehicles, not the riders.

In all honesty, there is a lot of riff-raff near the STO stop on Rideau in front of Chapters. But those aren't generally the same people who are waiting for STO buses.

I don't particularly relish my kids waiting for buses there. Especially not if they're alone.

Though I am now comforted by the idea that Aylmer might be around, ready to leap to their defence!

[wingman]

Originally Posted by O-Town Hockey

Are they getting all STO buses off of Rideau/Wellington once this is done? I can't stand seeing all that garbage lined up in front of what is supposed to be one of the most spectacular tourist spots/views in the country!

I take offence to the 'garbage' comment too... but to answer your question, yes, they are generally shifting to Albert, Slater and MacKenzie King.

[Aylmer]

Originally Posted by Acajack

In all honesty, there is a lot of riff-raff near the STO stop on Rideau in front of Chapters. But those aren't generally the same people who are waiting for STO buses.

I don't particularly relish my kids waiting for buses there. Especially not if they're alone.

Though I am now comforted by the idea that Aylmer might be around, ready to leap to their defence!

For all its seediness, it's the ever-present army of transit users' gazes that keep Rideau from being dangerous. There are always people at all hours to stare-shame potentially dangerous activity into submission or intervene if things truly get out of hand. Your kids are likely in greater danger crossing a street in genteel Champlain Park than they are waiting at 9:30pm at the Rideau bus stop because of this. Rideau may have its uncomfortable or unsavoury characters, but discomfort and danger are two different things.

And yes, I might one day be part of the transit battalion leaping to their defence, but the opportunity is unlikely to ever come up there.

[lrt's friend]

Originally Posted by Aylmer

For all its seediness, it's the ever-present army of transit users' gazes that keep Rideau from being dangerous. There are always people at all hours to stare-shame potentially dangerous activity into submission or intervene if things truly get out of hand. Your kids are likely in greater danger crossing a street in genteel Champlain Park than they are waiting at 9:30pm at the Rideau bus stop because of this. Rideau may have its uncomfortable or unsavoury characters, but discomfort and danger are two different things.

And yes, I might one day be part of the transit battalion leaping to their defence, but the opportunity is unlikely to ever come up there.

In general what you say is very true. Streets full of pedestrians are whole lot safer than those with an abandoned feel. I hope that the end of construction will see a new renaissance on Rideau Street that will liven it beyond the couple of blocks around the Rideau Centre.

[White Pine]

Originally Posted by Acajack

FYI, 21% of Ottawa (Ont. part of the CMA) households are car-free.

I don't see any stats for families with kids though. It's obviously quite a bit lower than that.

Busses, sorry!

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by White Pine

Busses, sorry!

Sorry, I responded to the wrong post anyway!

But you still got the point(s).

[Uhuniau]

Originally Posted by O-Town Hockey

Are they getting all STO buses off of Rideau/Wellington once this is done? I can't stand seeing all that garbage lined up in front of what is supposed to be one of the most spectacular tourist spots/views in the country!

How are buses "garbage"?

Why should transit users be denied access to that spot, when drivists will continue to have dominant use of Wellington?

Why is it taken as a given in Ottawa that bus transit is a bad thing on city streets, and something that needs to be put out of sight somewhere?

[Uhuniau]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

I see us 'rats' scurrying into our transit holes so that the political class does not have to rub shoulders with us. Give their limos free use of downtown streets and clean up their views. Isn't that consistent with moving the homeless to Vanier?

The classism in this town...