Canadian Airport Thread

[hollywoodcory]

https://aircanada.mediaroom.com/2018-03-...d-Edmonton-Las-Vegas-Flights-Next-Winter

It. Just. Got. Interesting.

AC going after WS in its home turf of Alberta. Mainline PSP and PHX!?

[MTLskyline]

Originally Posted by d_jeffrey

18 minutes with express service to the Airport. Hence I don't see the point of catching a plane at YHU. It takes about 20 minutes by car to get there, there's no clear benefit for someone DT.

There are 1.5M in the Monteregie region that would probably find it more convenient to fly out of YHU than YUL, in addition to the people in Montreal for which YHU is either closer or the same distance. It might be particularly convenient if the yellow line connects to it one day.

Obviously the airport would likely not have many flights other than to Toronto City/Quebec City and a few other regional locations. Possibly a few locations in the Caribbean. Would also likely be well suited to one of the new low cost carriers.

[zahav]

Originally Posted by hollywoodcory

https://aircanada.mediaroom.com/2018-03-...d-Edmonton-Las-Vegas-Flights-Next-Winter

It. Just. Got. Interesting.

AC going after WS in its home turf of Alberta. Mainline PSP and PHX!?

Interesting how AC is converting Western Canada to mainline for "leisure" routes, kind of defeats all their reasonining for operating the cheaper-operating Rouge initially on these types of routes. And they aren't even using 737 MAX for the PHX and PSP routes, these as well as Los Cabos and Puerto Vallarta from YYC will be on 320s.

YVR saw a big boost with this announcement too. Now will be double daily flights to HNL and OGG, new service to LIH (again, targeting WS head-on since they were the only ones operating this route previously), as well as increased frequency to CUN, PVR, SJD, and IXT all on 737MAX. PHX and PSP will now be daily on 320s too. I wonder what they are doing with the extra Rouge 767s

[thenoflyzone]

Originally Posted by zahav

YVR saw a big boost with this announcement too............ I wonder what they are doing with the extra Rouge 767s

AC is simpy reshuffling their planes to better utilize the 767s due to the cap restriction at Rouge. It will indeed be interesting to see what they do with these 767s. Most likely a return to YYZ/YUL, especially if there will no longer be a pilot base for the 767 out west.

2 7M8s have 56 more seats than a Rouge 767. 2 A320s only have 10 more seats than a Rouge 767. So it's an 100% + increase in frequency on most routes, but only a 20% increase in passenger numbers per route, more or less.

[chris]

Originally Posted by MTLskyline

There are 1.5M in the Monteregie region that would probably find it more convenient to fly out of YHU than YUL, in addition to the people in Montreal for which YHU is either closer or the same distance. It might be particularly convenient if the yellow line connects to it one day.

Obviously the airport would likely not have many flights other than to Toronto City/Quebec City and a few other regional locations. Possibly a few locations in the Caribbean. Would also likely be well suited to one of the new low cost carriers.

Always wondered why the city of Sherbrooke, Quebec doesn't have commercial air service.

[thenoflyzone]

Originally Posted by chris

Always wondered why the city of Sherbrooke, Quebec doesn't have commercial air service.

10 years ago, Pascan tried YSC-YYZ. Didn't work. They were also flying to YUY and YVO i believe. Again, didn't last. Regional air fares in Quebec are the highest in the country. 1.20$ per nautical mile in Quebec vs 0.77$/nm elsewhere in the country. 67% of regional routes in Quebec have a monopoly on the route, vs 33% elsewhere. Unless that discrepency gets solved, secondary airports in Quebec wont flourish.

Link in french only

https://www.latribune.ca/affaires/vols-r...-quebec-00ee8086a992849cf12e206e5a91a334

[Johnny Aussie]

Originally Posted by thenoflyzone

AC is simpy reshuffling their planes to better utilize the 767s due to the cap restriction at Rouge. It will indeed be interesting to see what they do with these 767s. Most likely a return to YYZ/YUL, especially if there will no longer be a pilot base for the 767 out west.

2 7M8s have 56 more seats than a Rouge 767. 2 A320s only have 10 more seats than a Rouge 767. So it's an 100% + increase in frequency on most routes, but only a 20% increase in passenger numbers per route, more or less.

A 20% increase is a big boost to any route. And with better frequencies many more options for travellers. Including Westjet, YVR-Hawaii will have an incredible 11 daily flights next winter.

[Zmonkey]

Originally Posted by thenoflyzone

There are a few benefits. Cheaper landing fees, no gate hold issues due to capacity constraints at YUL, etc. The domestic jetty at YUL is not getting any bigger, and yet airlines keep adding flights.

Not saying it's a clear cut win for YHU, but there are benefits.

After the rail link will most travelers want to go out to Saint Hubert though?

From downtown, Dorval is 20KM from downtown, Saint Hubert is about 13KM.

It would be nice to have a 2nd airport in Montreal, and a mini hub for say someone like Porter to help bring fares down, I just don't see it as realistic.

Could the c-series land there? If porter does want a competitive advantage maybe run the c-series out of there out to western Canada? Could be a good connection for Quebec, Ottawa, Atlantic Canada and parts of the the North East US. Issue is will anyone in Toronto connect in Montreal to go to Alberta or BC?

[isaidso]

Perhaps the C-Series can fly out of Pearson or Munro.

[thenoflyzone]

Originally Posted by Zmonkey

After the rail link will most travelers want to go out to Saint Hubert though?

From downtown, Dorval is 20KM from downtown, Saint Hubert is about 13KM.

It would be nice to have a 2nd airport in Montreal, and a mini hub for say someone like Porter to help bring fares down, I just don't see it as realistic.

Could the c-series land there? If porter does want a competitive advantage maybe run the c-series out of there out to western Canada? Could be a good connection for Quebec, Ottawa, Atlantic Canada and parts of the the North East US.

For 1 to 2 million people, YHU is closer than YUL, so it would make sense for them. And yes, the CSeries has plenty of runway available at YHU. The CS100 only needs 4,800 ft of runway to takeoff at MTOW. The CS300, 6,200 ft. YHU's longest is 7,800 ft long.

If ever the runway at YTZ doesn't get extended, PD will have 2 choices. Start flights to YYZ, or establish an operating base at YOW, which already has a decent network to the Maritimes, and can support some more west coast flights.

Originally Posted by Zmonkey

Issue is will anyone in Toronto connect in Montreal to go to Alberta or BC?

Probably not. Which is why YYZ or YOW make more sense for PD.

Originally Posted by isaidso

Perhaps the C-Series can fly out of Pearson or Munro.

Pearson makes sense. Munro doesn't. Expanding westward from YOW makes more sense than establishing brand new operations at YHM, which is far removed from downtown Toronto and offers virtually zero high yield traffic. At least YOW has the higher yielding government traffic that PD can chase.

[Nicko999]

Originally Posted by thenoflyzone

They don't have enough gates at peak times, so this was inevitable. They will start boarding at remote gates this summer. They bought brand new buses for this.

Extensive towing operations have become the norm here (AC and TS). Have a look at latest imagery on Google Earth. ADM built remote parking north of runway 10/28, so that the tows don't go too far (specifically TS, as their hangar is next to the threshold to rwy 24R). This meant we couldn't use rwy 10/28.

Rwy 06L/24R and taxiway B need to be closed this spring/summer, as well as summer 2019, so we need to use rwy 10/28 in order to have at least 2 operational runways at all times. This means that the newly built remote parking needs to be decommissioned. ADM started doing that this week.( Brand new light poles came down.) They had changed all of runway 10/28s lights to blue, as it was going to be a taxiway for the foreseeable future, so the white lights need to return before we can use it. Huge cluster 🞵🞵🞵🞵 on their part. This is what happens when there is no long term planning at a company.

Anyway, I'll leave it at that for now.

This is what happens when you have no long-term vision and pick Dorval over Mirabel. Any person with an average IQ could see the problems Dorval was going to face in the future.

Originally Posted by MTLskyline

The Quebec Government is injecting $800K to study the construction of a terminal at St. Hubert Airport.

http://www.tvanouvelles.ca/2018/03/06/no...hie-dans-le-projet-daerogare-a-st-hubert

My point about complete lack of vision is proven by this waste of money. Every government since the 70's is trying to turn Montreal into a mid size American city rather than the huge metropolis it deserves to be. A couple of flights to Toronto won't solve YULs problems.

The solution would be to build a small but efficient terminal in Mirabel. Start off with some domestic flights and see how it goes.

[MTLskyline]

Originally Posted by Nicko999

My point about complete lack of vision is proven by this waste of money. Every government since the 70's is trying to turn Montreal into a mid size American city rather than the huge metropolis it deserves to be. A couple of flights to Toronto won't solve YULs problems.

The solution would be to build a small but efficient terminal in Mirabel. Start off with some domestic flights and see how it goes.

If anything, the development of St. Hubert Airport would have accelerated if Mirabel had remained and Dorval had been shut down. Mirabel is practically 70km away from Longueuil by car (and 50km from downtown Montreal).

Already, St. Hubert Airport is closer to downtown than Dorval, but if just Mirabel was operational, my bet would be that St. Hubert would be handling a lot more than a few Toronto flights (and this would have happened much earlier).

[casper]

Originally Posted by zahav

Interesting how AC is converting Western Canada to mainline for "leisure" routes, kind of defeats all their reasonining for operating the cheaper-operating Rouge initially on these types of routes. And they aren't even using 737 MAX for the PHX and PSP routes, these as well as Los Cabos and Puerto Vallarta from YYC will be on 320s.

YVR saw a big boost with this announcement too. Now will be double daily flights to HNL and OGG, new service to LIH (again, targeting WS head-on since they were the only ones operating this route previously), as well as increased frequency to CUN, PVR, SJD, and IXT all on 737MAX. PHX and PSP will now be daily on 320s too. I wonder what they are doing with the extra Rouge 767s

Us westerners never cared much for Rouge. We don't want to deprive our friends in central Canada of this fine airline banner. YYZ is a great base for Rouge.

[thenoflyzone]

Originally Posted by Nicko999

This is what happens when you have no long-term vision and pick Dorval over Mirabel. Any person with an average IQ could see the problems Dorval was going to face in the future.



My point about complete lack of vision is proven by this waste of money. Every government since the 70's is trying to turn Montreal into a mid size American city rather than the huge metropolis it deserves to be. A couple of flights to Toronto won't solve YULs problems.

The solution would be to build a small but efficient terminal in Mirabel. Start off with some domestic flights and see how it goes.

No one wants to catch a domestic flight from Mirabel. Especially when YUL has the same flights (and soon possibly YHU also). YMX's catchment area in that regard is peanuts compared to YUL and YHU.

Besides, ADM is in the process of updating their long term masterplan for YUL. i.e new terminal, permanent closure of rwy 10/28 to accomodate apron expansion, new taxiways, rail link to downtown, road access improvements, etc.

Keeping all operations at YUL is the right decision. If done properly, YUL will easily be able to accomodate 25-30 million passengers. YMX, as a commerical passenger airport, will never happen.

Montreal's future in that regard is YUL. Some token domestic flights at YHU arent going to change that.

They srewed the pooch with YMX. Time to get over it. It's now reborn of sorts as a GA airport and a BBD final assembly line. Aircraft movements are on the rise. I'm hearing talk of control tower services possibly returning. YMX's future looks bright in that regard. No need to complicate things with a passenger terminal that will most likely be underutilized.

[thenoflyzone]

On another note, with YYZ-HNL going mainline next winter, Rouge will officially be out of Hawaii altogether.

https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/air...-honolulu-service-changes-as-of-11mar18/

AC has struggled with this route from the start, reducing operating season and/or frequency every year. It will only operate for a 3 week period in W18.

[chris]

Originally Posted by thenoflyzone

No one wants to catch a domestic flight from Mirabel. Especially when YUL has the same flights (and soon possibly YHU also). YMX's catchment area in that regard is peanuts compared to YUL and YHU.

Besides, ADM is in the process of updating their long term masterplan for YUL. i.e new terminal, permanent closure of rwy 10/28 to accomodate apron expansion, new taxiways, rail link to downtown, road access improvements, etc.

Keeping all operations at YUL is the right decision. If done properly, YUL will easily be able to accomodate 25-30 million passengers. YMX, as a commerical passenger airport, will never happen.

Montreal's future in that regard is YUL. Some token domestic flights at YHU arent going to change that.

They srewed the pooch with YMX. Time to get over it. It's now reborn of sorts as a GA airport and a BBD final assembly line. Aircraft movements are on the rise. I'm hearing talk of control tower services possibly returning. YMX's future looks bright in that regard. No need to complicate things with a passenger terminal that will most likely be underutilized.

Is there room for a third or fourth parallel runway a YUL? Perhaps one adjacent to each of the current parallel runways?

[esquire]

Originally Posted by thenoflyzone

Montreal's future in that regard is YUL. Some token domestic flights at YHU arent going to change that.

They srewed the pooch with YMX. Time to get over it. It's now reborn of sorts as a GA airport and a BBD final assembly line. Aircraft movements are on the rise. I'm hearing talk of control tower services possibly returning. YMX's future looks bright in that regard. No need to complicate things with a passenger terminal that will most likely be underutilized.

Just throwing this out there, but if it gets busy enough that a control tower returns, what are the prospects of building a small modest terminal at Mirabel aimed mainly at charter and ULCC traffic? Montreal is a big market but it's often left out of the ULCC conversation... something like this could lead to that alternative.

What if your typical European glorified ULCC shed is built for this purpose, given that the aviation infrastructure is there along with the highways, parking lots, etc.?

[zahav]

Originally Posted by thenoflyzone

On another note, with YYZ-HNL going mainline next winter, Rouge will officially be out of Hawaii altogether.

https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/air...-honolulu-service-changes-as-of-11mar18/

AC has struggled with this route from the start, reducing operating season and/or frequency every year. It will only operate for a 3 week period in W18.

I feel like AC keeps this route just to have it included in the last of destinations out of YYZ to show global reach. I have heard from insiders the same thing about it struggling, it doesn't make much sense to keep it on such a minimal schedule

Also, correction on my earlier post regarding AC mainline switch:

Interesting how AC is converting Western Canada to mainline for "leisure" routes, kind of defeats all their reasonining for operating the cheaper-operating Rouge initially on these types of routes. And they aren't even using 737 MAX for the PHX and PSP routes, these as well as Los Cabos and Puerto Vallarta from YYC will be on 320s.

Los Cabos and PVR are 737MAX, not 320s. Only PSP and PHX are changing to 320, all other Mexico and Hawaii routes are 737MAX.

So that leaves Vegas and Orlando for Rouge winter destinations (both routes cycled through YYC or YUL I'm guessing since the Rouge base here will be closed).

[Coldrsx]

Edmonton International Airport
Passenger Statistics for February 2018 --

Highlights:
§ Terminal Traffic: 590,464 passengers
Q Domestic 441,651 passengers
Q Transborder 91,072 passengers
Q International 57,741 passengers

§ FBO Traffic*: 30,412 passengers

§ Grand Total: Overall 620,876 passengers


Growth%:
§ Terminal: 7.3%
Q Domestic 6.9%
Q Transborder 9.2%
Q International 7.6%

§ FBO Traffic: -2.0%

§ Grand Total: Overall 6.8%

Another record month.

[SpongeG]

An interesting read about airport hotels

How airport hotels are resurrecting the golden age of air travel

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/life/tra...golden-age-of-airtravel/article38215225/