Amazon HQ2 bid - Page 15

bigstick · #**281** Posted **Jan 19, 2018, 2:28 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Atlanta3000

O Sweet Mother of God in Heaven - I figured this would be cringy. However, take my expectations and multiply x 100.

Can you believe how utterly bad that is, and they actually criticize Seattle subtly...LOL

Atlanta3000 · #**282** Posted **Jan 19, 2018, 2:33 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Martinman

Amazon isn't looking for the biggest city. They are looking for some place that will meet their needs and it doesn't surprise me that mid-sized cities like Raleigh and Indianapolis are under consideration. Miami is the most surprising finalist to me only because it's seems so foreign to that city's current economy. But I have believed from the beginning that HQ2 could easily go to some unexpected city because this is such a game changer for whatever city they choose.

M-man - you are right, Amazon is not looking for the biggest city. They are however looking for a city. Downtown Raleigh is at best equivalent to one of Atlanta's smaller suburbs. If you look at Amazon's presence in Seattle, you can ascertain this is a company that wants to be located in very urban environment. Unlike most high-tech companies that still are building corporate campuses, Amazon wants to integrate into urban experience. Raleigh is polar opposite of what their corporate culture embraces. I would actually put Raleigh at the bottom of the list solely based on it's size and density.

Atlanta3000 · #**283** Posted **Jan 19, 2018, 2:38 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigstick

Can you believe how utterly bad that is, and they actually criticize Seattle subtly...LOL

BS - I was expecting BAD based on your rotten tomatoes review - this however was APOCALYPTIC. Dare I say, it was a dark chasm of HELL - FIRE - SIN!

Martinman · #**284** Posted **Jan 19, 2018, 3:25 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Atlanta3000

M-man - you are right, Amazon is not looking for the biggest city. They are however looking for a city. Downtown Raleigh is at best equivalent to one of Atlanta's smaller suburbs. If you look at Amazon's presence in Seattle, you can ascertain this is a company that wants to be located in very urban environment. Unlike most high-tech companies that still are building corporate campuses, Amazon wants to integrate into urban experience. Raleigh is polar opposite of what their corporate culture embraces. I would actually put Raleigh at the bottom of the list solely based on it's size and density.

The fact that Raleigh is one of 20 finalists out of 238 bids quite clearly shows that none of what you think Amazon is looking for has any merit with Amazon.

Atlanta3000 · #**285** Posted **Jan 19, 2018, 9:58 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Martinman

The fact that Raleigh is one of 20 finalists out of 238 bids quite clearly shows that none of what you think Amazon is looking for has any merit with Amazon.

Let me just leave this here......

Amazon's real estate chief leans toward urban campuses
https://webcache.googleusercontent.com/s...2&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us&client=firefox-b-1

montydawg · #**286** Posted **Jan 19, 2018, 9:27 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Atlanta3000

Let me just leave this here......

Amazon's real estate chief leans toward urban campuses
https://webcache.googleusercontent.com/s...2&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us&client=firefox-b-1

I will point out that PaddyPower has downgraded Atlanta from the #1 spot. Boston is now #1, and Austin and Atlanta are tied for #2.

bigstick · #**287** Posted **Jan 19, 2018, 9:47 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by montydawg

I will point out that PaddyPower has downgraded Atlanta from the #1 spot. Boston is now #1, and Austin and Atlanta are tied for #2.

http://www.strawpoll.me/14872219/r

Libertarian · #**288** Posted **Jan 20, 2018, 4:13 AM**

Could one of you research gurus check on who currently owns the block bordered by Spring, 3rd, West Peachtree, and Ponce de Leon Ave. NW? Just wondering. Thanks.

Martinman · #**289** Posted **Jan 20, 2018, 4:53 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Atlanta3000

Let me just leave this here......

Amazon's real estate chief leans toward urban campuses
https://webcache.googleusercontent.com/s...2&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us&client=firefox-b-1

Just an FYI

Urban and big city are NOT synonymous. In fact several of the most urban cities in the South are small to mid-sized cities such as Charleston, Savannah and New Orleans.

Atlanta3000 · #**290** Posted **Jan 20, 2018, 10:48 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Martinman

Just an FYI

Urban and big city are NOT synonymous. In fact several of the most urban cities in the South are small to mid-sized cities such as Charleston, Savannah and New Orleans.

Please don't insult my intelligence assuming I don't know the distinction between urban and size. With respect to the adjectives URBAN and SIZE - Raleigh doesn't have either to close out the conversation.

Atlanta3000 · #**291** Posted **Jan 20, 2018, 10:59 AM**

This is a very interesting article and I believe illustrates why Atlanta is ultimately positioned as the best option for Amazon's HQ2. With Amazon's emphasis on affordable housing I think 3/4 of the short listed cities will be eliminated - specifically all of the NE cities.

Amazon's real estate chief just outlined the company's top priorities for HQ2

https://webcache.googleusercontent.com/s...+&cd=2&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us&client=safari

Quote:

“We look to it being a combination of buildings and facilities probably within walking proximity to one another,” Schoettler said.

Quote:

“We look forward to cities that are also progressive and are thinking forward and long-term in terms of affordable housing and mass transportation and being able to move people around,” Schoettler said.

Street Advocate · #**292** Posted **Jan 20, 2018, 1:36 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Libertarian

Could one of you research gurus check on who currently owns the block bordered by Spring, 3rd, West Peachtree, and Ponce de Leon Ave. NW? Just wondering. Thanks.

A handful of owners on ~2 parcels including reliastar life insurance, an MD practice, potentially three separate archbishops (donoghue John F, Donnelan Thomas A, and an unnamed archbishop of Roman Catholic something it other), Hiott Jeff w/Watson Barbara.

You can review any parcel in the city here. It’s relatively up to date
http://gis.atlantaga.gov/dpcdviewer/

Libertarian · #**293** Posted **Jan 20, 2018, 2:29 PM**

Thank you for the amazing link.

Libertarian · #**294** Posted **Jan 20, 2018, 3:10 PM**

I can appreciate how Atlanta/Fulton could occasionally justify developer tax abatement (subsidy) in a few cases, but I can't see the benefit to voters and taxpayers of a giveaway by the State of Georgia to the world's most wealthy person, Jeff Bezos and his protected corporation. Nor can I understand why the state gives subsidies to the film industry. These activities already benefit from existing local infrastructure, low cost of living, and educational resources, so why make it a la mode? Better would be that the state take back all the corporate subsidies and benefits and give the taxpayers a reduction or elimination of the state income tax. This would provide direct relief to the citizens and also make our businesses competitive with Florida, Tennessee and Texas.

skyscraperpage17 · #**295** Posted **Jan 20, 2018, 3:17 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Libertarian

I can appreciate how Atlanta/Fulton could occasionally justify developer tax abatement (subsidy) in a few cases, but I can't see the benefit to voters and taxpayers of a giveaway by the State of Georgia to the world's most wealthy person, Jeff Bezos and his protected corporation. Nor can I understand why the state gives subsidies to the film industry. These activities already benefit from existing local infrastructure, low cost of living, and educational resources, so why make it a la mode? Better would be that the state take back all the corporate subsidies and benefits and give the taxpayers a reduction or elimination of the state income tax. This would provide direct relief to the citizens and also make our businesses competitive with Florida, Tennessee and Texas.

One thing you're forgetting:

Florida, Texas and Tennessee are doing the same thing Georgia's doing (with respect to the corporate subsidies) via. higher sales and property taxes. They traded in one funding mechanism for others.

Are Georgians willing to do the same? I tend to doubt it.

Libertarian · #**296** Posted **Jan 20, 2018, 3:33 PM**

When states take the bait from Amazon etc. and compete with one another to offer giveaways to get their business it's a losing proposition for the 99% of us.

Atlanta3000 · #**297** Posted **Jan 20, 2018, 4:09 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Libertarian

When states take the bait from Amazon etc. and compete with one another to offer giveaways to get their business it's a losing proposition for the 99% of us.

Normally I would 100% agree with you. Amazon is an exception for a number of reasons:

* If selected Atlanta would immediately be catapulted into a league of elite tech hubs in the US and Internationally.

* Tech jobs are the jobs of the future. Amazon will provide an economic foundation that will allow Atlanta to weather future recessions better than otherwise and raise the median wage for most Atlantans because of the increased competition.

* TRANSPORATION - Landing Amazon will force the CoA, Metro Counties and the State to make significant investments in infrastructure both short and long term.

* Spinoffs - when a company attracts the best talent, invariably they leave to create start ups that drive additional economic benefits.

* PR - Worldwide Atlanta will be put on stage for winning the most significant corporate expansion in US history.

Libertarian you and I are usually on the same stage. However I can't stress enough that attracting Amazon AT ANY COST is the best investment Atlanta will ever make.

Libertarian · #**298** Posted **Jan 20, 2018, 4:34 PM**

You may well be right. Assuming this lands in Atlanta I wish we could look into the future and see the results. I don't trust Bezos to see beyond his own self interest, but I'd love to be proven wrong.

Street Advocate · #**299** Posted **Jan 20, 2018, 5:18 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Atlanta3000

tech jobs & Spinoffs

This is my big interest in amazon’s potential. Obviously the transportation investment would be huge, but who knows if/what would be built. Hopefully not all talent is captured by Anazon wherever they go, but rather it breeds healthy competition as HQ2 location becomes an incubator for innovation and encourages more talent to come and stay in the area. Atlanta has an issue with retaining top talent. Atlanta’s startup and tech scene exists, but it simply pales to a lot of other cities.

Khantilever · #**300** Posted **Jan 20, 2018, 5:53 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Libertarian

When states take the bait from Amazon etc. and compete with one another to offer giveaways to get their business it's a losing proposition for the 99% of us.

OR, the competition helps nudge Amazon toward the location that maximizes the collective benefit. If Atlanta would benefit more than Boston, but Amazon is indifferent between the two, we as a society should want Atlanta to be able to provide incentives to get Amazon to make the right choice.

If you're concerned about the *distributional* effects, i.e. that Amazon captures much of the surplus that would otherwise go to the city they locate in, that's why we have income (corporate and individual), sales, and wealth taxes. Let's encourage efficient choices and then use tax-and-transfer mechanisms to get the distribution of wealth we want.