YVR Airport & Sea Island Developments Discussion

[moosejaw]

Originally Posted by SpongeG

apple's european headquarters are there too aren't they?

Yes as well as Amazon
Ireland has a real low corporate tax rate as well as a english speaking population that make its very attractive to US companies.

[officedweller]

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[LeftCoaster]

Originally Posted by YVR_Future

I had no idea YVR was getting a Skyteam lounge. Exciting!

Yep, announced several months ago. Looks pretty nice. AC just finished an update of their Intl lounge as well (presumably in response to this). I was flying to Tokyo last week and checked it out, pretty solid, makes it all the more obvious how lacking their domestic lounge is. Upper floor wasn't open when I was there though so still some work to do. They must have wanted to open before SkyTeam.

Originally Posted by mezzanine

my guess, if it ever comes to fruition, is Vietnam airlines

There's a big Vietnamese population in Vancouver, but it isn't the wealthiest so I doubt the VFR is going to be a driver here. Strange they would mention Vancouver but then again they also mentioned Montreal which makes no sense so maybe they were just throwing out locations.

If it were to happen it would be huge though. Very unique location for YVR and our first (if Manila doesn't count) SE Asian destination.

Originally Posted by Vagabond

AC has just announced a codeshare arrangement with TG for flights from Taipei to Bangkok. So it's looking like any medium-term prospect for YVR-BKK will be on TG (if at all).

I'd be surprised, but anythign is possible.

[LeftCoaster]

Originally Posted by Johnny Aussie

I’d say that’s still excellent growth! Don’t forget too that with the large increases observed over the last two years, the base is that much higher so % increases don’t necessarily paint the whole picture. The fact YVR saw 131,000 more pax in Sept 2017 vs Sept 2016 is amazing. Especially when compared to most other airports in Canada and especially Western Canada..

Oh I know, but I would think by now you have noticed I have a well established track record of greediness when it comes to YVR's growth!

[thenoflyzone]

Originally Posted by LeftCoaster

Strange they would mention Vancouver but then again they also mentioned Montreal which makes no sense so maybe they were just throwing out locations.

Although both routes are highly unlikely, they were definately not just throwing out locations.

There are several reasons why they would mention Montreal. First, Montreal has a larger Vietnamese Canadian population than Vancouver. Second, Vietnam used to be a french colony, and a lot of Vietnamese know how to speak french. The country is part of the Francophonie, an international organization representing countries and regions where French is the first or customary language. It's member states (Quebec is a participating government, along with Canada and New Brunswick) cooperate in the fields of education, culture, science, economy, etc.

A decent number of Vietnamese students come to Montreal to study, through the Canadian Francophonie Scholarship Program. So taking into account the linguistic ties and the fact that Vietnam is now a mainstream tourism destination, a lot of French Canadians venture to that part of the world also. Hence why Vietnam Airlines would mention Montreal as a possible destination.

Either way, a non stop is out of the question (too long and thin), and even a one stop is highly unlikely. And I dont see them operating into YVR either. The only routes to North America that make sense for Vietnam Airlines are to LAX and SFO. They will apparently try to launch LAX next year, but I have my doubts if it will succeed, even if it is the world's largest unserved market. (SGN-LAX O&D over 200,000 in 2015)

[YVR_Future]

Originally Posted by LeftCoaster

If it were to happen it would be huge though. Very unique location for YVR and our first (if Manila doesn't count) SE Asian destination.

Didn't SQ fly to YVR in the past? Do you think there's any chance of that coming back?

[mezzanine]

Originally Posted by thenoflyzone

And I dont see them operating into YVR either. The only routes to North America that make sense for Vietnam Airlines are to LAX and SFO. They will apparently try to launch LAX next year, but I have my doubts if it will succeed, even if it is the world's largest unserved market. (SGN-LAX O&D over 200,000 in 2015)

I agree that it will be challenging for VN to serve north america, but vancouver is mentioned in their 2014 prospectus for NA growth after LAX, along with IAD and SFO.

I can see a lot of push as TG, VN and SQ along with them likely want to be the first mover for further NA routes. Then again, YVR is still waiting, although VN flights to LAX were supposed to start back in 2016 according to the prospectus...

[mezzanine]

Originally Posted by YVR_Future

Didn't SQ fly to YVR in the past? Do you think there's any chance of that coming back?

SQ flew as a 5th freedom flight via ICN. It was cancelled after the 2008 financial crisis. not sure if the conditions are there to bring back the original route...

[trofirhen]

Originally Posted by mezzanine

SQ flew as a 5th freedom flight via ICN. It was cancelled after the 2008 financial crisis. not sure if the conditions are there to bring back the original route...

Is there any chance of SQ flying YVR >< SIN nonstop? United recently started LAX >< SIN nonstop, the longest nonstop out of the USA 14117 km. YVR >< SIN shorter at 12827 km.
Also JFK >< LAX is in fact longer by a tad than JFK >< YVR. So maybe, as with PAL, this could be a lucrative possibility. Hope so.

[thenoflyzone]

Originally Posted by mezzanine

SQ flew as a 5th freedom flight via ICN. It was cancelled after the 2008 financial crisis. not sure if the conditions are there to bring back the original route...

SQ wants a non stop to YVR, which is not allowed under the current bilateral. They can, however, resume SIN-ICN-YVR tomorrow if they wish.

Originally Posted by trofirhen

Is there any chance of SQ flying YVR >< SIN nonstop?

Not at the moment. The bilateral will need to be updated. Link from 2007, when the last bilateral was signed.

https://www.mot.gov.sg/News-Centre/News/...des-Air-Transport-Agreement-With-Canada/

Under the new bilateral agreement, Singapore carriers are allowed to operate passenger and all-cargo flights as frequently as desired between Singapore and Canada, via selected intermediate points.

[trofirhen]

Originally Posted by thenoflyzone

SQ wants a non stop to YVR, which is not allowed under the current bilateral. They can, however, resume SIN-ICN-YVR tomorrow if they wish.

Not at the moment. The bilateral will need to be updated. Link from 2007, when the last bilateral was signed.
https://www.mot.gov.sg/News-Centre/News/...des-Air-Transport-Agreement-With-Canada/

When can they update this bilateral? Isn't it overdue? If they cannot, WHY not? It would be a great route to have, and provide real competition to the LAX >< SIN United nonstop, imo.

[LeftCoaster]

I would be interested as to why Canada has not re-negotiated with SG. Sure AC would have a bit more competition on their Aus routes, but Singapore is not a cheap place to fly though so I can't imagine it would be that big an issue. Frankly I'd imagine Singapore could fill the planes without leaching too much AC business at all, the city itself is a big draw and a great jumping off point for Indonesia and Malaysia.

Originally Posted by thenoflyzone

Although both routes are highly unlikely, they were definately not just throwing out locations.

There are several reasons why they would mention Montreal. First, Montreal has a larger Vietnamese Canadian population than Vancouver. Second, Vietnam used to be a french colony, and a lot of Vietnamese know how to speak french. The country is part of the Francophonie, an international organization representing countries and regions where French is the first or customary language. It's member states (Quebec is a participating government, along with Canada and New Brunswick) cooperate in the fields of education, culture, science, economy, etc.

Good point, didn't even think about the French connection, though it is a bit of a longshot.

I'd love to see VN come to Canada, if not for anything else than their beautiful livery.

[trofirhen]

Originally Posted by LeftCoaster

I would be interested as to why Canada has not re-negotiated with SG. Sure AC would have a bit more competition on their Aus routes, but Singapore is not a cheap place to fly though so I can't imagine it would be that big an issue. Frankly I'd imagine Singapore could fill the planes without leaching too much AC business at all, the city itself is a big draw and a great jumping off point for Indonesia and Malaysia.



Good point, didn't even think about the French connection, though it is a bit of a longshot.

I'd love to see VN come to Canada, if not for anything else than their beautiful livery.

Do you think a YVR><BKK><SIN no-change-of-plane routing would be possible, using any airline, or combination thereof? Or must it be a nonstop, involving whichever airline / airlines?
*I checked YVR><HND><Jakarta, the YVR><SIN><Jakarta, ...... and the distance is almost exacrly the same: 400 km difference. (thought it would be much different, but no)

[thenoflyzone]

Originally Posted by LeftCoaster

I'd love to see VN come to Canada, if not for anything else than their beautiful livery.

Their 777 came to YOW and YQB for an official visit with both governments back in 2005.

Current livery hasn't changed that much compared to back then. Nice looking bird.

Some pics from YQB.

http://www.airliners.net/photo/Vietnam-A...7t78Z%2BsAPa9Mu73nIbaaeN2AcUy0LF%2BrdjTV

https://www.jetphotos.com/photo/499531

[LeftCoaster]

Funny you mention that routing, I flew YVR-HND-SIN on ANA last week. Pretty easy routing, but of course a direct would be better.

No idea on the legalities of a YVR-BKK-SIN route, but I bet Thai wouldn't be too happy about it.

[trofirhen]

Originally Posted by LeftCoaster

Funny you mention that routing, I flew YVR-HND-SIN on ANA last week. Pretty easy routing, but of course a direct would be better.

No idea on the legalities of a YVR-BKK-SIN route, but I bet Thai wouldn't be too happy about it.

That's true enough!! But could it be split beween Thai and Air Canada + SQL with a codeshare? (although I will admit; Three's a Crowd!!)
I'd love to see YVR get that Southeast Asia access though ..... yeppers .... wouldn't we all !!!!
Finally, why can that 2007 bilateral not be updated? If AC and SQL shared a YVR-SIN nonstop, the tightasses in Ottawa would surely go for it.

[YVR_Future]

Originally Posted by trofirhen

That's true enough!! But could it be split beween Thai and Air Canada + SQL with a codeshare? (although I will admit; Three's a Crowd!!)
I'd love to see YVR get that Southeast Asia access though ..... yeppers .... wouldn't we all !!!!
Finally, why can that 2007 bilateral not be updated? If AC and SQL shared a YVR-SIN nonstop, the tightasses in Ottawa would surely go for it.

Direct YVR-SIN would be great. I really don't know what it takes to renegotiate a bilateral, but if AC and SQ pushed for it, I suspect it could happen.

[trofirhen]

Originally Posted by YVR_Future

Direct YVR-SIN would be great. I really don't know what it takes to renegotiate a bilateral, but if AC and SQ pushed for it, I suspect it could happen.

Wouldn't that be great!! If AC was in on the action, flying and codesharing YVR><SIN with SQL, it would very possibly materialize, IMO. Thai would do YVR><BKK and we'd be set!!

[Hourglass]

Originally Posted by thenoflyzone

SQ wants a non stop to YVR, which is not allowed under the current bilateral. They can, however, resume SIN-ICN-YVR tomorrow if they wish.



Not at the moment. The bilateral will need to be updated. Link from 2007, when the last bilateral was signed.

https://www.mot.gov.sg/News-Centre/News/...des-Air-Transport-Agreement-With-Canada/

The info in that link seems a bit off. I distinctly recall that SQ was limited to 2/3x weekly via ICN and was seeking to increase frequency via ICN (1-stop via HKG was also a speculated target during negotiations). SQ was claiming at the time (probably to raise support for their position) that they were running 98% full on their YVR flights.

That negotiating position was shut down by the Canadian side as not being beneficial (and that’s certainly an argument used to limit ME3 access to Canada). No limitations on non-stop service between Canada and Singapore — and this would also be completely consistent with Canada's Blue Skies negotiating position.

I’ll see if I can find links to this, but it was years ago. And anyways, the 2008 financial meltdown made it moot.

**Edit - haven’t found the news links, but here was some of the chatter on SQtalk (a Singapore Airlines community forum)
http://www.sqtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=4252
http://www.sqtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?p=13655
http://www.sqtalk.com/forum/archive/index.php/t-6345.html

[YVR_Future]

What a shame. Also, having SQ (along with AC & CX) flying YVR-HKG would be great.