Salt Lake City: Official Development News Thread - Part 5

[delts145]

Originally Posted by asies1981

I didn't mention this in the article but it is the out of state developers that are going for the downtown office space like Held and Patrinely. And it is the out of state developers that are doing the really large residential like Salt. I think we are going to see a jump in out of state interest and they are going to be the ones leading a lot of downtown and downtown adjacent development over the next decade.

I think your right, and I certainly hope that's what happens. Like Ironweed was saying, the local development investors seem very wimpy when it comes to major projects. As with the article Stenar posted, it would seem that even the national experts, who believe Salt Lake City is one of the top five investment opportunities, are pointing out the lack of local investment capital. Hopefully, what we're seeing with the likes of Patrinely, Salt, and Held is evidence of more to come, especially in building a few new tallest.

[bob rulz]

Originally Posted by ajiuO

It’s over at Reddit, where this outdated forum should consider migrating to.

How about no? One of the things that appeals to me about this forum is that it is NOT Reddit.

[ajiuO]

Originally Posted by bob rulz

How about no? One of the things that appeals to me about this forum is that it is NOT Reddit.

I’d be cool if they just updated the forum. It’s so outdated that it’s almost ridiculous. It’s seriously the only forum I know of at this point that doesn’t support either Tapatalk or at least have their own mobile solution.

And I’ve been complaining about this for 5 years because it’s been outdated for longer than 5 years.

[Comrade]

Originally Posted by Ironweed

This is the conundrum I've been discussing ad nauseum. I personally blame the citizens and local developers for their ignorance of proper urban planning. We are living in a mountain basin. The region is not conducive to sprawl. The overall development process along the Wasatch Front has been a failure. No intelligent thought process has been achieved when considering sprawl, traffic, and pollution. I have read numerous comments from different publications other than this forum. Articles discuss the rapid current and future growth. The comments from the locals are frustrating. They honestly believe that additional growth will occur away from the Wasatch Front. SLC is clearly behind the eight ball as well when discussing development. The culprits: Poor leadership, and wimpy local lenders. Hopefully the trends can change. Hopefully capital firms and developers outside of Utah will address the in equilibrium on the supply and demand curve. The locals clearly don't know how to.

It's been the de-emphasis of central city development for the last 50 years that has led to this type of mindset. Utah remains very suburban oriented. Look no further than the Amazon discussion. The first site that came on the radar was...Draper's.

Utah is an echo chamber and, unfortunately, our leaders are almost tied to suburban living and have been their whole lives. The lack of diversity in Utah government has directly led to this. Who's the most influential politician in the state? Whoever you say, or believe, they probably come from a suburban city and have experienced that suburban mindset their whole lives.

IS it a bad mindset? Not always - when it's balanced out by other views on the issue. Unfortunately, because of Utah's political makeup, where the minority party is solely based in the most urban center of the state (SLC), and Utah remains probably the most lopsided one-party state in the country, there is no diversity. It's all fed through the suburban experience and in that regard, they don't know any better.

A great deal of other states similar to Utah do not have this problem. Salt Lake City is a pretty significant hub in the region. It's not Boise or Albuquerque - secondary cities in the western area of the United States. Yeah, it's not Denver, either, but it still is an economic hot spot for the west and one of the region's more important cities. Where it's different than Phoenix or Denver or Portland or Seattle is that its political reach within the state almost universally ends at its borders. Denver is a politically important city, not just in national politics but especially in local politics. They have a voice at the table. Salt Lake is probably one of the most politically impotent larger-ish US cities because of the homogeneous makeup of the Utah government - the people in power are either from suburban or rural communities, LDS, white and Republican.

Let's be honest, and I don't mean to stereotype, but that sub-group isn't exactly the first group you think of when you think of urban living.

[Ironweed]

Originally Posted by Comrade

It's been the de-emphasis of central city development for the last 50 years that has led to this type of mindset. Utah remains very suburban oriented. Look no further than the Amazon discussion. The first site that came on the radar was...Draper's.

Utah is an echo chamber and, unfortunately, our leaders are almost tied to suburban living and have been their whole lives. The lack of diversity in Utah government has directly led to this. Who's the most influential politician in the state? Whoever you say, or believe, they probably come from a suburban city and have experienced that suburban mindset their whole lives.

IS it a bad mindset? Not always - when it's balanced out by other views on the issue. Unfortunately, because of Utah's political makeup, where the minority party is solely based in the most urban center of the state (SLC), and Utah remains probably the most lopsided one-party state in the country, there is no diversity. It's all fed through the suburban experience and in that regard, they don't know any better.

A great deal of other states similar to Utah do not have this problem. Salt Lake City is a pretty significant hub in the region. It's not Boise or Albuquerque - secondary cities in the western area of the United States. Yeah, it's not Denver, either, but it still is an economic hot spot for the west and one of the region's more important cities. Where it's different than Phoenix or Denver or Portland or Seattle is that its political reach within the state almost universally ends at its borders. Denver is a politically important city, not just in national politics but especially in local politics. They have a voice at the table. Salt Lake is probably one of the most politically impotent larger-ish US cities because of the homogeneous makeup of the Utah government - the people in power are either from suburban or rural communities, LDS, white and Republican.

Let's be honest, and I don't mean to stereotype, but that sub-group isn't exactly the first group you think of when you think of urban living.

I agree Comrade. Good points. We are not dealing with top shelf leadership in the planning category. It will lead to lower quality of life here. It already has to a degree.

[ajiuO]

Pleas tell me this isn’t a medical waste disposal that they have sitting in pioneer park.

First of all someone who just shot up H isn’t going to be in it enough to go find such a thing. Second of all that just kind Of says “it’s okay to come here and shoot up harion”

[asies1981]

As promised here's the information on the 1300 South/500 East development.

[Comrade]

Originally Posted by asies1981

As promised here's the information on the 1300 South/500 East development.

Yeah...uh...you linked to a Dear Prudence article.

[JMK]

I didn't know that Isaac read up on anything besides development,

but the article is on Building Salt Lake,
http://www.buildingsaltlake.com/deve...-liberty-park/

[Liberty Wellsian]

Originally Posted by JMK

I didn't know that Isaac read up on anything besides development,

but the article is on Building Salt Lake,
http://www.buildingsaltlake.com/deve...-liberty-park/

Well that's awful.

Srsly they could do so much better with that corner.

[Always Sunny in SLC]

Originally Posted by Comrade

Yeah...uh...you linked to a Dear Prudence article.

Never heard of Dear Prudence, but sounds interesting. At least it wasn't a link to the Salt Lake swinger scene.

[Stenar]

Originally Posted by Liberty Wellsian

Well that's awful.

Srsly they could do so much better with that corner.

Yeah, not impressed.

[asies1981]

Originally Posted by Comrade

Yeah...uh...you linked to a Dear Prudence article.

I was multitasking and mixed up my links, lol. Pretty great Dear Prudence article though, calling out a classist lady lol.

[jubguy3]

Originally Posted by ajiuO

Pleas tell me this isn’t a medical waste disposal that they have sitting in pioneer park.

First of all someone who just shot up H isn’t going to be in it enough to go find such a thing. Second of all that just kind Of says “it’s okay to come here and shoot up harion”

Yes, it looks like it says "SHARPS" on it. Here's the thing... these needle exchange programs and sharps disposal programs exist because we would rather have a heroin epidemic than a heroin epidemic and an aids epidemic and a hepatitis epidemic, etc. People are going to shoot up heroin either way until their addiction is clinically treated. Taking away their needles is not even close to a comprehensive solution for dealing with their addiction. I would imagine that the local government wouldn't want to have an aids epidemic at the same time as a heroin epidemic... so it makes sense to provide needles and needle disposal to addicts while they are addicted to curb any blood borne illnesses. The addiction treatment can come in the next phase.

I'm sure the junkies are nice enough to hang on to their needles until they've come down from their high and can go and dispose of them. They're addicted but they aren't bad people.

I'm just wondering why its like facing the street. I wouldn't exactly want to display something like sharps disposal to people coming into the city.

[bob rulz]

Easily accessible needle disposal may not look good, but it's an excellent idea. Better that the drug user drop it off there than leave it on the street for some kid to step on.

The needle exchange program that was set up in the Rio Grande district before they cracked down was very much shown to significantly reduce the number of needles found on the streets.

Originally Posted by Liberty Wellsian

Well that's awful.

Srsly they could do so much better with that corner.

It's not good, but the renderings are really rough, and with it having to go through the CBSDR process, there's a chance it could improve. I don't want to set the standard too low, but not everything has to be exceptional. At least it fronts the street and will make an attempt to feature some true mixed uses.

[asies1981]

The Pickle Building proposal won some grant money.

[flyinpenguin]

It looks like the Sears on State Street finally made the closing list.
This article contains complete list of new closures.
http://www.al.com/news/index.ssf/201...art_store.html

[FullCircle]

I've be anticipating that closure for a long time; it seems like the parking lot is always mostly empty and these types of department stores have been contracting for a while. Seems like prime space for this southern downtown tech campus idea to expand to.

[Liberty Wellsian]

Originally Posted by FullCircle

I've be anticipating that closure for a long time; it seems like the parking lot is always mostly empty and these types of department stores have been contracting for a while. Seems like prime space for this southern downtown tech campus idea to expand to.

I hope that that block gets more than 9-5 midrise tech buildings. I'm hoping for more of an extension of DT. A mix of highrise office, midrise residential, and lots of ground floor activity would make me happy.

[FullCircle]

Agreed; I don't think they have to be mutually exclusive. As it is sort of kitty corner to the Patrinely Group's tech campus, and all the talk of Amazon and the mostly surface parking blocks in the area, it seems like a good fit to focus on tech office, but good street engagement and 24/7 population is almost always a good idea downtown and adjacent.