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  #1121  
Old Posted Oct 5, 2017, 2:32 AM
Buggys Buggys is offline
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Originally Posted by zzptichka View Post
I like that they are reserving 50-car parking lot on a busy tight station for staff. Nice touch.

A geographical diagram or map should really have at least a N arrow, especially if it's not already facing N. :-S And they call themselves experts.
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  #1122  
Old Posted Oct 5, 2017, 2:54 AM
BlackRedGold BlackRedGold is offline
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Bottom right.
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  #1123  
Old Posted Oct 5, 2017, 4:04 AM
Uhuniau Uhuniau is offline
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A geographical diagram or map should really have at least a N arrow, especially if it's not already facing N. :-S And they call themselves experts.
A very, very, very, very, very, very, VERY common problem with such drawings and renderings by the city and its agencies.
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  #1124  
Old Posted Oct 5, 2017, 9:25 AM
Buggys Buggys is offline
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Bottom right.
Ah thanks. Mapping convention is to have them somewhere at the top, no? Or somehow stand out more than the rest of the map.
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  #1125  
Old Posted Oct 5, 2017, 1:03 PM
Uhuniau Uhuniau is offline
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Bottom right.
I think that points in the direction of Zed.
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  #1126  
Old Posted Oct 5, 2017, 2:24 PM
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roger1818 roger1818 is offline
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Originally Posted by Uhuniau View Post
I think that points in the direction of Zed.
If that is the Z-axis, this must be a (sideways) profile view of the station.

Last edited by roger1818; Oct 5, 2017 at 8:37 PM.
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  #1127  
Old Posted Oct 5, 2017, 7:58 PM
PHrenetic PHrenetic is offline
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Good Day....

a-hah.... so we ARE supposed to stand on our heads and hold our tongue just so in order to look at and see these thingies to make 'sense of them !!! <snort>
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  #1128  
Old Posted Oct 19, 2017, 4:47 PM
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City seeking a consultant for largest art buy in Ottawa's history

Jon Willing, Ottawa Citizen
Published on: October 18, 2017 | Last Updated: October 18, 2017 5:48 PM EDT


City hall needs a consultant to manage the largest-ever art buy for Ottawa and it’s willing to pay nearly $200,000 for the outsourced services.

The city is poised to spend $11 million on original art for the Stage 2 rail expansion of the Confederation Line LRT and the Trillium Line.

There’s so much work coordinating the art program for Stage 2 that the city needs an outside advisor to help manage that part of the transit expansion project scheduled to be done in 2023.

The city, which expects to pay $188,991 over six years for the consultant’s work, published a request for proposals earlier this week.

Spending money on a hired hand to quarterback an art program paints a bad picture for residents who are advocating for more community services, according to one councillor.

“When they see $188,000 being spent for a consultant, it’s hard for people to wrap their head around that,” Coun. Riley Brockington said.

Brockington said he accepts that acquiring art is a unique procurement initiative for the city, but it’s “a bitter pill to swallow” when residents are calling for more transit service, for example, when there are scarce tax dollars.

But Nicole Zuger, the city’s program manager of arts and heritage development, said the Stage 2 art program needs outside help to manage more than 17 art projects.

“This is beyond the capacity for the City of Ottawa public art program,” Zuger said in an email.

The Stage 2 transit blueprint calls for 40 kilometres of new rail and 23 new stations to be built after Stage 1 of the Confederation Line opens in 2018.

Stage 2 will stretch train tracks to Algonquin College and Moodie Drive in the west, Trim Road in the east and Earl Armstrong Road in the south, with a spur line to the Ottawa International Airport.

The consultant for the Stage 2 art program is expected to begin by the end of 2017 and the work will continue right through to the opening in 2023.

According to Zuger, the consultant will work with city staff to lead the first phase of the art procurement process, which includes pre-qualification, shortlists and juried selection.

The art consultant will also be in charge of organizing a “materials and methods” symposium, Zuger said.

“This symposium will provide artists with an opportunity to learn from public art professionals, fabricators and established public artists in the application of evolving their current art practice into permanent public art projects,” Zuger said.

A municipal policy compels the city to dedicate one per cent of its funding of major projects to public art. The city is paying $1 billion for its share of the $3.6-billion Stage 2 project. The federal and provincial governments are splitting the rest of the cost.

The city will dedicate $10 million to commissioning art for the two rail lines.

The city is throwing in another $1 million for art specifically in the corridor of Richmond Road and the Byron Avenue linear park, since that stretch will undergo significant transformation during and after the cut-and-cover construction of a train tunnel.

The Stage 1 artwork, which will cost $7.3 million, will be spread across the 13 stations currently under construction.

The city didn’t hire an art consultant for Stage 1, but rail director Steve Cripps said a “technical advisor” was retained to support a number of components of the LRT project, including the public art. The technical advisor fees related to the art component were about $8,000, he said.

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http://ottawacitizen.com/news/local-news...t-for-largest-art-buy-in-ottawas-history
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  #1129  
Old Posted Oct 19, 2017, 4:50 PM
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The city didn’t hire an art consultant for Stage 1, but rail director Steve Cripps said a “technical advisor” was retained to support a number of components of the LRT project, including the public art. The technical advisor fees related to the art component were about $8,000, he said.
So for that price, will we get higher quality art, or better value for our money this time?
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  #1130  
Old Posted Oct 20, 2017, 3:04 AM
Uhuniau Uhuniau is offline
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So for that price, will we get higher quality art, or better value for our money this time?
This is the sort of thing I remember when Jim Watson says there's no money to include a station at Jasmine in the Orleans extension.
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  #1131  
Old Posted Oct 20, 2017, 1:07 PM
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Originally Posted by zzptichka View Post
I like that they are reserving 50-car parking lot on a busy tight station for staff. Nice touch.

I would have thought they would have taken this opportunity to move the station a bit further north to bring it closer to Baseline Rd. Maybe on the north side of Navaho instead of the south side.

It would have brought it closer to more housing and shopping, and still wouldn't have been too far from Algonquin College.
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  #1132  
Old Posted Oct 20, 2017, 1:56 PM
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You mean we may actually use that very expensive tunnel at Baseline at some point but am I getting this right, that they are actually moving the station to the south and away from the original planned location next the college building. What a joke. They spend all this money to integrate the building with the station then they change the plan.
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  #1133  
Old Posted Oct 20, 2017, 2:13 PM
Multi-modal Multi-modal is offline
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Originally Posted by lrt's friend View Post
You mean we may actually use that very expensive tunnel at Baseline at some point but am I getting this right, that they are actually moving the station to the south and away from the original planned location next the college building. What a joke. They spend all this money to integrate the building with the station then they change the plan.
Ya sort of, They are moving it a little further south so the south tip of it is underneath College Avenue (between "north entrance" and "south entrance" in the diagram. Then they are building the bus station south of that. I really don't understand the rational for pulling the station so far south (and therefore bringing the #88 so far away from Baseline). Maybe they are trying to space the stations far enough apart that they can get away from building a station at Tallwood in a future expansion? Seems stupid anyway I look at it.
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  #1134  
Old Posted Oct 20, 2017, 2:48 PM
lrt's friend lrt's friend is offline
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Ya sort of, They are moving it a little further south so the south tip of it is underneath College Avenue (between "north entrance" and "south entrance" in the diagram. Then they are building the bus station south of that. I really don't understand the rational for pulling the station so far south (and therefore bringing the #88 so far away from Baseline). Maybe they are trying to space the stations far enough apart that they can get away from building a station at Tallwood in a future expansion? Seems stupid anyway I look at it.
From my experience, all the public buildings nearby (Ben Franklin Place, the City Archives) are very car oriented and are transit unfriendly locations. Our transit plans are not really changing this. Our plans to build stations between destinations instead of next to destinations may save money but in the end, discourage people from using transit.

Those lovely circles that they put on maps showing how far people will walk do not always reflect what real people want.

Last edited by lrt's friend; Oct 20, 2017 at 3:07 PM.
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  #1135  
Old Posted Oct 20, 2017, 4:15 PM
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I am not a good indicator of tolerance for walking to transit as I'm fine with a good distance, but my wife is probably quite indicative of the average person.

Over 1 km you've totally lost her when it comes to walking to a transit station. Ideally it would be 800 m or less.

Paris has the right idea with no address in the city further than 500 m from a métro station. But that's not realistic in the context of a newish North American city.
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  #1136  
Old Posted Oct 20, 2017, 10:35 PM
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My brother lives downtown and works in Overbrook-ish. His commute is a 1km walk from his place in centretown up to the Albert/Slater route, then a transitway bus to St. Laurent, then another 1km walk from St. Laurent to his office. That's 4km of walking to and from transit every single workday. He actually loves it, he says it gets him exercise (knowing him, he'd probably never get any otherwise ). I do sometimes wonder how many people are like him.. you do notice in Ottawa there seems to be lots of people regularly walking up to Transitway stations from quite far away.
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  #1137  
Old Posted Oct 21, 2017, 1:41 AM
Richard Eade Richard Eade is offline
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There seems to be a misconception that there is much rational thinking during the recent 'planning' of the Baseline Station. About the only true planning happened many years ago, when the Baseline Station was moved south of the Baseline / Woodroffe intersection. That intersection was so busy that there was no way for buses to reliably get through it on a schedule during the peak periods. The idea of using Navaho and Constellation to get around the traffic congestion was a good one. The island station made use of two existing intersections along Woodroffe so that buses could, relatively easily, loop through the station. The land surrounding that station was to be developed with towers. Since that time, ‘planning’ has been in name only.

Take, for example the orientation of the tunnel. Since the City had done nothing to develope the land, Algonquin College requested some so that they could have a more prominent presence along Woodroffe and be more integrated to the transit system. The City could have given (OK, I think that the College paid a dollar, so not technically ‘given’) Algonquin a piece of land of any shape, since the College had not yet designed their building. Had the City actually put any thought into the planning, they could have designed their tunnel to be at an angle to minimize the turns that transit vehicles would need to make.



The fuchsia line shows the City’s choice of routing; while the red line shown a straighter path.

Unfortunately, the City arbitrarily chose a line for the tunnel that was parallel to Woodroffe so that the lot would be rectangular (i.e., the City 'planned' no further than the immediate property shape). Alas, this ensures that the future train riders will enjoy ‘S’ turns at each end of the station; with all of the associated extra maintenance that will entail.

It would have been far better for the City to position the future Baseline Station on the sides of the Navaho Bridge over the tunnel. That would mean that the future Baseline Rapid Transit buses could simply stay on Navaho across Woodroffe. Is the City really ‘planning’ to have the Baseline ‘Rapid’ Transit weave through the Algonquin College campus over speed bumps? That is crazy! Who comes up with this stuff.

Also, putting the station at Navaho would put it roughly in the middle of all those parking lots (including at College Square). Additionally, it would be a bit closer to the low-rise residential building that populate the north side of Baseline Road (and which will likely eventually be redeveloped into something taller). Not to mention that it would put a bit of distance between Baseline Station and the future Tallwood Station.

Recently, there have been a number of ‘designs’ for the area and each one strikes me as almost worse than the previous.
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  #1138  
Old Posted Oct 21, 2017, 3:38 AM
Uhuniau Uhuniau is offline
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Originally Posted by lrt's friend View Post
From my experience, all the public buildings nearby (Ben Franklin Place, the City Archives) are very car oriented and are transit unfriendly locations. Our transit plans are not really changing this. Our plans to build stations between destinations instead of next to destinations may save money but in the end, discourage people from using transit.

Those lovely circles that they put on maps showing how far people will walk do not always reflect what real people want.
In a lot of cases, they don't even reflect how humans can possibly locomote.
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  #1139  
Old Posted Oct 21, 2017, 3:41 AM
Uhuniau Uhuniau is offline
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Is the City really ‘planning’ to have the Baseline ‘Rapid’ Transit weave through the Algonquin College campus over speed bumps? That is crazy! Who comes up with this stuff.
It's bad enough that the existing route has to go over speed bumps.

A street can have transit service, or speed bumps, but it should never have both. If it's a pre-existing transit route, whatever the traffic situation that leads to cries of MOAR SPEED BUMPS, the solution should never involve speed bumps. Visually or literally narrow the street, bump-outs, whatever, but not speed bumps.
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  #1140  
Old Posted Oct 21, 2017, 3:44 AM
PHrenetic PHrenetic is offline
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In a lot of cases, they don't even reflect how humans can possibly locomote.
Good Day...

especially given the usual urban barriers of fences, rivers, creeks, roads, highways, arterials, buildings, fences.......etc.
it's the old 'as-the-crow-flies' circles .vs. actual real-life time-and-distance consuming "walking", which if properly mapped, really reduces the diameter of those 'circles' .

NoJoy.
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