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  #161  
Old Posted Oct 3, 2017, 12:36 PM
acottawa acottawa is offline
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Originally Posted by passwordisnt123 View Post
Not at the moment but once completed, the Lebreton Flats development will effectively be an entertainment district for the city with restaurants and one of the main entertainment attractions in the city (Sens).
But not that part of the flats (which is a museum/memorial district). The Sens proposal puts most of the entertainment components along the canal or near the arena itself (almost a km away).
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  #162  
Old Posted Oct 3, 2017, 1:01 PM
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  #163  
Old Posted Oct 3, 2017, 3:19 PM
kevinbottawa kevinbottawa is offline
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But not that part of the flats (which is a museum/memorial district). The Sens proposal puts most of the entertainment components along the canal or near the arena itself (almost a km away).
The monument is pretty close to Zibi.
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  #164  
Old Posted Oct 3, 2017, 3:33 PM
acottawa acottawa is offline
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The monument is pretty close to Zibi.
It's at least 750m from Zibi. How big of an exclusion zone do we have to put around monuments and memorials?
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  #165  
Old Posted Oct 3, 2017, 3:45 PM
kwoldtimer kwoldtimer is online now
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An interesting review in today's Toronto Star:

https://www.thestar.com/news/gta/201...-you-hume.html
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  #166  
Old Posted Oct 3, 2017, 3:47 PM
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It's at least 750m from Zibi. How big of an exclusion zone do we have to put around monuments and memorials?
How many metres is it from the National War Memorial to D'Arcy McGee's?
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  #167  
Old Posted Oct 3, 2017, 4:58 PM
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How many metres is it from the National War Memorial to D'Arcy McGee's?
About 50
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  #168  
Old Posted Oct 3, 2017, 5:15 PM
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Canada’s new National Holocaust Monument is ‘about you’: Hume

The new National Holocaust Monument in Ottawa isn’t a building or a sculpture. “It falls between these things,” says its designer, Daniel Libeskind.

By Christopher Hume, Urban Issues and Architecture
Tues., Oct. 3, 2017


OTTAWA — Even if the name wasn’t there for all to see, there can be no doubt about the meaning of Canada’s National Holocaust Monument. Its enclosed spaces, precariously angled walls and raw concrete surfaces speak the language of pain, fear and isolation. There is nothing heroic here — how could there be? — only the offer of an experience not easily forgotten.

Located across the road from the Canadian War Museum in the LeBreton Flats area of Ottawa, the recently opened monument is a powerful addition to the landscape of the capital. Falling somewhere between art and architecture, this is the first memorial of its kind in the country. Devoid of rhetoric and (mostly) of figurative imagery, it’s an abstract structure that would rather evoke a response than make its point overtly.

The designer, Polish-American architect Daniel Libeskind, has acquitted himself brilliantly. More than any other contemporary practitioner, Libeskind has mastered architecture’s narrative possibilities. Until the monument, the best example of his story-telling skills was the Jewish Museum in Berlin. When opened in 2001, it was completely empty. Still, tens of thousands showed up to see it. Even without artifacts or exhibits, the building told the history of a people with clear and undeniable eloquence.

The monument, which addresses a more specific episode, has fewer means at its disposal. But it’s also free from the limits of conventional architectural structures. Other than the need to memorialize, it serves no purpose. What it offers is pure experience.

“It’s not a building,” Libeskind explains. “It’s not sculpture. It falls between these things. There’s no didactic way to go through it. You have to create spaces for individuals as well as room for 1,000 people. It’s about your experience. It’s about you.”

Just in case there was any doubt, however, a series of black-and-white murals of various Holocaust sites have been painted on a number of walls. These images, based on pictures taken by acclaimed Canadian photographer Edward Burtynsky, add an extra layer of information. But they are unnecessary, intrusive and in some cases distracting. Even more out of place are the metallic panels — in both official languages — that document the Holocaust and its legacy.

This fear of leaving anything unsaid is at odds with a structure that is strong enough to speak for itself, that needs no explanation and that demands we engage with it through our imagination. If words are required, they should be somewhere else. It’s always hard to know when to stop, of course, and the monument reminds us once again why less is more.

At the same time, its hidden spaces, slanted ground planes and dark corners — all unexplained — add an appropriate note of mystery and perhaps of threat to the space. But Libeskind’s monument isn’t without hope: a lone stairwell leads from the ground to an opening in a vertiginously canted wall through which the attentive visitor can glimpse the Peace Tower. On the other side of that opening, a sunbathed balcony looks out over Ottawa and the world beyond. We feel ourselves back in the light, returned to the land of the living. Our response is a quiet sense of exhilaration — and the realization of the power of what we experienced below.

Unlike, say, Peter Eisenman’s Memorial to the Murdered Jews of Europe in Berlin, Libeskind’s piece is frankly abstract but not abstruse. Though from above, its outline resembles an elongated Star of David, even that’s not necessary to an understanding of the monument.

Libeskind, working with Burtynsky, landscape architect Claude Cormier, Holocaust scholar Doris Bergen and Lord Cultural Resources, won the commission through an international design competition launched in 2013. Best known in Toronto for the Crystal, his addition to the Royal Ontario Museum, and the L-Tower condo at Yonge and Esplanade, Libeskind now lives in New York where he moved after winning another competition to remake Ground Zero in Manhattan.

“How lucky we are to be in Canada,” he declares, smiling broadly. “It doesn’t make me feel good to live in America anymore. There’s a darkening of the world. The Germans have broken a historical taboo and elected members of a neo-Nazi party.”

“The opposite of love is not hate,” says Libeskind, paraphrasing Elie Wiesel, “it’s indifference. People forget. It’s not just looking backwards. If you stand here you can hear the voice of the victims of the Holocaust. We should be thinking of who’s not here.”

Christopher Hume’s column appears weekly. He can be reached at [email protected]





https://www.thestar.com/news/gta/201...-you-hume.html
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  #169  
Old Posted Oct 3, 2017, 5:24 PM
kevinbottawa kevinbottawa is offline
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It's interesting that Christopher Hume likes the monument and people on this forum don't. I've rarely read an article from him where he actually likes something.
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  #170  
Old Posted Oct 3, 2017, 5:30 PM
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It's interesting that Christopher Hume likes the monument and people on this forum don't. I've rarely read an article from him where he actually likes something.
I like it. I think it displays the message it should. A "beautiful" monument would just glorify the worst event in modern history. I wish there were more pictures though.
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  #171  
Old Posted Oct 3, 2017, 7:24 PM
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  #172  
Old Posted Oct 3, 2017, 11:53 PM
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Ah, the National... Gas Meter?
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  #173  
Old Posted Oct 5, 2017, 2:56 AM
eltodesukane eltodesukane is offline
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Canada forgets to mention Jewish people at Holocaust memorial.
The plaque commemorated the "millions of men, women and children murdered" but did not specifically mention Jewish people or anti-Semitism.
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-41506700
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  #174  
Old Posted Oct 5, 2017, 1:16 PM
AndyMEng AndyMEng is offline
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Originally Posted by eltodesukane View Post
Canada forgets to mention Jewish people at Holocaust memorial.
The plaque commemorated the "millions of men, women and children murdered" but did not specifically mention Jewish people or anti-Semitism.
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-41506700
This is a ridiculous thing. Not just the plaque, but the entire conversation. The resulting plaque and its text shows the work of a committee to not leave anyone out including the millions killed who were not Jews. However, now we have the dramatic storytelling of the PM who left out the Jews, as if it were his fault somehow that the NCC committee left out Jews specifically. Is the new plaque going to do the usual and mention Jews and gloss over everyone else now? How about the gays and lesbians? Do we get our own monument now?
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  #175  
Old Posted Oct 5, 2017, 1:51 PM
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This is a ridiculous thing. Not just the plaque, but the entire conversation. The resulting plaque and its text shows the work of a committee to not leave anyone out including the millions killed who were not Jews. However, now we have the dramatic storytelling of the PM who left out the Jews, as if it were his fault somehow that the NCC committee left out Jews specifically. Is the new plaque going to do the usual and mention Jews and gloss over everyone else now? How about the gays and lesbians? Do we get our own monument now?
Exactly, the plaque should include every group that was affected by the Holocaust. If they make it a point to specifically mention Jews, then also mention all the others. There is a reason why its referred to as the Holocaust, and not simply Jewish Holocaust.
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  #176  
Old Posted Oct 5, 2017, 2:47 PM
acottawa acottawa is offline
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^^
^
So Jewish groups spend years fundraising, lobbying, organizing to commemorate the seminal event in Jewish history, and a bunch of other people who did SFA to contribute in any way to the monument show up and want to take credit.
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  #177  
Old Posted Oct 5, 2017, 2:57 PM
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Wasn't the problem because the Nazis didn't view the Jews as equal "men, women and children"? We're missing the bigger picture by focusing specifically on anti-semitism when the root evil of the Holocaust is supremacist ideology, something that is very much alive today disguised in different forms. That perspective can make the difference between this monument being a relevant call for vigilance against all types of racism, religious persecution and discrimination, or a pity-fest for something that happened a long time ago to some people somewhere else.
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  #178  
Old Posted Oct 5, 2017, 3:16 PM
acottawa acottawa is offline
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Wasn't the problem because the Nazis didn't view the Jews as equal "men, women and children"? We're missing the bigger picture by focusing specifically on anti-semitism when the root evil of the Holocaust is supremacist ideology, something that is very much alive today disguised in different forms. That perspective can make the difference between this monument being a relevant call for vigilance against all types of racism, religious persecution and discrimination, or a pity-fest for something that happened a long time ago to some people somewhere else.
I guess you could make all monuments completely generic: make the firefighters memorial across the street (or war memorials) a generic monument to workplace deaths, make the violence against women memorial a generic monument about violence, make the peacekeeping monument a generic commemoration of foreign policy, AIDS memorials generic memorials about infectious disease and at some point everything becomes about nothing.
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  #179  
Old Posted Oct 5, 2017, 3:30 PM
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This particular corner of Wellington/SJAM/Booth is going to be a bit of a dead zone though...
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  #180  
Old Posted Oct 5, 2017, 4:05 PM
AndyMEng AndyMEng is offline
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Originally Posted by acottawa View Post
^^
^
So Jewish groups spend years fundraising, lobbying, organizing to commemorate the seminal event in Jewish history, and a bunch of other people who did SFA to contribute in any way to the monument show up and want to take credit.
All because a small plaque with the PM's name on it tried to be inclusive without getting overly long-winded and doesn't say "Jewish" yet all the imagery, knowledge boards, the shape of the site, and cultural references on the site are Jewish.

Lets be clear, I'm not against a holocaust monument talking about Jews. I've been to the monument, I think as a whole it does an excellent job both as a museum and as a monument. I'm against wasting time in the house of commons and media firestorms about minor issues such as this.
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