Great Canadian Skyline Thread II

[Black Star]

Originally Posted by Vixx

Nice shot.

I still can't get over how mediocre the two Fox tower projects turned out. The design is just bad, and was a missed opportunity. At least it helped increase density, got rid of some gravel parking lots and helped move people into downtown.

Yeah.....Oh well....whats done is done.

Like you said. Density, less gravel parking lots and more people downtown.

[saffronleaf]

Originally Posted by rousseau

Okay, I'll bite: what definition of "ground level refinement" could you possibly be using in your universe where Vancouver and Calgary have a superior pedestrian street level experience to Toronto?

Back here on earth:

1. Montreal (obviously)
2. Toronto (obviously)
3. Quebec City (obviously)
4. Vancouver
5. Victoria
6. Ottawa
7. Who cares?
8. Who cares?
9. Who cares?
10. Who cares?

I'd switch QC with Vancouver. If Victoria is there, should Halifax? Haven't really been there so no comment.

[O-tacular]

Growing skyline from Stephen Avenue:



Historic, Old, New, Newest:

[Djesus777]

From the new Bonaventure park (which is really nice btw)

[isaidso]

Originally Posted by saffronleaf

If Victoria is there, should Halifax? Haven't really been there so no comment.

I've not been to Victoria but if he has Quebec City, Ottawa, and Vancouver on there Halifax should be there too.

[Martin Mtl]

https://www.instagram.com/p/BY6il19gjfv/?taken-by=alexchoquette_photography


https://www.instagram.com/p/BY4ZsW8A2U_/?taken-by=dxiv.visuals


https://www.instagram.com/p/BY3eC0EHbGS/?taken-by=dom4good


https://www.instagram.com/p/BY4EiAxhBB_/?taken-by=fred514

[G.S MTL]

^Wow love that 2nd one !

[someone123]

Originally Posted by isaidso

I've not been to Victoria but if he has Quebec City, Ottawa, and Vancouver on there Halifax should be there too.

For what it's worth, and at the risk of upsetting people, I think Halifax is a nicer city to walk around in than both Vancouver and Toronto (I think Victoria and Quebec City are better than Vancouver and Toronto for this as well). Vancouver and Toronto are larger and have more stuff but Halifax has a nice pedestrian scale (small blocks, narrow streets, lots of little parks) and inherited a lot of old buildings that were designed for pedestrians (there is a lot of street-level interest). Pedestrian friendliness is not really something that is specific to big cities. If anything there's probably an inverse correlation. Overcrowding and giant buildings and streets are not pleasant for pedestrians. The only reason why Canadians tend not to see this is that they are used to newer and more suburban small cities.

Just my opinion, but then again I actually walked around all three of these cities during the past week.

[Martin Mtl]

De retour/Back Home/Tlllbacka hemma by Christian Barrette on Flickr

[TorontoDrew]

Looking south to Humber Shores.

[IMG]Threatening Clouds by Robert Rutkay, on Flickr[/IMG]

[FrAnKs]

Originally Posted by Martin Mtl

De retour/Back Home/Tlllbacka hemma by Christian Barrette on Flickr

Fantastic

[Laceoflight]

This thread was missing Québec (city)


Dans les nuages par @stephanvallieres, sur Instagram


Je ne vis que pour les couchers de soleil par @eloisegelinas, sur Instagram


Oh Québec par @laurenceldc, sur Instagram

[shappy]

Originally Posted by someone123

For what it's worth, and at the risk of upsetting people, I think Halifax is a nicer city to walk around in than both Vancouver and Toronto (I think Victoria and Quebec City are better than Vancouver and Toronto for this as well). Vancouver and Toronto are larger and have more stuff but Halifax has a nice pedestrian scale (small blocks, narrow streets, lots of little parks) and inherited a lot of old buildings that were designed for pedestrians (there is a lot of street-level interest). Pedestrian friendliness is not really something that is specific to big cities. If anything there's probably an inverse correlation. Overcrowding and giant buildings and streets are not pleasant for pedestrians. The only reason why Canadians tend not to see this is that they are used to newer and more suburban small cities.

Just my opinion, but then again I actually walked around all three of these cities during the past week.

Sorry but this is quite the eye-rolly post. It just sounds like you know Halifax very well but not Toronto. Street level interest... really? I have to shake my head at that one.

[someone123]

Originally Posted by shappy

Sorry but this is quite the eye-rolly post. It just sounds like you know Halifax very well but not Toronto. Street level interest... really? I have to shake my head at that one.

I didn't say that Toronto was bad, or that there was nothing to see there. I responded to the extreme view that Toronto was so amazing in this area that it wasn't worth even considering other cities. I guess if you start with a view like that, any reasonable observation tied to reality may seem like a mean-spirited attempt to bring the city down a peg or two. But this is a warped way to see the situation.

We can argue about which place is better but my larger point is that I don't think Toronto stands out all that much compared to at least a handful of other cities in Canada when it comes to how pleasant or interesting it is to explore on foot. It's also just not true that larger cities necessarily have a better pedestrian experience in general. A lot of people on SSP Canada tend to assume that bigger cities are better in every way, and that Toronto must be the best Canadian city in every way because it is the biggest. But that is not really how the world works.

[isaidso]

Originally Posted by shappy

Sorry but this is quite the eye-rolly post. It just sounds like you know Halifax very well but not Toronto. Street level interest... really? I have to shake my head at that one.

I've spent 16+ years in each and would have to agree with 'someone123'. Halifax may be tiny compared to Toronto but it's downtown compares very well from a pedestrian pov. Halifax has lots of 2 lane roads vs 4 lane roads in Toronto, lots of small scaled retail just like Toronto, and the quality of the public realm is about the same. Downtown Halifax is very pleasant to explore on foot. It's biggest drawback is that it's not a very big area.

Toronto is obviously more crowded, has more 'energy', and more 'stuff', but it's a mistake to assume that Halifax is many tiers worse from a pedestrian pov because it's not.

[DrJoe]

Originally Posted by someone123

I didn't say that Toronto was bad, or that there was nothing to see there. I responded to the extreme view that Toronto was so amazing in this area that it wasn't worth even considering other cities. I guess if you start with a view like that, any reasonable observation tied to reality may seem like a mean-spirited attempt to bring the city down a peg or two. But this is a warped way to see the situation.

We can argue about which place is better but my larger point is that I don't think Toronto stands out all that much compared to at least a handful of other cities in Canada when it comes to how pleasant or interesting it is to explore on foot. It's also just not true that larger cities necessarily have a better pedestrian experience in general. A lot of people on SSP Canada tend to assume that bigger cities are better in every way, and that Toronto must be the best Canadian city in every way because it is the biggest. But that is not really how the world works.

Whether you're right or wrong or not you're notorious for slagging on Toronto so anytime you post about the place it's taken with a grain of salt. You're last couples sentences exposed your obvious chip...

[Drybrain]

Halifax and Toronto have urban public realms of similar quality. Toronto, of course, just has a lot more...you can walk for hours through fairly thick urbanity, which you can't do in Halifax. On the other hand, Halifax's historical building stock represents a longer history and diversity of styles, if that means anything. On the other other hand Toronto, for now anyway, enjoys better contemporary architecture, and increasingly some of the slick public-realm touches that come with being an increasingly global city.

But overall, yes, they're not as far apart as it people might think.

And both have wonderful natural features in their urban core. Halifax has the harbour, Point Pleasant park, the sailing and boating opportunities along the Northwest Arm, etc.

Toronto's natural features are less celebrated but I think very unique and special. I love the semi-wild, rocky little lakefront parks in the west end, like Humber Shores. And the city, including fairly central areas, is bisected by rivers and ravines and wooded areas.

[shappy]

Originally Posted by someone123

I didn't say that Toronto was bad, or that there was nothing to see there. I responded to the extreme view that Toronto was so amazing in this area that it wasn't worth even considering other cities. I guess if you start with a view like that, any reasonable observation tied to reality may seem like a mean-spirited attempt to bring the city down a peg or two. But this is a warped way to see the situation.

We can argue about which place is better but my larger point is that I don't think Toronto stands out all that much compared to at least a handful of other cities in Canada when it comes to how pleasant or interesting it is to explore on foot. It's also just not true that larger cities necessarily have a better pedestrian experience in general. A lot of people on SSP Canada tend to assume that bigger cities are better in every way, and that Toronto must be the best Canadian city in every way because it is the biggest. But that is not really how the world works.

Correcting bombastic notions is fine and all but you're swinging the pendulum a touch too far the other way here.

Originally Posted by isaidso

I've spent 16+ years in each and would have to agree with 'someone123'. Halifax may be tiny compared to Toronto but it's downtown compares very well from a pedestrian pov. Halifax has lots of 2 lane roads vs 4 lane roads in Toronto, lots of small scaled retail just like Toronto, and the quality of the public realm is about the same. Downtown Halifax is very pleasant to explore on foot. It's biggest drawback is that it's not a very big area.

Toronto is obviously more crowded, has more 'energy', and more 'stuff', but it's a mistake to assume that Halifax is many tiers worse from a pedestrian pov because it's not.

Well the assertion here is that Halifax is better at street level for the pedestrian. That's what I've responded to not that Halifax should be disregarded due to its size...

[csbvan]

On a somewhat related note to the current discussion, Walk Score released its data for most walkable cities in Canada, the US and Australia, according to their metrics.

Canada:
1. Vancouver
2. Toronto
3. Montreal

US
1. New York
2. San Fran
3. Boston

Aus
1. Sydney
2. Melbourne
3. Adelaide

Vancouver named most walkable city in Canada

With a score of 89 -- which denotes a "very walkable" city, where most errands can be accomplished on foot -- New York takes the title of America's most pedestrian-friendly city, thanks to neighbourhoods like Union Square, the Bowery and NoLita.
The Big Apple falls one point shy of the top tier in the ranking: Cities that score 90-100 are deemed a "walker's paradise," where residents can accomplish daily errands without the use of a car.
The city is also the top performer of all three countries.

...

In Canada, Vancouver outranks Toronto to take the top spot as the country's most walkable city, with a score of 78 thanks to top neighbourhoods like the downtown core, West End and Strathcona.
Toronto edged out Montreal with just one point (71 versus 70 respectively).

...

While Sydney, Melbourne and Adelaide were named the country's most walkable cities, their scores are significantly lower than their American and Canadian counterparts, falling in the "somewhat walkable" category, with marks ranging between 54 to 63.

http://www.ctvnews.ca/lifestyle/vancouver-named-most-walkable-city-in-canada-1.3584352

[Metro-One]

I am sorry I started this, in someone123's defence I don't see what he said that was so inflammatory. We all have a hometown bias to a degree, and more importantly I can totally see his point regarding Halifax, Victoria, and Quebec City having more pleasant pedestrian experiences than Vancouver and Toronto. They were all big enough pre-war to develop decent pedestrian realms, the all retained said very well through the "urban renewal" decades, they are all provincial capitals (a lot of extra care is given in grand architecture and landscaping it seems), they all have nice natural topography, and they are all big enough to get many of the benefits of a larger centre while still being small enough to avoid many of the negatives.