DENVER | Transportation Thread

[mojiferous]

Originally Posted by TakeFive

Meanwhile, RTD needing to cut some fat is looking at cutting Golden's end of line frequency.

http://www.denverpost.com/2017/08/27/rtd-denver-golden-light-rail-cuts-public-transit/

Consider the (bad) timing...

Personally, I think it's horrible timing on RTD's part, but not because of the Golden circulator, which probably won't add much ridership, since Golden isn't exactly bustling. But you know what will add ridership? All the TOD that will be finished in the next couple of years:

• 5+story apartments u/c at Federal & Colfax, Knox, Perry
• Everything at Sloan's Lake, which is less than a mile from the Perry station
• New townhouses and apartments at Sheridan
• Oak street apartments

And the near-future redevelopments too:

• Sun Valley Redevelopment
• Federal Center TOD

We live near the Perry Station - There are at least 13 townhome projects u/c between 12th and 14th on Osceola, Perry, and Quitman.

Before this last year there hadn't been much construction going on for the length of the W since it opened in 2013... And I guess none of this construction guarantees more ridership and it probably won't have enough of a numerical impact to really matter, but more solid TOD is finally happening along the line and now RTD wants to reduce the service. That just makes it seem like no one at RTD is paying attention to changes in the neighborhoods along their transit routes.

[wong21fr]

Originally Posted by mojiferous

Before this last year there hadn't been much construction going on for the length of the W since it opened in 2013... And I guess none of this construction guarantees more ridership and it probably won't have enough of a numerical impact to really matter, but more solid TOD is finally happening along the line and now RTD wants to reduce the service. That just makes it seem like no one at RTD is paying attention to changes in the neighborhoods along their transit routes.

Sure they are. The service reduction for the W Line is only from the Jefferson County Government Center to the Federal Center. The rest of the line would maintain 15-minute headways as there is decent ridership along the other sections.

This is the better option versus what's happening to the R Line. RTD figured out that suburban ridership is pathetic on this line and will discontinue all off-peak service south of the Florida Station. TakeFive will like the nerfing of the R Line to reflect Aurora's true nature: a city with nothing worth visiting.

[mojiferous]

Originally Posted by wong21fr

Sure they are. The service reduction for the W Line is only from the Jefferson County Government Center to the Federal Center. The rest of the line would maintain 15-minute headways as there is decent ridership along the other sections.

This is the better option versus what's happening to the R Line. RTD figured out that suburban ridership is pathetic on this line and will discontinue all off-peak service south for the Florida Station.

Ah, yep. It helps to read the article before complaining about it... That's not so bad then, because Golden's anti-growth stance means that the ridership likely will never really increase west of the Fed Center.

Ignore all my ranting!

[seventwenty]

Bus lane potato photos:





Photos taken at 8th and Broadway, looking south. There is no solid use of red paint, and outside of the downtown corridor, 17th and Broadway to Colfax, and around 8th Ave and Broadway, there isn't red paint. Outside of those higher traffic areas, there is only "BUS ONLY" markings and signage, though the bus lane lights are permanently on. Drivers appeared to be confused by the bus lane, but it's only day 1. Also, I don't know if painting is completed.

[TakeFive]

Originally Posted by mojiferous

But you know what will add ridership? All the TOD that will be finished in the next couple of years:

• 5+story apartments u/c at Federal & Colfax, Knox, Perry
• Everything at Sloan's Lake, which is less than a mile from the Perry station
• New townhouses and apartments at Sheridan
• Oak street apartments

Before this last year there hadn't been much construction going on for the length of the W since it opened in 2013...

I've noticed the pickup in projects along the W Line. Nice to see.

Unfortunately there's a problem with the 59 acres of prime Federal Center TOD land that was to be auctioned off. Colorado's homeless folk are suing to assert their right to live off the land out there.

[Cirrus]

Originally Posted by seventwenty

Bus lane potato photos:

Good, good.

Originally Posted by wong21fr

discontinue all off-peak service south of the Florida Station.

Is that actually happening?

[TakeFive]

^^ Ah, I missed that part.

Originally Posted by wong21fr

This is the better option versus what's happening to the R Line. RTD figured out that suburban ridership is pathetic on this line and will discontinue all off-peak service south of the Florida Station. TakeFive will like the nerfing of the R Line to reflect Aurora's true nature: a city with nothing worth visiting.

I've always divided Aurora into CCSD and Aurora Public Schools but never suggested it was a destination. For talking purposes CCSD lies mostly south of Iliff Ave.

Given that the H line now ends at Florida, Iliff was redundant but had potential to relieve traffic at Nine Mile. As I recently pointed out: not counting DUS or DIA only four stations system-wide have better ridership than Nine Mile Station.

All you're pointing out is that nobody wants to ride from Lone Tree or other stops along the SE corridor through Aurora (City Center) to the Peoria Station to jump on the A line to the airport. bunt long ago pointed out the folly of that and I figured it was likely a pipe dream. Totally agree it's a waste of assets and energy.

Meanwhile the Rockies are one run down going into the bottom of the 5th - lots of time still.

[TakeFive]

How low can you go?

United's Fare Cuts Spread, Fueling Risk of New Airline Price War

[wong21fr]

Originally Posted by TakeFive;7906083All you're pointing out is that nobody wants to ride from Lone Tree or other stops along the SE corridor through Aurora (City Center) to the Peoria Station to jump on the A line to the airport. [B

bunt[/B] long ago pointed out the folly of that and I figured it was likely a pipe dream. Totally agree it's a waste of assets and energy.

And no one in Aurora wants to use the R-Line to commute to jobs in the Tech Center. They'd rather sit with their thumbs up their asses on I-225.

[The Dirt]

I don't blame them. I-225 is the smoothest it's ever been since there's no more choke points. The stations are also not conducive to a Park-n-Ride model, since they don't provide a ton of parking and are right next to the highway. You're not really saving much time by parking, waiting for a train, then having to figure out the last mile connection in the DTC. The TOD model doesn't currently exist either. There's certainly some potential around some of the station, but the R line looks like it was built with the assumption that the TODs are already there. Once RTD decreases the headways to 60 minutes, no TODs will be built anyway.

[mishko27]

Originally Posted by The Dirt

I don't blame them. I-225 is the smoothest it's ever been since there's no more choke points. The stations are also not conducive to a Park-n-Ride model, since they don't provide a ton of parking and are right next to the highway. You're not really saving much time by parking, waiting for a train, then having to figure out the last mile connection in the DTC. The TOD model doesn't currently exist either. There's certainly some potential around some of the station, but the R line looks like it was built with the assumption that the TODs are already there. Once RTD decreases the headways to 60 minutes, no TODs will be built anyway.

Not only this, but the cost makes no sense. I am 8 miles away from my office (live in Aurora, work in DTC). My car gets over 30 mpg, while the local daily pass is $5.20... Financially, taking the R line does not make sense for me at all.

[Denver Dweller]

http://www.cobizmag.com/Trends/Rundles-Wrap-Up-No-parking-For-shame/

[mhays]

Sounds like a conspiracy theory mixed with a profound misunderstanding of the less-parking concept and how developers think.

The concept is about reducing parking to what tenants will need, vs. building extra spaces. Sometimes it's about hitting lower price points by specifically going for residents without cars.

Developers obsess about getting the mix right. If they aim too low, rents will be low. Aim too high and project costs rise.

[TakeFive]

Originally Posted by wong21fr

And no one in Aurora wants to use the R-Line to commute to jobs in the Tech Center. They'd rather sit with their thumbs up their asses on I-225.

Not a doctor so I can't speak to peoples butt problems.

Refining things a bit it's fair to say that lots of people who live in east CCSD - south Aurora commute to the DTC corridor. Depending on specifically where they live and their destination they'd more likely utilize either E-470 or Arapahoe Rd.

For those who live north and west of I-225 they'd more likely use Hampden Ave and if their destination is east of I-25 they can drop down via either Yosemite or Tamarac Dr/DTC Blvd. If their destination is west of I-25 they will need to ultimately use southbound I-25 unless their destination is not far from Belleview in which case they could take either Tamarac or Monaco Pkwy to Quincy and cross I-25 that way.

I agree with the points that The Dirt makes (and mishko27 too) but if one really wants or needs to use light rail going south during non-peak hours they can switch lines at Southmoor via the H Line.

[The Dirt]

Right now, the only thing of value that the northbound R line provides is a feeder into the airport-bound A line. RTD should capitalize on this by reducing travel times. They should run an express service at most times that skips the Fitz stop (north of UCD) and several other stops in the middle of nowhere. 55+ minutes to travel from DTC to the Peoria station is a deal-breaker for many.

[Darius C]

Originally Posted by The Dirt

Right now, the only thing of value that the northbound R line provides is a feeder into the airport-bound A line. RTD should capitalize on this by reducing travel times. They should run an express service at most times that skips the Fitz stop (north of UCD) and several other stops in the middle of nowhere. 55+ minutes to travel from DTC to the Peoria station is a deal-breaker for many.

I completely agree. It is telling that airport workers are not using the R line and stick to the AT bus line instead. The AT starts fairly empty at Arapahoe Station but fills to standing room only at Nine Mile, pretty much at any time of the day. Unless the R line can cut 10-15 minutes from its current travel time, it will continue running empty.

[CastleScott]

Here's something of interest:
http://www.denverpost.com/2017/09/04/colorado-officials-brainstorm-front-range-rail-service

[COtoOC]

Originally Posted by The Dirt

Right now, the only thing of value that the northbound R line provides is a feeder into the airport-bound A line. RTD should capitalize on this by reducing travel times. They should run an express service at most times that skips the Fitz stop (north of UCD) and several other stops in the middle of nowhere. 55+ minutes to travel from DTC to the Peoria station is a deal-breaker for many.

I live in Stapleton and work off Lincoln in Lone Tree, so I've tried the R line a few times and agree. The R line north of the Aurora Mall is what really ruins the entire trip. It's just too slow through there, and poorly planned IMO.

When I drop my kids at school in Lowry, I then go down Quebec to Hampden to I25 South. That whole trip takes about an hour. If I just go get on the R line at Peoria and go to work, it takes about an hour and 10 min. door to door. Plus it cost me twice as much to pay for the train that drive my hybrid. So the only benefit is that I don't have the stress of driving.

[Cirrus]

Airport workers should be getting heavily discounted eco-passes for the A-line. It's too expensive for workers to use, but there's logic to the high fare for non-workers. So fine, solve the problem using a special worker pass.

[wong21fr]

Originally Posted by Cirrus

Airport workers should be getting heavily discounted eco-passes for the A-line. It's too expensive for workers to use, but there's logic to the high fare for non-workers. So fine, solve the problem using a special worker pass.

Many do receive a heavily discounted eco-pass (looks as if it's $43/mo for City of Denver employees). But that doesn't change that the R Line is pretty much worthless as a transit line except for transferring to the A Line but only if you are boarding a station north of 6th Ave. For everyone else along the I-225/I-25 corridor it makes more sense to take the AT bus.