ATLANTA | Development Thread VI

[atlwarrior]

Originally Posted by RocketSurgeon

I like that Portman design--much better than Coda started out--but as I've said before I'm probably the only one here who likes brutalism, which it's obviously influenced by

We're not getting taller towers in Midtown because Midtown has density restrictions. Those kinds of projects won't happen until Downtown makes a comeback.

Well please explain why 98& 14th was originally in the 70 story range.

[Verge]

Originally Posted by jpk1292000

Better than a parking lot, I guess and it will have decent height. But overall very disappointing design. The design for the High Performance Computing building under construction now is better than this.

This looks almost like a cartoon of a big building.

Looks like something that would have been built in Downtown LA-- Circa 1995...

[Verge]

Originally Posted by atlwarrior

Well please explain why 98& 14th was originally in the 70 story range.

An FAR of 10 is quite high and allows for substantial (tall) buildings--
40-50 story towers have all been announced close to Peachtree and 14th Street.

[montydawg]

Originally Posted by Pemgin

I don't think that's true. I believe most of us understand it's necessary for the entire metro to thrive.

Ha, I think some people on here envision that Atlanta should be a dense grouping of super tall skyscrapers with a few low rise buildings sprinkled in (for the low income people that clean, handle the trash, etc.) encircled by underground HRT, with everyone riding bikes and walking- plus no cars and no parking- and of course no suburbs- it would just transition from high rise to forest. Sounds great, but reminds me of something I would see in a science fiction film and disconnected with reality.

[Hokiehaven]

Originally Posted by scania

I'm not sure that's true either as far as Nashville. Nashville really is on fire.

I agree, Midtown is doing great, but Nashville is very focused, but the massive development in Nashville is more than what has been happening in Midtown so far. From what I've seen I like how Nashville is expanding at least, what I've seen to date.

Midtown could be pushing it if a few more of these projects start getting off the ground.

[ATL_J]

Originally Posted by scania

I'm not sure that's true either as far as Nashville. Nashville really is on fire.

Good thing there is a data on this and we don't have to go with gut instincts.

Building permits:

2016: Atlanta, 36,357; Nashville, 20,182
2015: Atlanta, 30,342; Nashville, 18,291

If we want to focus on multifamily specifically:

2016: Atlanta, 13,107; Nashville, 7,199
2015: Atlanta, 10,150; Nashville, 6,746

Source: US Census

[bigstick]

Atlanta and Nashville are on entirely different levels. Atlanta is ultra massive compared to Nashville.

[RocketSurgeon]

Originally Posted by atlwarrior

Well please explain why 98& 14th was originally in the 70 story range.

It''s a mixed-use residential tower near a transit station, so I'm sure they hit the maximum possible FAR. They have an unusually large lot to work with, the tower is narrow, and the parking podium makes even more floors possible.

[MdtwnATL]

Originally Posted by joecool

Agree! Avery is basic and cheap looking. Portman design is not that bad.

Avery looks like a very cheap suburban apartment building. I was hoping they'd be a bit more creative with the Underground designs, at least making them a bit more urban and a lot less...stucco.

[tdawg]

Ha, I didn't mean to start a flame war, I was just super impressed by the changes I saw around downtown Nashville when I was there two months ago. I think it's compounded by the fact that it was rather dormant for so long and now, all of a sudden, there's this massive wave of really high-quality infill and high-rise development. What really impressed me was the vitality of downtown. I'd just come from Austin, TX, a city I really love, but with a rather dead downtown, even on weekdays. Downtown Nashville was jumping, the bars and honkytonks were already open with music and people coming in and out, and this was on a Thursday at 11am. And I have many friends in New York who talk about moving to Nashville, which would have floored me just 10 years ago. It's definitely a new "It" city, much like Portland and Austin have been for so long.

[daharris80]

I'm going to plead (in vain) for self-control on the city comparison posts. Its really beyond the scope of this forum.

Its also extremely difficult to do. You can look at it in terms of 1) change from set points, 2) quantity in terms of permits, units, square feet, or 3) quality through use of subjective factors. Its all about as pointless as counting cranes in each city. Ultimately the exercise is endless and has a lot more to do with city "pride" than anything else.

The comment that started this discussion was complementary to both cities. Why not just leave it there? Both cities seem to be doing great. Let's continue to discuss the particulars of Atlanta's development. If someone said something above about one city or the other you'd like to dispute - please just send a DM.

[Atlanta3000]

Originally Posted by tdawg

Ha, I didn't mean to start a flame war, I was just super impressed by the changes I saw around downtown Nashville when I was there two months ago. I think it's compounded by the fact that it was rather dormant for so long and now, all of a sudden, there's this massive wave of really high-quality infill and high-rise development. What really impressed me was the vitality of downtown. I'd just come from Austin, TX, a city I really love, but with a rather dead downtown, even on weekdays. Downtown Nashville was jumping, the bars and honkytonks were already open with music and people coming in and out, and this was on a Thursday at 11am. And I have many friends in New York who talk about moving to Nashville, which would have floored me just 10 years ago. It's definitely a new "It" city, much like Portland and Austin have been for so long.

Nashville took off as soon as they announced/completed construction on their new Convention Center. Personally I think it is one of the best projects from an architectural perspective in some time. It was also designed by Atlanta based TVS Design.

[scania]

Originally Posted by ATL_J

Good thing there is a data on this and we don't have to go with gut instincts.

Building permits:

2016: Atlanta, 36,357; Nashville, 20,182
2015: Atlanta, 30,342; Nashville, 18,291

If we want to focus on multifamily specifically:

2016: Atlanta, 13,107; Nashville, 7,199
2015: Atlanta, 10,150; Nashville, 6,746

Source: US Census

Please tell me you aren't serious!!! We are referring to skyscrapers.

[tdawg]

Ditto what daharris80 said. Sorry if I got people sidetracked. Back to Atlanta and its amazing boom.

[Verge]

Originally Posted by scania

Please tell me you aren't serious!!! We are referring to skyscrapers.

I am very familiar with both cities-- Atlanta certainly has more high-rises under construction in town-- Nashville's tend to be in one neighborhood-- the effect is pretty spectacular because of that-- A whole neighborhood where there were on parking lots and warehouses a few years before.

Atlanta (as has been pointed out) is in another league city-wise, with about 3x the population of Nashville (metro areas).

[Martinman]

Originally Posted by montydawg

Ha, I think some people on here envision that Atlanta should be a dense grouping of super tall skyscrapers with a few low rise buildings sprinkled in (for the low income people that clean, handle the trash, etc.) encircled by underground HRT, with everyone riding bikes and walking- plus no cars and no parking- and of course no suburbs- it would just transition from high rise to forest. Sounds great, but reminds me of something I would see in a science fiction film and disconnected with reality.

There is a vast array of possible realities for this city between what you have described what we currently have here. Atlanta is the least dense large city (+5 million pop.) in EVER. So when people on here here favor density and walkability, they are really only wanting Atlanta to move ever so slightly closer to the norm. That people want the very core of the city to be dense, walkable and designed for people more than cars should not seem so peculiar.

[Ant131531]

People have to remember that both Downtown and Midtown share a lot of their potential development with Buckhead(And even Perimeter Center...just look at the propose High Street development). Buckhead's skyline is the size of mid-size metro's downtown skylines in the country at this point.

Atlanta would be monstrous if everything was centralized, but that's not the city it is. Unfortunately, it boomed a lot during a time where the suburbs were worshipped. Cities like Charlotte and Nashville should be thankful that they're developing and booming during a time where the city and it's core are becoming more appreciated so it's unlikely they develop these large secondary highrise clusters like Atlanta, Houston, and Dallas. So then you have these massive booms that Nashville is going under because EVERYTHING is basically being built downtown outside of your typical midrise apartment. Atlanta has to share everything between Downtown, Midtown, Buckhead, and edge cities like Perimeter.

It's a problem that has sort of already perpetuated itself and can't really be stopped.

[Street Advocate]

And Cumberland, Doraville, Alpharetta... I'm always surprised at all the offices and apartments going up in Cumberland.

[Nanosolar]

Originally Posted by Street Advocate

And Cumberland, Doraville, Alpharetta... I'm always surprised at all the offices and apartments going up in Cumberland.

Well at least in 100 years all these areas will be one humongous blob of development!

[Street Advocate]

Originally Posted by Nanosolar

Well at least in 100 years all these areas will be one humongous blob of development!

I truly believe single family home neighborhood's will continue to exist in the core of Atlanta within a hundred years. We'll just build multiple rings of corridors.