YVR Airport & Sea Island Developments Discussion

[SpongeG]

an article on what has already been discussed

Competition heats up on Vancouver-Hong Kong route
Airlines seek edge with ultra-modern planes, seat configurations, self-serve bars
By Glen Korstrom | June 30, 2017, 11 a.m.


Hong Kong Airlines landed its first flight to North America at Vancouver International Airport after 10 a.m. on June 30 | Vancouver Airport Authority

With more competition on the Vancouver-to-Hong Kong route than ever before, airlines are selecting ultra-modern aircraft and using innovative configurations to lure travellers.

Hong Kong Airlines launched daily non-stop flights between Vancouver and the Chinese special administrative region on June 30. This follows Cathay Pacific upping its number of flights on that route to 17 per week from 14 as of March 28.

Air Canada, the third competitor on this route, has daily flights.

The competition has boosted the number of flights per week on the route by 48% – to 31, compared with the 21 flights offered last summer.

Indeed, flights between Vancouver and the greater Chinese region, including Taipei and mainland China have been rapidly increasing as BIV reported earlier this year.

By July 25, there are scheduled to be 10 airlines operating a total of 104 weekly non-stop flights between Vancouver and those destinations.

Stiffer competition has forced airlines to differentiate their offerings and that is happening on the Vancouver–Hong Kong route.

Cathay Pacific’s strategy has been to use Airbus A350s on the airline’s three new weekly flights. Those planes, making their Vancouver debut, are Airbus’ equivalent of Boeing’s Dreamliner 787s, with both being the most advanced commercial aircraft available.

Not only do both models of aircraft fly faster and higher and offer better fuel efficiency, they also can provide a cabin humidity that makes passengers feel as though the plane were flying much lower – something that reduces jet lag.

“[Airbus A350 planes] are made from a composite material, rather than aluminum, which means that it is lighter,” Cathay Pacific’s senior vice-president for the Americas, Philippe Lacamp, told Business in Vancouver.

“The planes also have reduced emissions.”

While Hong Kong Airlines has some Airbus A350s on order, it plans to use a different class of Airbus plane – A330-200s – on the Vancouver route. The planes are relatively new but not as technologically advanced as the A350 series.

...


(Image: The business class cabin on planes that Hong Kong Airlines flies between Hong Kong and Vancouver have self-serve bars that include beer, wine and spirits | Hong Kong Airlines)

...

https://www.biv.com/article/2017/6/competition-heats-vancouver-hong-kong-route/

[Johnny Aussie]

Originally Posted by LeftCoaster

I count a few more than two homes! I thought you were a Calgarian?

That's HUGE! I was worried the fight wasn't doing so well, very happy to see otherwise!

I meant Australia and Canada (in general) YVR is my main destination now as all my family have relocated there. YUL is a side trip.

Just curious why you thought the DEL flight wasn't doing well?

[trofirhen]

I wonder if Vancouver will ever become a five-continent airport?

[LeftCoaster]

Originally Posted by Johnny Aussie

Just curious why you thought the DEL flight wasn't doing well?

Just a few expansion announcements for YYZ-India and no word for YVR. Wasn't so much that I thought it was doing poorly, just was worried it may be.



In other news Edeweiss is upping their Zurich-Vancouver flights next summer to 4xPW.

http://www.routesonline.com/news/38/airl...new-trans-atlantic-route-launch-in-2018/

Would still love to see Swiss fly this one, but given the type of traffic I imagine it sees, that is probably a bit of a dream.

[Vagabond]

I actually REALLY like these new timings. The old schedule pretty much ruled out any connecting traffic - at least - without a nasty overnight layover at DEL (both ways).

Problem is, I've noticed AC is now really trying to push traffic onto its YYZ-BOM flight, which is not particularly convenient to/from YVR. You actually spend more time in the air flying through Toronto than even connecting via London or HK. But I guess AC's most concerned about having passengers spend maximum time on their own metal, which makes sense, but is less convenient for passengers who could otherwise connect to an Indian airline like Jet Airways in Delhi.

Originally Posted by Canadian74

Weird timings, is the YYZ flight getting new times too?

[Hot Rod]

Originally Posted by SpongeG

snapped these june 24th



I heard a few people commenting on this new zealand one, one was like oh wow you can fly to New Zealand from here.

love the ANZ pic

[Marshal]

Originally Posted by SpongeG

I have to thank all of you air geeks. Until finding this forum, I never gave much thought to a lot of what you guys talk about. There are many interesting things. For the last year and some I have been in Vienna, and now Zurich, for about 40% of my time. Always Lufthansa, most frequently to Frankfurt first. I would never have thought about what actual aircraft I traveled on. I just made no assumptions. But, now I know better, and I like the feeling that this plane in the photo has (more-or-less) been my bus for most of those trips. Its a beautiful old friend by now, and makes me marvel all the more over its unheralded performance: like, how many million/billion times its fan blades have turned to perfection in keeping me alive. Lots of technology impresses me (hell, I marvel at my mountain bike), but modern aircraft are above and beyond. So thanks again.

[dharper]

When I am flying, I am always in awe of how the wings shape changes from takeoff-flight-landing. Obviously, someone smarter than me figured that out.

[Johnny Aussie]

Looks like Air Transat is going to pull LGW between 9 January and 21 March.

Again, goes to show just how seasonal YVR is to Europe in winter.

Call me a skeptic but I was surprised Icelandair has decided to go year-round.
Frequency wise FI replaces TS but with smaller aircraft.

KL/AF maintaining 7 per week - KL 4, AF 3.

LH generally daily dropping to its normal 5-6 per week during the slowest months.

Weekly frequencies between YVR - Europe will range between 28-31 flights per week depending on the week.

Generally, between early January and the end of Feb is the slowest period.

[teriyaki]

Canada and Thailand sign new open skies agreement!??

Is this the game-changer we were all speculating on for the longest time? It seems to fit the bill.

https://canadianaviationnews.wordpress.c...ovide-more-travel-options-for-canadians/

[trofirhen]

Originally Posted by teriyaki

Canada and Thailand sign new open skies agreement!??

Is this the game-changer we were all speculating on for the longest time? It seems to fit the bill.

https://canadianaviationnews.wordpress.c...ovide-more-travel-options-for-canadians/

This new agreement is very nice, and it extends YVR's reach that much further into Southeast Asia.
But it seems more like an enhancement of what we already have - a considerable one, to be sure, but an enhancement, and not really a "game changer."
Johnny said the new route to be announced as to be a "game-changer" and a "groundbreaker." This new route into Thailand is great to get, but does it qualify as a "groundbreaker"/"gamechanger?" Also, this agreement was signed just recently, it seems, whereas that "game changer/groundbreaker" was established months and months back:
the route and the airline. I'm just guessing deductively of course. You may well be right.

[Johnny Aussie]

Originally Posted by teriyaki

Canada and Thailand sign new open skies agreement!??

Is this the game-changer we were all speculating on for the longest time? It seems to fit the bill.

It sure might be huh? There's been no secret that Thai has mentioned direct flights to YVR and we all know AC has YVR-BKK connected on its 2018 route network possibilities route map. Imagine direct nonstop flights deep into South East Asia... both SIN and BKK also being strong Star Alliance bases.

It's aircraft like the Dreamliner and A350 that are opening up these once uneconomical routes. YVR-MEL is the most recently announced route benefitting from these frames.

Part of route planning is getting the rights to be able to operate such routes. Look how quickly AC increased YVR-BNE to daily as soon as the Canada-Australia cap was raised.

YVR-BKK, YVR-SIN and YVR-SGN are all real possibilities now.

[Canadian74]

It would be nice to see Thai at YVR but I think they could have already operated the route before this new agreement if they wanted to


Canada keeps expanding air agreements that have no air service to Canada in the first place, like Singapore, Thailand etc but ignore real markets that could use extra frequencies like UAE, etc

[nname]

Originally Posted by Canadian74

It would be nice to see Thai at YVR but I think they could have already operated the route before this new agreement if they wanted to

Nope. The old agreement does not allow a YVR route. It only allows:
1. BKK - (European city) - YYZ/YUL - (US)
2. BKK - (Asia/US city) - YYZ/YUL

Each route can have up to 3x weekly using 744 or 4x weekly using DC10.

[nname]

The seasonal 3rd daily YVR-SJC will start earlier on Jan 1st next year... so It's going year-round?

[Canadian74]

Originally Posted by nname

Nope. The old agreement does not allow a YVR route. It only allows:
1. BKK - (European city) - YYZ/YUL - (US)
2. BKK - (Asia/US city) - YYZ/YUL

Each route can have up to 3x weekly using 744 or 4x weekly using DC10.

But CP used to operate daily 744 to BKK from YVR before the merger with AC

[nname]

Originally Posted by Canadian74

But CP used to operate daily 744 to BKK from YVR before the merger with AC

YVR is only allowed from the Canadian side; Thailand only allowed to use YYZ/YUL.

[Klazu]

Just returned from my holiday in Iceland and Greenland. Since Icelandair's direct flight to KEF was so expensive, I ended up flying through MSP on Delta. Never been to MSP before, but it was quite practical and surprisingly big airport. I also had time to visit both Minneapolis and Mall of America on my 10-hour layover on the way back, which were interesting visits. Minneapolis wasn't that exciting, but Minnesota itself looked very inviting from the air.

Although Delta provides a good service overall, I really hate their new seating system and pricing. I already noticed this on my YVR-SEA-AMS flight over the Christmas and I am not sure if any other airline does it, but Delta charges a hefty $60 to reserve a window or an aisle seat on the front half of the Economy class. That 🞵🞵🞵🞵🞵 donkey balls, as it makes it very difficult to be sitting next to someone you are traveling with without paying an extra charge.

What makes it even more stupid is that Delta's seating algorithm seems to be now by default assigning two people traveling together to completely different rows, forcing almost everyone to request re-seating at the airport. I also saw many people trying to switch seats with other passangers inside the plane to sit next to their companions. This makes boarding a very slow process.

This is very stupid by Delta and I have to say I am disencouraged to fly with them for this very reason, should there be an equal flight available.

Does any other airline do the same yet? I really hope Delta understands this being a mistake, as it is very cumbersome for families with kids and also slows down the boarding process, leading to late departures which cost the airline. It is also anything but good customer service.

[Klazu]

Reading Delta's in-flight magazine, I was surprised to learn about their big campaign agains the Gulf carriers. It seems that Delta, American and United have all joined to fight the ME3 airlines for their unfair competion through huge government subsidies.

Delta has also published a neat video explaining the predatory practices ME3's have applied all around the world and how it has decimated the European and Australian airlines. They certainly have a good point about it all, as ME3's are almost entirely government-backed and enjoy huge subsidies and cheap fuel. It was interesting to learn that most Emirates, Qatar and Etihad routes operate on a loss and they keep flying wide bodies to the oddest airports just to kill competition. The video even mentions Qatar flying an almost-empty wide body route to ATL, just to screw with Delta.

I guess it's the same with some Chinese airlines as well, but it is certainly a problem. Will be interesting to see if the new US administration will be backing up this campaign. My guess is that it will be, as the current situation is hurting US jobs.

Interesting also that the video mentiones Canada as the only country that has effectively fought against the expansion of ME3's, resulting in Air Canada being able to grow so significantly as it has. I know that some in here cry about the lack of ME3's at YVR, but when you really think about it, we might be much better off this way. The illusion of cheaper prices through ME3 airlines only seems to last until the competiotion has been killed off.

Any thoughts on the campaign? I hadn't really heard about it before, but it was printed on the in-flight magazine, so the US airlines are definitely promoting it big time.

[Canadian74]

US3 behaving like cry babies. Propoganda

Australia is doing fine, in fact their air travel market is larger than Canada despite a much smaller population. Actually almost every county is doing fine.

Emirates is profitable.

Big discussions at a.net

Daily Emirates at YYZ and YVR isn't going to hurt anyone