Tsawwassen First Nation Updates

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by VancouverOfTheFuture

i tried to find something about the YVR outlet mall but i couldn't find anything about annual visitors. but when it opened in July and by the end of 2015 they had hit 2 million visitors, so similar to the Mills mall. though it is important to note that the YVR Outlet Mall is only 240,000sq feet.

YVR Outlet Mall; first 6 months - 2 million

Cool thanks for the stats.

I have no doubt the YVR Outlet mall is doing well. The location and skytrain certainly help. They know their customer base is close by (Richmond & Vancouver West). It has little appeal to me personally, like Tsawwassen, but the business plan appears solid.

[VancouverOfTheFuture]

well here is some news.

Free Shuttle From Downtown Vancouver

Tsawwassen Mills will operate a coach bus providing twice daily return trips from Canada Place to the shopping centre, with a stop at River Rock Casino Resort next to the Canada Line’s Bridgeport Station.

...operate weekends only from April 29 to May 29 and daily from June 3 to September

[SpongeG]

I went down there today, around 6:30 pm. The mall was pretty dead, most of the stores had 0 customers. The new miniso is quite nice, they seemed to be giving a tour to some people, perhaps staff who will work at the next store. It was really quiet. Not too many shoppers anywhere, but it was a weeknight and a monday. The only space that had a coming soon sign was for a Spencers set to open in june.

Maybe I missed them last time but there was a number of kiosk stores that really interupt the flow. ugh.

The commons next door was really dead.The homesense had about 5 cars parked out front. And I didn't see any people walking or anything in the area.

I snapped a pic of the walmart, one would expect it to be busy but the parking lot was quite empty. Lougheed walmart at 10 pm is a lot busier. There wasn't even 30 cars there.

2017-05-29_10-09-28 by snub_you, on Flickr

[flipper316]

Originally Posted by SpongeG

I went down there today, around 6:30 pm. The mall was pretty dead, most of the stores had 0 customers. The new miniso is quite nice, they seemed to be giving a tour to some people, perhaps staff who will work at the next store. It was really quiet. Not too many shoppers anywhere, but it was a weeknight and a monday. The only space that had a coming soon sign was for a Spencers set to open in june.

Maybe I missed them last time but there was a number of kiosk stores that really interupt the flow. ugh.

The commons next door was really dead.The homesense had about 5 cars parked out front. And I didn't see any people walking or anything in the area.

I snapped a pic of the walmart, one would expect it to be busy but the parking lot was quite empty. Lougheed walmart at 10 pm is a lot busier. There wasn't even 30 cars there.

2017-05-29_10-09-28 by snub_you, on Flickr

What you expect, it's in the middle of nowhere. I haven't even made it out there and I live in Surrey.

[officedweller]

Ontario pension plan bets big on Tsawwassen shipping container distribution centre
https://www.biv.com/article/2017/6/ontario-pension-plan-bets-tsawwassen-shipping-cont/



HOOPP’s Delta iPort development on Tsawwassen First Nation’s land adjacent to the Port of Vancouver’s Deltaport is five kilometres from the South Fraser Perimeter Road | Submitted
https://www.biv.com/article/2017/6/ontario-pension-plan-bets-tsawwassen-shipping-cont/

[Sheba]

Add container shipping to the Tsawwassen First Nation’s inventory of businesses.

The first phase of the its three-phase Delta iPort container logistics centre is being built on a 57-acre portion of a 300-acre Tsawwassen First Nation industrial development site adjacent to the Port of Vancouver’s Deltaport.

The $130 million development spearheaded by TFN Economic Development Corp. (TFNEDC), the band’s land development arm, is aimed at expanding containerized cargo distribution capacity in a region where industrial land suitable for goods movement and other Asia Pacific Gateway trade activities is increasingly constrained.

...

https://www.biv.com/article/2017/6/ontario-pension-plan-bets-tsawwassen-shipping-cont/

[SpongeG]

Never been but its always looked kinda boring and doesn't really offer much water park fun

Tsawwassen's freshly renovated Big Splash Water Slide Park will open on June 12
by Lucy Lau on June 7th, 2017 at 3:29 PM





Tsawwassen’s revamped Big Splash Water Slide Park will open for its first season this Monday (June 12).

Formerly known as Splashdown Waterpark, the seven-acre site was acquired by Executive Hotels and Resorts last year. It was renovated and rebranded by the company after Splashdown announced it was closing in May.

The outdoor water park has been overhauled with an updated layout, new landscaping, and refinished slides, pools, and hot tubs. Rides include the Double Trouble, Kamikaze, and Solar Splash, where guests can venture through a “black hole” on a tube. In total, there are six body slides and two tube slides, plus a kids’ zone for tots.

Among the new features are a large, adult-only hot tub with a DJ, private viewing decks, and Las Vegas–style VIP areas. Guests may also rent umbrellas and furniture for sun-bathing or picnics. Cabanas are available for private parties.

Food-and-drink offerings include Big Splash Grill, which will serve burgers, hot dogs, pizzas, shawarma, and more; BV’s Sports Bar and Grill, where you’ll find a selection of margaritas, sangria, and B.C. wine; and the Candy Café & Gift Shop, which will sell ice cream, gelato, and grab-and-go options like salads and fruit plates.

No outside food is allowed on the premises, though catering packages (from $25 a person) are available for large parties.

...

http://www.straight.com/life/921341/tsaw...plash-water-slide-park-will-open-june-12

[retro_orange]

It would be great if they added roller coasters and other rides, we really need a proper theme park like Canada's Wonderland in Toronto. The PNE doesn't cut it.

I haven't been to the area since I was a kid, is there space to expand?

[SpongeG]

there is enough space to add a hotel, i am sure they could expand the waterpark

even just add something like this

[Cypherus]

^Looks great. Definitely not like the waterparks in California or Orlando, but it will do...

Originally Posted by retro_orange

It would be great if they added roller coasters and other rides, we really need a proper theme park like Canada's Wonderland in Toronto. The PNE doesn't cut it.

I haven't been to the area since I was a kid, is there space to expand?

I don't want to go offtopic but this will be a one off: Playland is expanding in phases up to 2022 and the City of Vancouver has already approved additional funding to support the expansion. Additional attractions including a launch rollercoaster as indicated in the visionary plan are expected.

[SpongeG]

a bridge over playland looks interesting

[connect2source]

Originally Posted by SpongeG

I went down there today, around 6:30 pm. The mall was pretty dead, most of the stores had 0 customers. The new miniso is quite nice, they seemed to be giving a tour to some people, perhaps staff who will work at the next store. It was really quiet. Not too many shoppers anywhere, but it was a weeknight and a monday. The only space that had a coming soon sign was for a Spencers set to open in june.

Maybe I missed them last time but there was a number of kiosk stores that really interupt the flow. ugh.

The commons next door was really dead.The homesense had about 5 cars parked out front. And I didn't see any people walking or anything in the area.

I snapped a pic of the walmart, one would expect it to be busy but the parking lot was quite empty. Lougheed walmart at 10 pm is a lot busier. There wasn't even 30 cars there.

2017-05-29_10-09-28 by snub_you, on Flickr

Stopped there Tuesday, midday on the way to see clients. First a quick trip through the Mills, totally empty, no one in food court, bought a couple of items at the Nike Outlet and was the only customer in there. Then over to Rona, in the Commons. One of three cars parked in front of Rona, I don't think there were more than 2-3 customers in the entire store. Now I know the Commons are new but I've never seen anything like this at a huge new retail complex.

[BodomReaper]

Originally Posted by connect2source

Stopped there Tuesday, midday on the way to see clients. First a quick trip through the Mills, totally empty, no one in food court, bought a couple of items at the Nike Outlet and was the only customer in there. Then over to Rona, in the Commons. One of three cars parked in front of Rona, I don't think there were more than 2-3 customers in the entire store. Now I know the Commons are new but I've never seen anything like this at a huge new retail complex.

How does something like this happen? Wouldn't highly paid consultants or professionals have been brought-in specifically to do a proper analysis and make sure the project would be successful?

[retro_orange]

Are there any future planned residential developments in the area that they are anticipating being built?

[Sheba]

Originally Posted by retro_orange

Are there any future planned residential developments in the area that they are anticipating being built?

Plus the water park

Originally Posted by hankthetank

Clearly you aren't familiar with Tsawwassen First Nation. As a starting point you might find it helpful to look at their neighbourhood plan. They've already began build out of some residential and much more is in the works. Single family, townhouses, apartment buildings and even a hotel are all underway. A nice pedestrian and cycling network will connect the residential to commercial areas. It's going to be a walkable complete community. Sure the mall could be improved but the area is a big improvement on some other suburbs.

[flipper316]

lol at "walkable community" it's 2 giant big box store themed malls with acres of parking. doesn't exactly scream walkable community. kind of hoping this place does go under. expensive to live in metro Vancouver, then we'll have mobility pricing so maybe that'll be the nail in the coffin for this place.

[SpongeG]

there are a bunch of houses being built next to/across the street from the mall and the commons. Are they lease holds since its on reserve land? or will people outright own the land and house?

also looking at the pics of the waterpark, they must be old cause the grounds look awful, weeds, dirt, lawn, crapass bench, what an embarrassment.

[GMasterAres]

To answer a few questions:

1. I believe they are all leaseholds aka 99 year leases
2. There are upwards of 5000+ housing units being built in the area not including the Delta side aka Tsawwassen Springs and surrounding
3. Tsawwassen is envisioned to grow by 20,000 + people over the next 15 years based on Metro Vancouver's plan, though if they happens would be a different story
4. It is likely some of the business plan assumed a new bridge over to Richmond

So will it work in the long run? Unsure. The land is likely super cheap so cost for having a retail location in TM or TC is likely less than anywhere else in Metro Vancouver, but the question comes down to can the low cost outset the low foot traffic.

I have gone to TM several times during lunch and it isn't empty. It isn't full or what I would deem "busy" by any means, but there is a comfortable amount of people in the mall. The size of the mall makes it seem more empty than it actually is, but by no means does it have a large chunk of traffic. I've also been to Metrotown around 10-11am on a weekday and in many parts you could fire a cannon and hit nobody, and that's one of the busiest malls in the region statistics wise. They all go through slow times, but TM is definitely not leading in any category of "busy."

I think viability will come down to cost vs traffic because so far traffic seems to be on-par with several other malls in the region that are much much smaller which to me then accounts for less overall traffic per store. So the question is does the lower cost counteract that lower foot traffic per store in TM or TC.

Only time will tell and if the area builds up and a bridge gets built, it will likely see increasing demand over the next decade (if it survives that long). If neither happens, it will likely see decreasing demand and go bust.

The big joker thrown into the deck though is the overall reduction in retail demand globally which is likely to affect all malls not just this one as people shift toward online shopping. Heck I just look at my mom recently shopping for a car. She spent a week poking around web sites looking at models, researching, etc., then made a list of 3 cars she was interested in. She then drove to the dealerships around her just to look for those 3 cars. The majority of her "shopping" though was online, for a car. I think in the coming decades you'll see even retail like car dealerships start to stock less vehicles and do more online build-to-order sales. The retail landscape is definitely shifting for standard commodity based products.

[flipper316]

http://vancouversun.com/storyline/retail...game-changer-for-tsawwassen-first-nation
Love how in the article they pretty much admit that it's slow there.

[cornholio]

Originally Posted by jhausner

The big joker thrown into the deck though is the overall reduction in retail demand globally which is likely to affect all malls not just this one as people shift toward online shopping. Heck I just look at my mom recently shopping for a car. She spent a week poking around web sites looking at models, researching, etc., then made a list of 3 cars she was interested in. She then drove to the dealerships around her just to look for those 3 cars. The majority of her "shopping" though was online, for a car. I think in the coming decades you'll see even retail like car dealerships start to stock less vehicles and do more online build-to-order sales. The retail landscape is definitely shifting for standard commodity based products.

When I was there I thought the mall was great. Much better to drive out there from South Vancouver then to drive into Vancouver/Burnaby if you shop once a year.

But you make a absolute valid point about online shopping. Traditional retail over the next decade or two will get destroyed imo. I do almost all my shopping except clothes, furniture and sometimes food now online. I would never go to a store for example to shop for electronics, its frustrating now. Much simpler to find what I need and order it so that it comes in a couple hours to either my office or my home. As for clothes I see my self doing more of that sort of shopping online as well with time due to convenience. Food is super easy to do online and I actually don't know why I still go to super markets, that will change. Furniture as well but its just so damn rare to need to buy something, as in almost never. Traditional retail will die and become just a niche, and we will all be better for it.

I do wonder what will happen to these malls and many stores and what not. For example Best Buy will definitely go bankrupt probably within the next decade, maybe much sooner. That's one example. They have set their course and looking at their model they can no longer reverse it. So many more traditional retail franchises will go bust that people would not have imagined being a possibility. Restaurants for now seem to be safe as a group, McDonalds for example I think is amazing what they have done with their business (and I say this as someone that doesn't like fast food, beyond the coffee and occasional value burger).

Back on topic though, with online shopping and the certain death of most traditional retail it would seem that this mall will face serious existential problems in the future. Once a few stores begin to fold it will impact the remaining ones and create a gradual chain reaction at some point.