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  #621  
Old Posted Jun 14, 2017, 8:45 PM
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The Domain is a mess, 3-4 separate areas that do not connect, traffic is horrible. I use to go a wander around but now its just to time consuming to get in and out. I guess it is more for those who live there or who stay there in hotels, not for the outside visitor who may want to shop for something.
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  #622  
Old Posted Jun 14, 2017, 9:08 PM
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Originally Posted by ivanwolf View Post
The Domain is a mess, 3-4 separate areas that do not connect, traffic is horrible. I use to go a wander around but now its just to time consuming to get in and out. I guess it is more for those who live there or who stay there in hotels, not for the outside visitor who may want to shop for something.
I think once you're inside and on-foot, it's very pleasant. However, as you mentioned, it's done a disastrous job of creating connections to the rest of the area.
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  #623  
Old Posted Jun 14, 2017, 10:10 PM
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I think once you're inside and on-foot, it's very pleasant. However, as you mentioned, it's done a disastrous job of creating connections to the rest of the area.
I agree with this completely, and honestly don't have a lot of hope for further connectivity -- even though there's plenty more development on the way.

Burnet is still a major N/S arterial, and no matter what happens in the IBM parking lot, or back where the new Schwab offices are, it's not going to shrink in importance. So walking from, say, the Kramer station is always going to feel a bit like you're playing Frogger. Same when trying to cross Braker. It also doesn't help that the Pickle Research area seems like a mini military base, isolated and shut off from pretty much everything that's happening around it.

I like the Domain well enough, and think that it's helped broaden our idea of what's possible in between downtown and the suburbs, but agree that its fundamental aesthetic is inward looking, and in that way kind of flubbed the whole urbanist thing. It's an open question whether true urbanism is even achievable in that area, but . . . I'll leave that one to Novacek to argue.
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  #624  
Old Posted Jun 14, 2017, 11:49 PM
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Speaking of the Pickle Research Campus, I could see UT lease out some of the unused/underutilized land @ Pickle if the price is right in the future as well. I used to work at the PRC for a number of years, including the time that the Domain started, and it feels like UT has had less and less activity at the PRC. The only major capex I've seen them do recently is the new supercomputing center/cooler for TACC. Otherwise, they've moved a lot of stuff back to the 40 acres after various buildings were redeveloped there.

They've leased out parcels of the old MACC/East Braker Pickle tract and the Arbour Walk area before that. It feels like the University is focused on consolidating on the main campus and the area immediately surrounding it (west/east campus) as the city grows.
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  #625  
Old Posted Jun 15, 2017, 6:34 AM
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Speaking of the Pickle Research Campus, I could see UT lease out some of the unused/underutilized land @ Pickle.
This will not happen unless they decommission the entire campus. The research that goes on there involves biological and chemical compounds that could be catastrophic if something goes wrong and thus they need the land around the buildings to act as a geographic buffer.
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  #626  
Old Posted Jun 15, 2017, 3:09 PM
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Originally Posted by We vs us View Post
I'll leave that one to Novacek to argue.
Gladly


I'll definitely recognize shortcomings in the Domain (whoever decided that _6_ lanes meeting 4 lanes could use a stop sign should be shot).

But I guess I'm just more hopeful long term than many others here (both for the Domain per se and the surrounding area). I think a lot of factors will continue to improve the situation. Or at least have the potential to.


1. The long term plan for Burnet proposes dedicated transit lanes. This has the potential to move more people in/out without adding to all the traffic within the development. It didn't all get funded in the last bond (so those probably won't happen soon), but at least some did.

2. The surrounding area is continuing to densify (apartments east of burnet) which starts placing more people in walking/biking distance.

3. The long term plan for NBG shows improved connectivity within the Domain development (closer to a grid). Hopefully that still happens.

4. The Broadmoor development(IBM campus) across Burnet from the domain shows _huge_ potential (if it happens). Potentially even taller and denser than the domain, and possibly even direct rail access (with a new red line station). Dense development there is synergistic (people living in the domain can bike/walk across, and vice versa).

5. Bicycle access to the Domain (and the surrounding area) continues to get better. The mopac path just went in, which connects to north walnut creek, which will connect to Amherst soon. The red line trail south from there (part way) is one of the proposed/funded projects from the bond.

I would be even more positive if Lone Star Rail hadn't gotten killed, but c'est la vie.


Edit: I almost forget. I mentioned this before, but the potential for a Capmetro circulator in the Domain/the area. If it happens and if it actually goes into the domain.
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  #627  
Old Posted Jun 15, 2017, 3:09 PM
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  #628  
Old Posted Jun 15, 2017, 3:10 PM
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Originally Posted by wwmiv View Post
This will not happen unless they decommission the entire campus. The research that goes on there involves biological and chemical compounds that could be catastrophic if something goes wrong and thus they need the land around the buildings to act as a geographic buffer.
Plus the research reactor

I'm not a nuclear=scary guy, but the fences and everything are in-part for security.
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  #629  
Old Posted Jun 15, 2017, 3:33 PM
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Originally Posted by wwmiv View Post
This will not happen unless they decommission the entire campus. The research that goes on there involves biological and chemical compounds that could be catastrophic if something goes wrong and thus they need the land around the buildings to act as a geographic buffer.
No kidding.

https://nuclear.engr.utexas.edu/netl/triga-reactor
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  #630  
Old Posted Jun 15, 2017, 3:39 PM
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Here's another Domain office building that was sent around as an email from Endeavor, but isn't listed on their website yet.



Edited to add: This is where it's located, per the original concept from Endeavor:

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  #631  
Old Posted Jun 15, 2017, 3:40 PM
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Excited for Sway to open!
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  #632  
Old Posted Jun 15, 2017, 8:55 PM
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Here's another Domain office building that was sent around as an email from Endeavor, but isn't listed on their website yet.



Edited to add: This is where it's located, per the original concept from Endeavor:

This has gotten bigger by 60k sq. ft. and a few floors. Increased density!
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  #633  
Old Posted Jun 15, 2017, 11:12 PM
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Domain 11 has 14 foot slab-to-slab heights with a stated roof height of 235 feet with 15 floors. Dividing the height by the floors you get 15.6666666667 feet. So that should put Domain 9 around 204 feet. That's going to be four 200 footers pretty close together. Throw in Domain Tower at 181 feet, Domain 8 at 167 feet, plus the Archer Hotel and Maravilla at the Domain and the dozen or so nearby high rises outside of the Domain and there's a decent skyline starting to take shape up there.

Domain 12 - ~266 feet - 17 floors - Proposed
Domain 11 - 235 feet - 15 floors - Proposed
Domain 10 - ~219 feet - ~14 floors - Proposed
Domain 9 - ~204 feet - 13 floors - Proposed
Domain Tower - 181 feet - 11 floors - U/C - 2018
Domain 8 - 167 feet - 11 floors - U/C - 2017
Renaissance Austin Hotel - 145 feet - 10 floors - 1985
Stonebridge Plaza Two - 142 feet - 9 floors - 2001
National Instruments Headquarters I - 141 feet - 8 floors - 2002
Stonebridge Plaza One - 138 feet - 9 floors - 1999
Braker Pointe III - 135 feet - 7 floors - 2002
Maravilla at the Domain - 133 feet - 11 floors - Proposed
Arboretum Plaza I - 132 feet - 9 floors - 1984
Arboretum Plaza D - 131 feet - 10 floors - 1985
IBM Austin Executive Briefing Center Building 901 - 129 feet - 7 floors - 1991
IBM Austin Executive Briefing Center Building 903 - 129 feet - 7 floors - 1991
IBM Austin Executive Briefing Center Building 905 - 129 feet - 7 floors - 1991
Austin Archer Hotel at the Domain - 121 feet - 2016

18 buildings over 120 feet. By comparison, West Campus has only 11 buildings over 120 feet. The UT Campus has 22 buildings over 120 feet.
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  #634  
Old Posted Jun 15, 2017, 11:58 PM
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Originally Posted by KevinFromTexas View Post
Domain 11 has 14 foot slab-to-slab heights with a stated roof height of 235 feet with 15 floors. Dividing the height by the floors you get 15.6666666667 feet. So that should put Domain 9 around 204 feet. That's going to be four 200 footers pretty close together. Throw in Domain Tower at 181 feet, Domain 8 at 167 feet, plus the Archer Hotel and Maravilla at the Domain and the dozen or so nearby high rises outside of the Domain and there's a decent skyline starting to take shape up there.

Domain 12 - ~266 feet - 17 floors - Proposed
Domain 11 - 235 feet - 15 floors - Proposed
Domain 10 - ~219 feet - ~14 floors - Proposed
Domain 9 - ~204 feet - 13 floors - Proposed
Domain Tower - 181 feet - 11 floors - U/C - 2018
Domain 8 - 167 feet - 11 floors - U/C - 2017
Renaissance Austin Hotel - 145 feet - 10 floors - 1985
Stonebridge Plaza Two - 142 feet - 9 floors - 2001
National Instruments Headquarters I - 141 feet - 8 floors - 2002
Stonebridge Plaza One - 138 feet - 9 floors - 1999
Braker Pointe III - 135 feet - 7 floors - 2002
Maravilla at the Domain - 133 feet - 11 floors - Proposed
Arboretum Plaza I - 132 feet - 9 floors - 1984
Arboretum Plaza D - 131 feet - 10 floors - 1985
IBM Austin Executive Briefing Center Building 901 - 129 feet - 7 floors - 1991
IBM Austin Executive Briefing Center Building 903 - 129 feet - 7 floors - 1991
IBM Austin Executive Briefing Center Building 905 - 129 feet - 7 floors - 1991
Austin Archer Hotel at the Domain - 121 feet - 2016

18 buildings over 120 feet. By comparison, West Campus has only 11 buildings over 120 feet. The UT Campus has 22 buildings over 120 feet.
Personally, I'd divide these into two separate lists:

The first set actually functions as a visual cluster of towers:

Domain 12 - ~266 feet - 17 floors - Proposed
Domain 11 - 235 feet - 15 floors - Proposed
Domain 10 - ~219 feet - ~14 floors - Proposed
Domain 9 - ~204 feet - 13 floors - Proposed
Domain Tower - 181 feet - 11 floors - U/C - 2018
Domain 8 - 167 feet - 11 floors - U/C - 2017
Maravilla at the Domain - 133 feet - 11 floors - Proposed
IBM Austin Executive Briefing Center Building 901 - 129 feet - 7 floors - 1991
IBM Austin Executive Briefing Center Building 903 - 129 feet - 7 floors - 1991
IBM Austin Executive Briefing Center Building 905 - 129 feet - 7 floors - 1991
Austin Archer Hotel at the Domain - 121 feet - 2016

Whereas the towers on the second list are outlying miscellaneous towers that are visually disconnected from the rest:

Renaissance Austin Hotel - 145 feet - 10 floors - 1985
Stonebridge Plaza Two - 142 feet - 9 floors - 2001
Stonebridge Plaza One - 138 feet - 9 floors - 1999
Arboretum Plaza I - 132 feet - 9 floors - 1984
Arboretum Plaza D - 131 feet - 10 floors - 1985

These two towers could honestly be placed on either list, depending upon our own individual definitions of a "cluster" of towers. For me, I'd place them in the main cluster of towers (the 1st list):

National Instruments Headquarters I - 141 feet - 8 floors - 2002
Braker Pointe III - 135 feet - 7 floors - 2002

Speaking of Braker Pointe, this is an interesting property to me with just as much potential as the IBM/Brandywine campus yet is so much less likely to see redevelopment until we have commuter rail in that corridor precisely because it is geographically isolated from the Domain by the rail tracks. Once commuter rail exists on the corridor (I see this as inevitable and only a matter of time), a station platform would allow for pedestrian traffic crossing the rail line into the Domain.

Last edited by wwmiv; Jun 16, 2017 at 12:22 AM.
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  #635  
Old Posted Jun 16, 2017, 12:03 AM
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Yeah, they aren't really part of the same skyline. Actually, none of those except the newest ones in the Domain are actually tall enough to crack the horizon. I've been able to see Domain 8 from the South Austin Hospital garage some ~11 miles away along with the Arboretum buildings and the two Stonebridge Plaza buildings, but not much else from that area. They would pretty much need to be double those heights to really show up and create a skyline. San Antonio's medical center sort of comes to mind.
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  #636  
Old Posted Jun 16, 2017, 1:28 AM
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As to the question of whether or not the Domain is truly going to be an urban center (as opposed to a "flubbed...urbanist thing" as We vs Us so aptly put it) I think the area is still salvageable. I think it's just going to take a lot of intentionality moving forward. If the developments continue to be built with an inward focus rather than seeing how they can connect more broadly to the greater neighborhood, I'd agree that it won't happen.

I have a question for you folks who understand the city codes and plans moving forward...perhaps Novacek or someone else can enlighten me and others. Is there any sort of plan to create more of a true grid in the future? For instance, there are so many random streets that lack any sense of planning or foresight, which leads to some of the disconnected feeling, in my opinion. Also, as the area develops, I'd have to wonder if some of the simple, one-story buildings will be replaced in the future. I've always been curious as to whether or not a true "second downtown" in the urban sense could/would ever be achievable in this area, but those are some barriers I see to that happening. Thoughts?
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  #637  
Old Posted Jun 16, 2017, 1:42 AM
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Originally Posted by Novacek View Post
I'll definitely recognize shortcomings in the Domain
There are SO many, but much of the shortcomings require state or city action:

(1) Alterra Pkwy should be extended across MoPac.
(2) Domain Blvd should be extended across MoPac and connected to the Nat'l Instruments campus entrance.
(3) The service roads should be given grade separated rail crossings.
(4) Palm Way should be extended across MoPac.
(5) Esperanza Crossing should be extended across MoPac and given a signalized intersection there.
(6) Amy Donovan Plaza/Feathergrass Court should be turned into an actual road paralleling the tracks from MoPac/Esperanza crossing and ending at a signalized intersection with Braker.
(7) All/most of the stop signs internally should be changed to signalized intersections.
(8) The parking garage that the Kramer extension dead ends at should be demoed and Kramer should be extended to a signalized intersection with Amy Donovan, thru a grade separated rail crossing, and across MoPac thru the Braker Pointe property continuing on to the Stonelake/Balcones Center intersection.

Essentially, the problem with the Domain is not the size or scale of the roads, but the lack of viable access points ensuring a disadvantageous distribution of traffic. I.E. The current road plan creates bottleneck points that are overloaded by the demand. If we want this area to truly be a second downtown, then you need to create greater access.

In downtown Austin, there are 9 cross streets with I-35 that allow ingress into and egress from downtown: MLK, 15th, 12th, 11th, 8th, 7th, 6th, Cesar Chavez, and River/Holly. There's also a pair of turnarounds at 4th. I-35 reconstruction may or may not add additional connections, depending upon the final design. 5th, for instance, is something that city leaders have pushed TXDOT to consider.

In the Domain, there are 2: Braker and Burnet/Duval, with a set of turnarounds at the rail tracks. This isn't adequate at all.

Adding these crossings above would increase that to 7ish: Duval/Burnet, Alterra, Domain, Palm, Esperanza Xing/Amy Donovan (which renders the existing turnarounds gone, but oh well -- this intersection would ideally be modeled after the 51st/Cameron/I-35 intersection redesign), Kramer, and Braker.

The ONLY 2 currently planned added connectivity to MoPac are:

(1) extending Longhorn over MoPac to connect with York. That's smart, as Longhorn is also going to be connected to Rundberg. That'll provide an entirely new major E-W thoroughfare through North Austin, from Dessau to Stonelake.

(2) Connecting Rutland over MoPac to 360. This one is much less likely to happen, given that it requires cutting through the Pickle Campus, which isn't going to happen in the foreseeable future. But if they're seriously considering that, then why haven't they also considered a N-W arterial thru the campus by connecting Neils Thompson/Creativity to Feathergrass/Amy Donovan? And why not connect this southward underneath 183 where the access roads loop around around by the rail tracks and then via the empty strip of land to Shoal Creek?

Note that this added connectivity isn't in the (currently) right place to make a major difference for local traffic, though.

Quote:
Originally Posted by drummer View Post
I have a question for you folks who understand the city codes and plans moving forward...perhaps Novacek or someone else can enlighten me and others. Is there any sort of plan to create more of a true grid in the future? For instance, there are so many random streets that lack any sense of planning or foresight, which leads to some of the disconnected feeling, in my opinion.
The current roadway plan focuses on connecting the area to adjacent neighborhoods via Metric and adding roadways throughout the area to create an irregular grid with a good number of superblocks. Unfortunately, the current plan does not add any connectivity to the primary thru-way (MoPac), which is the primary connectivity problem.

ftp://ftp.ci.austin.tx.us/npzd/Austi...g_reg_plan.pdf

See page 10 of the .pdf, Figure 1-3.

Note that they are also leaving a fair amount of obvious cards on the table w/r/t new roadways. The diagonal strip of abandoned rail ROW from the Braker/Burnet intersection heading southeast toward the Red Line, for instance, should be coopted as a roadway. Metric should be realigned behind the Goodwill and connected underneath 183 adjacent to the Red Line with a signalized intersection. Waterford should be given a grade separate rail crossing and connected to Metric. Why not connect Industrial to Tudor underneath MoPac (this would require some more intricate engineering to accomplish, though).

Last edited by wwmiv; Jun 16, 2017 at 2:26 AM.
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  #638  
Old Posted Jun 16, 2017, 1:45 AM
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Last edited by wwmiv; Jun 16, 2017 at 1:55 AM.
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  #639  
Old Posted Jun 16, 2017, 1:36 PM
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Originally Posted by wwmiv View Post
But if they're seriously considering that, then why haven't they also considered a N-W arterial thru the campus by connecting Neils Thompson/Creativity to Feathergrass/Amy Donovan? And why not connect this southward underneath 183 where the access roads loop around around by the rail tracks and then via the empty strip of land to Shoal Creek?
The short answer is that they are. Kinda.


Long answer: I'm not a completely "anti-car, cars of evil urbanist", but part of my answer is to caution against conflating connectivity with single-occupancy-vehicle connectivity.

The connection you describe is happening. Actively happening right now. As a bike/pedestrian connection.

Anything more than that would face several obstacles. And while anything is possible with a sufficient application of money, I imagine it's to the point of improbability where it's not worth considering at this point. And nothing says it can't be changed if the conditions change, they keep updating this document.


1) All of this added connectivity (like the rest of the NBG plan) is made easier by the fact that there's no existing residential. There's no entrenched NIMBY force. Even in the spots where they're adding connectivity that eventually reaches Metric, Metric is then buffered (in most spots) from neighborhoods by further industrial.

If you attempt to connect south to Shoal Creek, I'm guessing that will start to awaken NIMBYs the don't want any further traffic on Shoal creek.

2. There's the actual engineering of the connection to Shoal Creek. It's a very tight fit between the turnaround (which probably needs to stay for TxDot, and it's only a single lane anyway) and the UP line. Moving the turnaround further in starts to run into the support for the lanes of 183. Again, not to say it couldn't be done, heck you could tunnel right through, but $




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Originally Posted by wwmiv View Post
Metric should be realigned behind the Goodwill and connected underneath 183 adjacent to the Red Line with a signalized intersection.
Personally I'd be all for this. Though not on this map (and probably not fully specified) I know the Wooten neighborhood plan calls for additional roads/connectivity through that commercial area under 183 and to the neighborhood.

In this case(and unlike above), it looks like there's a good bit of space by the turnaround, on either side of the 183 supports.


There's a slight complication of the fire station and substation there(which is sort of where you want to run the roadway if I'm understanding correctly). Rather than behind goodwill, it might be easier to take out the goodwill entirely.
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  #640  
Old Posted Jun 23, 2017, 12:33 AM
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Home Away will be expanding into Domain 11 and increase their workforce by 2K.

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